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Old 23rd December 2008, 13:01   #241
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Originally Posted by Red Liner View Post
Make that very lucky. Sometimes you make the stupidest mistakes, and its those that will haunt you badly. This one was a very very stupid mistake, and I had gripped the wheels hard (because of no seat belts + I was going fast + no doors to the jeep + completely open and the steering seemed the only form of security I had from spilling out). All this inspite of knowing very well of the consequences. Reflexes take over the in the most horrible situations. Thats when the mind needs to take control. An OTR is all about the mind.

Just to give you an idea...see my right hand and the thumb sticking out
Red Liner a.k.a. Venkat,

Please observe the photograph carefully. The actual mistake was not in holding the body with right hand and left hand on steering. You were airborne on right rear wheel. but your right front was firm on ground. Yes there is a tilt to leftside and steering is in steady position. This position will definitely make you tilted and chances of flipping possible.

One has to turn the steering to opposit direction of tilt and try to move the vehicle to firm position on all four wheels. Meaning in this position of yours, you should have turned the steering to right and moved the jeep. Then there was no chance of tilt.

BTW Sarjapur road OTR, we observed onething. You were very confident and perfect. You have mastered the trick.

Well done buddy.

Dwarak
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Old 23rd December 2008, 13:56   #242
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@Red Liner: Whoa.. Best thing is to let go of the steering in the above situation. But like you said with no other restraint in an open Jeep your first reflex is to grab the steering wheel. A seatbelt would'nt have made you think twice of letting go of the steering.

With one injured hand it would be difficult to steer a non PS equipped Jeep in that situation.

That pic looks awesome though, until you dont know about the thumb that is
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Old 23rd December 2008, 14:20   #243
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Originally Posted by dwaraka View Post
Red Liner a.k.a. Venkat,

Please observe the photograph carefully. The actual mistake was not in holding the body with right hand and left hand on steering. You were airborne on right rear wheel. but your right front was firm on ground. Yes there is a tilt to leftside and steering is in steady position. This position will definitely make you tilted and chances of flipping possible.

One has to turn the steering to opposit direction of tilt and try to move the vehicle to firm position on all four wheels. Meaning in this position of yours, you should have turned the steering to right and moved the jeep. Then there was no chance of tilt.

BTW Sarjapur road OTR, we observed onething. You were very confident and perfect. You have mastered the trick.

Well done buddy.

Dwarak
Heyyyyy Dwarak! In this particular picture, I was being towed randomly by Andy (if I remember right) and the vehicle was just being dragged out of the ditch. Andy was on the left, above the wall, and was towing me out from that direction - almost sideways. I had zero control. And you will see the vehicle being pulled out towards the left - which is why the right wheel is totally in the air.

If you notice, I was just beginning to turn the wheel to the right with the one hand I had left but Andy had already decided to go for it.

Every OTR presents a new challenge And well, you know me, I usually never say no

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Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
@Red Liner: Whoa.. Best thing is to let go of the steering in the above situation. But like you said with no other restraint in an open Jeep your first reflex is to grab the steering wheel. A seatbelt would'nt have made you think twice of letting go of the steering.

With one injured hand it would be difficult to steer a non PS equipped Jeep in that situation.

That pic looks awesome though, until you dont know about the thumb that is
The thumb incident happened much earlier when I crash landed into the pit in the first place. At that immediate second, the body just told me to hold onto something at all cost. I have slowly begun tempering my mind over the body Visualising different scenarios before actually doing it really helps.
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Old 23rd December 2008, 14:29   #244
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Hey headers,
Can you explain how does this happen? I havent flipped my jeep yet....failed to understand why?
Will do so soon Vinod!


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One has to turn the steering to opposit direction of tilt and try to move the vehicle to firm position on all four wheels.
Sir, is it not in the direction of the tilt! to avoid flipping! One generally turns into the direction of the tilt, not away from it!

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@Red Liner: Whoa.. Best thing is to let go of the steering in the above situation.
Well Sir, You do NOT let go of the steering in such situations!

Well I'm truly scared of offroad now!
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Old 23rd December 2008, 14:36   #245
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Well Sir, You do NOT let go of the steering in such situations!

Well I'm truly scared of offroad now!
You will hold on to the steering when the terrain makes your front wheels turn on its own. How? Please keep only the above situation in mind, do not generalise it over every offroad track.

PS: Sir, I know you won an OTR.

Last edited by Spitfire : 23rd December 2008 at 14:39.
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Old 23rd December 2008, 14:41   #246
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Will do so soon Vinod!




Sir, is it not in the direction of the tilt! to avoid flipping! One generally turns into the direction of the tilt, not away from it!

Well Sir, You do NOT let go of the steering in such situations!

Well I'm truly scared of offroad now!
I agree with you on the flip. I was trying to straighten the wheel out because my jeep was beginning to climb onto the embankment, and I needed to go straight a little.

When being towed out (albeit slowly) you must correct steering position. That is especially important when trying to clear a higher embankment.

However, (again) when I hit the "imaginary" ground under the slush and came out, the steering wheel whipped from left to right and back again through my hands because the ground underneath the slush was hard and extremely uneven. If I had just removed my hands from wheel, I would have saved my thumb (actually I should not have clasped my thumb around the wheel).

Proper recce's at that spot right there and a slower approach might have been good in hindsight...and guys, everyone learns through experience. Nobody is a born offroader. The important thing is to admit your silliest mistakes to others and let them LEARN too I am sure many people would have picked up some good tips from the basic discussions we are having here.

I think we are going majorly Offtopic on this thread. Suggest we close and move to the Munnar OTR Looks too juicy.

If anyone is keen on opening a new thread on "mistakes made when offroading and corrective action", I promise to wade in and fight!
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Old 23rd December 2008, 14:48   #247
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You will hold on to the steering when the terrain makes your front wheels turn on its own. How? Please keep only the above situation in mind, do not generalise it over every offroad track.
You do not either completely let go off it nor do you completely hold onto it in a static position. You need to keep correcting the steering and the guy towing you needs to tow you out very slowly. Not a sudden jerk movement and full blown acceleration thereafter. Where is the time to plan? In this sarjapura OTR, we all made the mistake of full force tow outs 90% of the time. that's okay on flat land.

Which is why winches are always preferred over other vehicles towing people out. Its a constant, slow, movement which you can use to calculate and direct your steering. And the best thing is it can stop in case things are going dangerous. Zero human intervention is sometimes...just sometimes, good
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Old 23rd December 2008, 14:59   #248
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Originally Posted by Red Liner View Post
You do not either completely let go off it nor do you completely hold onto it in a static position.
Agree, its when you potentially risk an injury that you dont hold on to the steering. The above post was considering your thumb or fingers can be compromised when the steering gets a mind of its own.

Regards to being winched out. I have noticed this for optimal winching effort. The direction of the front wheels should be in parallel to the winch cord.

Last edited by Spitfire : 23rd December 2008 at 15:16.
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Old 23rd December 2008, 15:15   #249
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BTW, I always wear seatbelt during offroading. Since I don't have doors, I am scared I might fall off.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwaraka View Post
One has to turn the steering to opposit direction of tilt and try to move the vehicle to firm position on all four wheels.
Sir, is it not in the direction of the tilt! to avoid flipping! One generally turns into the direction of the tilt, not away from it!
Exactly, I am not sure why Dwaraka is suggesting otherwise.

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Well I'm truly scared of offroad now!
Oh, I never thought you would be such a wimp.
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Old 23rd December 2008, 16:08   #250
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Exactly, I am not sure why Dwaraka is suggesting otherwise.

Oh, I never thought you would be such a wimp.
Sharat, Isnt it better to be a wimp than be a stud and do the wrong things?

I've already had my fair share of spills and thrills!
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Old 23rd December 2008, 16:36   #251
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Sharat, Isnt it better to be a wimp than be a stud and do the wrong things?

I've already had my fair share of spills and thrills!
Maybe you should share those experiences with all of us so we can all learn?
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Old 23rd December 2008, 16:54   #252
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Venkat, I will, but i think it is already posted on the forum, somwhere. Let me search for it, else will post in a couple of days.

IIRC, Arka has already posted what and what not especially while the vehicle tilts!
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Old 26th December 2008, 19:27   #253
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Venkat, I will, but i think it is already posted on the forum, somwhere. Let me search for it, else will post in a couple of days.

IIRC, Arka has already posted what and what not especially while the vehicle tilts!
Ahhh...Arka...long time since I heard the big man bellowing commands at an OTR good fun good fun
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Old 27th December 2008, 09:24   #254
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Maybe you should share those experiences with all of us so we can all learn?
Hi,

Just found a pic of my gypsy lifting a wheel while turning into a descent. Please note that the RL wheel is in the air. This was a very slow descent. Now:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/suvs-m...ml#post1051971


If I turn the steering to the left, thinking I will put the RL wheel down, i would be mistaken and it would result in a topple. Why? Cos the entire weight of the vehicle shifts to the FR wheel and this is already 2 feet down.

Also, your vehicle moves forward for your steering correction to have some effect. This would mean the vehicle going parallel to the descent which will have an extreme lean angle, that is dangerous!

One of the basic thumb rules is to always turn in the direction of the vehicle tilt. That way one does not topple the vehicle. Lifting a wheel is OK, you still have three wheels on the ground!

If one is doing a steep climb, and you stall doing the climb: what to do?

Will post later on how to recover from that situation.

Cheers
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