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Old 5th February 2014, 13:45   #16
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

I was very excited when i saw RFC is taking place in India, but when i saw participation cost + stay + food, it was kind of off putting. But i still consoled myself thinking it as a once in a life time opportunity.
But when i added the cost of to and fro transportation (approx 1500 kms, taking into consideration of western ghats are close to me) + mechanic backup ( in such an international event, i cant fight alone and need mechanic backup) + vehicle preparation cost + allied miscellaneous cost, i decided to better skip this once in a life time opportunity
But i know few people who have been to last RFC and would be more than happy that they are getting opportunity to participate on their mother land, without going abroad, taking a vehicle on rent, coping up with law of land of other nation etc.
Best part is, India would be recognised as a Country who promote such events and we passionate people will be able to witness this event (May be as a support staff etc..)
TPC has created its own niche over last few years and i dont think it would affect participation level in TPC. Even i am looking forward to witness TPC for the first time in my life this year

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Old 6th February 2014, 19:27   #17
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Hi guys,

I contacted Cougar Motorsports for the vehicle specification sheet and other rules and regulations and they were kind enough to mail it to me.

After I went through it, I had a telephonic conversation with Mr. Ashish Gupta who runs Cougar and I suggested that they need to encourage the local off-roaders and have an Indian category since we still don't have access to stuff like Simex tyres, etc. He was very patient and has promised to look into an Indian category and will talk to the RFC team.

Latest gossip (strictly hearsay / rumour) tells me that there will be a possibility of an Indian vehicle category to be added.

I'm happy that they listen to feedback and try to implement it. Keeping fingers crossed.

All the best to the organisers and participants.
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Old 7th February 2014, 17:59   #18
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
*Updated the opening post with more information from the press invite*

This is taking offroading to an entirely different level in India! Expect to see a lot of folk start preparing their rides already. Serious stuff, am sure we're going to see familiar names from the forum participating.

An existing thread on the Sri Lankan event with pics etc. - Link (Taprobana 4x4 Challenge 2012 (Rain Forest Challenge’ Srilanka))
I was as excited to hear about this event and even so more when i heard that it was @ 70k odd for 10 days. Of course i was corrected that it was only the participation fees that i was looking at. Totalled to almost 5L including service vehicle etc etc i think thats a tall price to pay so as said earlier maybe those with deep pockets will be able to participate coz though id love to participate, i dont think i will when the cost of having fun is so high. Then i did some digging into the organizers and i was told (please correct me if im wrong) he/they has no experience of offroading so im thinking is this purely a profit based event? secondly what comes into my typically skeptical Indian mind is what about the permissions and the scale. For a 10 day event (say 6-7 days out of that for the event) is 40 acres enough space? dont get me wrong guys im the first one to get excited for the RFC but if this is not a passion driven event then im sorry im taking a back seat.

Now coming to Tejas's mention of an Indian class, that seems like a glimmer of hope and i think they should and most probably will take heed to that advice keeping in mind the purely passion driven offroaders we have in India...well, at least on TBHP!!

So im excited but have my antennae up!!! Sincerely hope this gives the much needed impetus to this wonderful sport here...finally!!

BTW, thanks Tejas for having a word with the guys at RFC India and getting their minds thinking about the Indian Class! I wish they would also have a purely participation based class which could be non competitive for those, who are not competition driven but being in love with the sport, want to just enjoy the sport!!
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Old 7th February 2014, 19:02   #19
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

Rules & regulations for India edition 2014.

http://www.rfcindia.in/assets/RFC_In...tions_2014.pdf

Spidey is already disqualified
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Old 7th February 2014, 19:15   #20
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Just received a text message from Mr. Ashish Gupta.

Overall Indian ranking has been given a separate category.

Check screenshot. (Highlighted part)

The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa-image.jpg

Since I'm taking offers, any other wish Gogi?
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Old 7th February 2014, 19:23   #21
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

I doubt the feasibility of an Indian class for the following reasons
  • Would there be separate rules & specifications for Indian class? Not an easy job, without dilution of the RFC brand
  • Would there be separate trail/track for Indian class? Would impact the schedule & logistics
  • Cost? Different costs for Indian class?

I also believe that it will NOT be easy for foreign teams to get in their vehicles/support structures (or take out for that matter), courtesy the great Indian bureaucracy. Remember they made life hell for F-1 teams, so RFC is child's play for them to create havoc.

Another question: To run an event of this scale, how to they intend to organize it from an off-road perspective -- considering that the body entrusted to run this is little thin on hardcore 4x4/off-road. Will they be getting marshals/volunteers from Malaysia?

Looking at the vehicle spec list, looks like tall order and needs full time commitment -- apart from deep pockets, from now on if someone is planning to take part.

Let's see how this pans out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by V-16 View Post
.... I wish they would also have a purely participation based class which could be non competitive for those, who are not competition driven but being in love with the sport, want to just enjoy the sport!!
@Gogi: They do mention a non-competitive "Touring Adventurers" type entry for ~28k for 2 pax in a 4x4 vehicle.


EDIT: @Tejas: Just saw your post. It's not a separate class but just ranking from Indian entries. Not sure how that helps.

Last edited by khan_sultan : 7th February 2014 at 19:27.
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Old 7th February 2014, 20:02   #22
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

I totally agree with you Khan and share your sentiments.

I assume that like the standard chartered marathon they will rank the indian and international entries separately but on the same track.

I'm lecturing in HYD currently and have a dodgy internet connection. I have found a few grey areas in the rules sheet and will go through it in detail and raise those points later.

My interest in the RFC is to see how the RFC guys design the obstacles. I want to see how the international teams come prepared. I have had a long chat with my Croatia trophy friend about his experience and the first thing he tells me is that the co driver has to be fit and in supreme condition since he will be doing most of the back breaking work. That rules me out

Anyways, in the interest of the sport i do hope it works out and let's see how the first year pans out and then we can think of participation in the second round.

@Khan: during my telephonic talk with Mr. Ashish Gupta, i told him why would an indian participate without getting access to good offroad tyres and he knows the current scene in India. I said Indians would be left behind at the end of the lot if they are using the tyres available to us. He asked me what could be done and that's why i said having a separate winner from india could be helpful.

Now if an Indian manages to get hold of Simex, then what? Which category does he fall into? Lot of questions. I think RFC needs a representative here on teambhp to clarify a lot of doubts.
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Old 9th February 2014, 09:38   #23
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

Quote:
Originally Posted by Endeavour333 View Post
I don't think that there would be many drop outs from TPC because the cost to participate in RFC will be a barrier to entry. Participant entry fee alone is Rs. 84,000 per vehicle (2 pax.), plus boarding and lodging. Rough cost is attached below. TPC is only around 6000 per head but RFC is around 70,000 per head. A pretty expensive affair without sponsorship deals i'm afraid. I have also not mentioned the cost of preparing the vehicle but that will vary drastically from one to another.

Attachment 1201821
Costs have been taken as per www.rfcindia.in
The cost of participating in a RFC level event is not cheap. It is an event for the top runners in the Off roading scene in their respective countries. Typical RFC standard obstacles can not be contended with a standard production class vehicle with standard equipment. Especially the vehicle needs to Last 30 SS, plus a Twilight Zone transport where no 4x4's have gone before. This is the equal number of SS and the number of Days as the main event in Malaysia.

In Malaysia, most competitors are Workshop Owners. After RFC Malaysia 2008, I own a Malaysian Built Mongrel - Toyota Chassis, Supra Engine, Volvo Portal Axles and God's Winch. Which is cheaper to buy and has no paperwork. I use this every year, without regret and the vehicle is basically a chassis and roll cage and hardly any body, and hand painted. These vehicles get to event in a car carrier and returns the same way. So the cost is not only getting to the start line but also after the event is over.

Eventually the event will evolve into a Modified Truck challenge, and a battle between workshop teams. And I am sure there are enough workshops in India that can build 4x4 for this event, and rent the same on a contract.

This is the case now in RFC Sri Lanka. In 2009 Team India did this on a Land Cruiser 70 series. Last year Team India ran Gypsy with Toyota Drive Train complete with equipment and Extreme Trekker Tires.

It is unfair for me to comment on the entry fee of RFC India, as I am sure they have their costs, but for an opening event of a RFC series the cost is almost the same as renting a vehicle and running the main event in Malaysia.
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Old 9th February 2014, 10:16   #24
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl View Post
I totally agree with you Khan and share your sentiments.

I assume that like the standard chartered marathon they will rank the indian and international entries separately but on the same track.

I'm lecturing in HYD currently and have a dodgy internet connection. I have found a few grey areas in the rules sheet and will go through it in detail and raise those points later.

My interest in the RFC is to see how the RFC guys design the obstacles. I want to see how the international teams come prepared. I have had a long chat with my Croatia trophy friend about his experience and the first thing he tells me is that the co driver has to be fit and in supreme condition since he will be doing most of the back breaking work. That rules me out

Anyways, in the interest of the sport i do hope it works out and let's see how the first year pans out and then we can think of participation in the second round.

@Khan: during my telephonic talk with Mr. Ashish Gupta, i told him why would an indian participate without getting access to good offroad tyres and he knows the current scene in India. I said Indians would be left behind at the end of the lot if they are using the tyres available to us. He asked me what could be done and that's why i said having a separate winner from india could be helpful.

Now if an Indian manages to get hold of Simex, then what? Which category does he fall into? Lot of questions. I think RFC needs a representative here on teambhp to clarify a lot of doubts.
Khan Sir is spot on. I was the competition manager RFC 2012 Melaka, and the rules and regs were completely revamped and simplified to be understood by all nationalities. However, the English version stands as the final one. So in RFC Events the Teams who are proficient in English raise the issues, the others don't.

Realistically on the organizers side the rules and regs are primarily to protect the organizer. And it not practical to have rules that can not be enforced.

RFC India Rules and Regs is an Indian version of the original R&R V2013 with omissions and inclusions for the Indian competitor pool. This is a great forum to discuss these issues among the potential competitors and help the local organizers set a fair playing ground. If not every time an amendment is made it will open a can of worms.

This is a great event for India and for the 4x4 Industry, especially for the 4x4 vehicle manufacturers and the 4x4 after market in India.
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Old 10th February 2014, 15:28   #25
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

I personally feel RFC India will not be suitable for most of the offroaders due to 2 main reasons.

1) Entry cost too high + Its a difficult task to find a co-passenger who is technically sound, fit to do hard work and after all this who will to share the fees amount and not drive the vehicle.

2) Vehicle preparation is going to be the main reason for many people to drop out of this event. first of all due to our stupid laws you can modify your vehicle. RFC needs a vehicle which is built for purpose. As soon as you build something for RFC automatically RTO authority will reject it or impound it if you are caught driving it. Even if you own a vehicle you will need dual winch, rollcage, recaros with 4 point harness, MTs, Underbody protection, crawlers, diff lock plus some other mandatory mods. After all this i am sure your engine will die with added weight so you will need a better motor too.

All this will cost nothing less than 3-4 Lacs plus entry fees.

but I am sure if this year if they pull it well next year response will be crazy as people will have time and money to build there ride before hand.


If budget permits i would surely go for it.

Lets hope for the best as its going to promote the sport big time.
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Old 10th February 2014, 15:59   #26
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

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Originally Posted by pdev29 View Post
2) Vehicle preparation is going to be the main reason for many people to drop out of this event. first of all due to our stupid laws you can modify your vehicle. RFC needs a vehicle which is built for purpose. As soon as you build something for RFC automatically RTO authority will reject it or impound it if you are caught driving it.
If it is not street legal, you have to transport it via truck to the event and back. Can the RTO impound a vehicle if it not used on road? Many track vehicles are not street legal, but they are allowed in the track, are they not?
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Old 10th February 2014, 16:05   #27
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@ Samurai,

thats the point i am trying to make here, this is india and not everyone can keep a track vehicle due to many reasons. Other than RFC the same vehicle will be used for other OTR sessions too so it restricts an individual to go all out on modifications.

they should have a category for unrestricted vehicles and one for pro stock just like drags and revise the complete fees structure.
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Old 10th February 2014, 17:07   #28
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

I think we all need to get around the concept of an off-roader which can also be used on road. Atleast for serious stuff.

For all practical, purposes and also, due to the fact that off-road requirements and on-road requirements totally contradict each other.
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Old 11th February 2014, 12:53   #29
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

Alright then. A few friends reached out to us to help in their preparations. We reached out to our I4WDTA - The International 4-Wheel Drive Trainers Association LLC colleague and Croatia Trophy pro veteran Rob Mieras. Our dear friend has agreed to come down to India (at no consulting cost) and help and educate participants in the following topics and much more:
- vehicle preparations
- service teams and support
- role of the driver
- role of the co-driver
- using pto winches
- negative markings
- ground anchors
- competition driving techniques and trips
- when to abort and when to recover
- etc
This is a non-profit initiative of Offroad Junkie to promote Indian competitors participating in the Rainforest Challenge India. The training sessions will be theory and hands-on and the costing will depend on the number of participants that sign up (we've gotta take care of the travel and accommodation expenses and i've promised to show him the Taj Mahal ).
Please PM me if you are interested and once we get a decent enough number, we'll coordinate with Rob to get the dates and venues fixed.
All the best and as the RFC tagline goes, you're already winners!

Same post on the FB page has shown interest from 4 teams already. Once we have some numbers, we will work out the costing and venue.

We're looking to do this probably in mid to late March.


EDIT:

Here's Rob in his "Pink Panther" during the Croatia Trophy 2013:

Name:  401823_313944788736008_1504002195_n.jpg
Views: 2054
Size:  58.2 KB

Last edited by Tejas@perioimpl : 11th February 2014 at 13:02. Reason: see edit.
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Old 14th February 2014, 11:02   #30
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Default re: The 2014 Rain Forest Challenge @ Goa

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl View Post
The training sessions will be theory and hands-on and the costing will depend on the number of participants that sign up
Attachment 1207001
Hi,

Thanks! Its a good initiation, i have a small suggestion. The theory section will cover mostly of the topic and it can also be done on a Video conferencing or a Video that can be hosted in you tube and every one can view it.

Regards,
Mahendran.K
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