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Old 22nd April 2008, 16:33   #16
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Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
Front Axle - IFS Torsion bar Full- Floating with Auto Locking Hubs (M35 Diff)

Rear Axle - Rigid Live Axle on Coil Springs - Semi-Floating (NO LSD)

Gearbox - NGT530

Transfer Case - Part-Time Borg-Warner 2 Speed electronically actuated.
So the Scorpio has open diffs at the front and the rear. This is similar to most selectable 4x4s sold in India. The vehicle will stop moving if one wheel on each axle looses traction. The Safari has the advantage of LSD rear axle, but it is a heavier vehicle on the same tyres, so overall, the two may have similar offroad performance. Remember, the Gypsy with open diffs will cream almost all of the expensive SUVs offroad. Weight and ground pressure play an important role in determining a vehicle's off road ability.

We need a through offroad test drive 4x4s, something the auto mags will never give us...it will have to be done by ourselves, anyone willing to lend their 4x4 for some mud bashing?
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Old 22nd April 2008, 16:39   #17
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Alfa_Kilo, arka says that scorpio has "auto locking hubs". so if one of the front wheels loses traction, the other will still spin, right?
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Old 22nd April 2008, 17:08   #18
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Auto-Locking Hub = Electronically actuated Free-Wheeling Hub
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Old 22nd April 2008, 17:17   #19
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Arka, even after your explanation, I am confused.
So if one front wheel loses traction in the scorpio, it will spin freely and you wont get out of much, right?
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Old 22nd April 2008, 17:39   #20
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So if one front wheel loses traction in the scorpio, it will spin freely and you wont get out of much, right?
Depends on how bad the situation is, TSK. Even with only 2 or 3 tyres having grip (and one spinning), I have come out of very tricky conditions.
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Old 22nd April 2008, 17:46   #21
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Depends on how bad the situation is, TSK. Even with only 2 or 3 tyres having grip (and one spinning), I have come out of very tricky conditions.
But in what car? With, or without, LSDs?

Without LSDs, this means:

If, from one side, you see a front wheel spinning free (the vehicle making no headway), you can be sure one rear wheel (the other side) is also spinning free.
If you see one rear wheel spinning free and car not moving, one front wheel on the other side is also spinning free!

Is this correct?
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Old 22nd April 2008, 17:49   #22
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...
Is this correct?
not necessarily. again depends on the situation
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Old 22nd April 2008, 18:11   #23
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not necessarily. again depends on the situation
Could you please elaborate? (In the context of what I have written about a vehicle without LSDs).
Where would the above not necessarily be true?
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Old 22nd April 2008, 19:06   #24
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Originally Posted by Alfa_Kilo View Post

We need a through offroad test drive 4x4s, something the auto mags will never give us...it will have to be done by ourselves, anyone willing to lend their 4x4 for some mud bashing?
Lets put my safari to the grind... when and where???
I feel we should wait for the monsoon to get some good slushy and muddy terrain.
I really want to find out if my safari is worth my cent. There is lots of places close to mumbai. ive offroaded close to raigad in the monsoon in a classic. Real offroad stuff.

I am game and so is my safari, all stock...on the block!

Last edited by jaysmokesleaves : 22nd April 2008 at 19:08.
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Old 22nd April 2008, 19:19   #25
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Alfa_Kilo, arka says that scorpio has "auto locking hubs". so if one of the front wheels loses traction, the other will still spin, right?
No, it wont. The scorpio has auto locking hubs, not a locking diff. The diff is responsible for transferring power between two wheels on an axle. An open diff will transfer all the power to the wheel which can overcome grip and spin.

Hub locks are provided in some part time 4x4s to disengage the wheels from the front axle drivetrain. This slightly reduces wear and tear, and has a marginal improvement on FE and performance. Old Gypsies and Jeeps used to have manually operated hub locks, whereas some SUVs has auto hublocks. Auto hublocks usually have some disadvantages compared to manual ones, so hardcore offraders prefer manual hublocks, or auto hublocks with a manual override.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
Auto-Locking Hub = Electronically actuated Free-Wheeling Hub
I think the Scorpio hublocks are similar to that of the Safari, they are mechanically actuated with the rotation of the driveshafts. Such hublocks have on disadvantage that when one changes the direction of travel, the front wheels are temporarily disengaged. So if one is stuck, and require rocking to get out, auto hublocks could let you down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves View Post
Lets put my safari to the grind... when and where???
I feel we should wait for the monsoon to get some good slushy and muddy terrain.
I really want to find out if my safari is worth my cent. There is lots of places close to mumbai. ive offroaded close to raigad in the monsoon in a classic. Real offroad stuff.

I am game and so is my safari, all stock...on the block!
Thats the spirit

I would love to accompany you guys on any offroad event. I dont have 4x4 at the moment, but planning to get an ex-army MM550 by the year end.
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Old 23rd April 2008, 00:46   #26
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Alfa,

completely OT, but isnt the best thing to call up arka - the jeepers would've done ALL of it and then some more
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Old 24th April 2008, 15:42   #27
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Default locking hubs not locking diff

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Alfa_Kilo, arka says that scorpio has "auto locking hubs". so if one of the front wheels loses traction, the other will still spin, right?
Do not confuse locking hubs with locking differentials. These are two different things. The locking hub's purpose is only to prevent the front propeller etc from turning when four wheel drive is not in use thereby increasing fuel average slightly and saving wear and tear on front wheel drive components. If you were not confusing the two then please disregard this obnoxious blast of hot gas.
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Old 24th April 2008, 15:49   #28
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I was confusing the both.
So I guess the scorpio does not have LSD and hence by default open differentials?
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Old 24th April 2008, 18:05   #29
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Ok, this means that the front two wheels will always spin together.
So that means unless you have 3 wheels out of action, the SUV will move ahead, right?
Not True. If you don't have LSD or differential locks and both front and rear tires on the same side, then you won't have traction as spinning wheels will loose the traction in the front and back.
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Old 24th April 2008, 18:10   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
I was confusing the both.
So I guess the scorpio does not have LSD and hence by default open differentials?
That is sadly true. Mahindra provides LSDs only on Army vehicles, and perhaps on some export models.
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