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Old 23rd October 2008, 16:11   #1
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Default Gypsy on Steroids: The Rockcrawler 4.16:1 T-Case Gearset.

In my quest to make my mpfi MG413W a very capable and a 'Camel Trophy' worthy off-roader, I had given 2 doses of 'Steroids' to my Gypsy.

Dose #1:

Dose #2:

I also did away with the 'anti-sway' bar and that has improved articulation to a great degree (a very handy thing to have in off-road scenarios).

As I had mentioned in other posts, I have a long lists of mods that will achieve my dream of building my MG413w the way I want it to. However, before each set of major mods I need time to test my MG413W extensively in both on-road and off-road situations. Now, after testing all the above mods extensively and fully satisfied with the results it's time to move on to the next set of mods.

This one is the killer w.r.t off-roading scenarios especially rocks and slow speed off-roading. Not many mods for a MG413W can be better than this one. This is the one that should make the MG413W a true rock crawler at nearly stand still speeds -- a characteristic that the stock high revving MG413W does not possess natively because of the petrol engine block & the gearing ratios. (NOTE: Rock Crawling is very different from hill climbing/inclines which my gypsy is able to do very easily)

I had various choices to make the MG413W a capable rock crawler:
  • Plonk a ultra low t-case gearset in place of the stock 2.268:1 gearset
  • Do mods to change the axle ratio from 3.73 to something even more lower (both front & rear)
After months of research and interaction with Samurai owners from other parts of the world, I decided on taking option #1.
Here also, one could go way way low. I decided to keep an optimum balance of on-road manners & good +ve effect on off-road manners. Hence I settled for a 4.16:1 t-case gearset. This will give 84% low range reduction and 12% high range reduction -- a massive performance boost compared to the stock 2.268:1 t-case capabilities.

This is what it looks like:
Gypsy on Steroids: The Rockcrawler 4.16:1 T-Case Gearset.-4162.jpg

To give another perspective on what this means in off-roading & rock climbing, let me explain on what this will do to the 'crawl ratio' of my MG413W

The stock crawl ratio of MG413w is:
3.652 * 2.268 * 3.727 = 30.869

With the 4.16:1 t-case gearset, the crawl ratio would become:
3.652 * 4.160 * 3.727 = 56.621

To put this in perspective, the crawl ratio of a CL340 & CL340 Classic is:
3.986 * 2.460 * 4.880 = 47.851 (CL340 Classic)
3.986 * 2.460 * 5.380 = 52.754 (CL340 )

Will get this installed very soon in my MG413W. Will keep you updated on the whole install process (this will also require some more mods to handle the increased torque).

Cheers,
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Old 23rd October 2008, 16:51   #2
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Thumbs up Amazing!

Wow ! khan_sultan, Amazing !

Best of luck on this round of modifications!


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Originally Posted by khan_sultan View Post
...Will keep you updated on the whole install process (this will also require some more mods to handle the increased torque)...
stronger propeller shafts and axle shafts, for sure. I know you would be looking into this aspect : the online Suzuki Samurai forums must be having this information available. I am sure the stock ones will not be able to handle the additional torque.

.

Last edited by Blue Thunder : 23rd October 2008 at 16:58.
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Old 23rd October 2008, 21:08   #3
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Here comes the next one.

Shan, you are true inspiration for 4x4 guys I beleive. Ready for any mods. And also amazed to see your R&D onthis before choosing the right ones. Great going.

Cheers
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Old 23rd October 2008, 21:16   #4
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Will be keenly following this thread as my King will be with me in December. By the way, will there be any change in the 2H and 4H ratios. The Gypsy is not so fast on the higways as it is.
If I understood right, this goes into the divorced transfer case and only for the 4L?
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Old 23rd October 2008, 23:49   #5
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Now thats one of most required Mod for a Gypsy!!!! Looking forward to it Khan Bhai

Thanks
--Sree--
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Old 24th October 2008, 12:34   #6
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Shan you will teach all of us automotive engg by the time the mods are done. Kudos man for your enthu as you get to rarely see your type
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Old 24th October 2008, 15:21   #7
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Way to Go Shahnawazcheers:.

Knowing the amount of homework you do before you take the plunge, am sure this one should make your MG413W rock. All the very Best for your mods. I will be watching this thread closely

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Shan you will teach all of us automotive engg by the time the mods are done. Kudos man for your enthu as you get to rarely see your type

Last edited by S@~+#0$# : 24th October 2008 at 15:24.
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Old 24th October 2008, 15:45   #8
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So your Gypsy crawl ratio is going to exceed the crawl ratio of my Jeep. This ain't fair.

So, when is this going to happen?
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Old 24th October 2008, 16:02   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Thunder View Post
....stronger propeller shafts and axle shafts, for sure. .... I am sure the stock ones will not be able to handle the additional torque...
BT, actually the 4:1 t-case doesn't require that much additional mods and the stock shafts will do. It's only in the 'ultra low' 6:1 or 8:1 t-case setups you need these additional mods.

One thing that needs to be beefed up is the t-case mounting. That's the weakest link. with 4:1, it will be just ok but it is always good to reinforce it to handle the additional torque.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jyobeb View Post
....will there be any change in the 2H and 4H ratios. ....
There will be a 12% reduction in High ratio's as well. Both 2WD-H and 4WD-H.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
So your Gypsy crawl ratio is going to exceed the crawl ratio of my Jeep. This ain't fair.

So, when is this going to happen?
He he he.. Good one. Yeah the crawl ratio will be awesome now and folks who have 340's can really appreciate what this means in off-roading terms.

Actually, there are few things that are delaying this right now and me not plonking in the 4:1 t-case.

1. Deepawali holidays. The mechanics are in holiday mood already and not in mood to take up new work.

2. Am changing the front leaf springs also. So am waiting for MUL to supply them so that both things can be done at the same time.

3. Too many frequent OTR's . This work could mean me missing out on some OTR's and with rain gods being so benevolent, I am tempted not miss OTR's.

Cheers,
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Old 25th October 2008, 16:03   #10
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Man, your Gypsy is truly evolving into a 4x4 "King". Slowly & steadily.

Quote:
The stock crawl ratio of MG413w is:
3.652 * 2.268 * 3.727 = 30.869

With the 4.16:1 t-case gearset, the crawl ratio would become:
3.652 * 4.160 * 3.727 = 56.621
Mega! Who uses 3rd & 4th low anyways. With your new setup, 1st & 2nd low will be used for extreme applications, while 3rd & 4th low will prolly be for situations that you use your current 1st & 2nd low ratio in. Where are you importing the gearset from?

Quote:
However, before each set of major mods I need time to test my MG413W extensively in both on-road and off-road situations.
Wise and the way to go.
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Old 25th October 2008, 20:53   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
...Mega! Who uses 3rd & 4th low anyways. With your new setup, 1st & 2nd low will be used for extreme applications, while 3rd & 4th low will prolly be for situations that you use your current 1st & 2nd low ratio in...
Yeah, you are right. Here is the chart of what impact this will have across all the gears. In fact, lots of terrains can now be done in 4-H itself where previously 4-L would have to be used.

Name:  gearing_impact.JPG
Views: 7399
Size:  58.6 KB

Quote:
Where are you importing the gearset from? ...
From the US. After much lookout, I have found that Suzuki Samurai 4x4 mod parts are best sourced from the US. You have good choice, reasonable price points, reliability (based on user feedback) and one can find enough people to bring the stuff for you (so saving on shipment costs)

Cheers,
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Old 26th October 2008, 12:46   #12
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K.S., if you wanted to stay "all India" and not use imported parts, what would you do to get comparable crawl ratios? The reason I ask is that some of us live in remote places where spare parts, let alone imported ones, are hard to get.
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Old 26th October 2008, 23:32   #13
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Khan_Sultan : You might want to consider a beefier clutch too.
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Old 27th October 2008, 08:23   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
K.S., if you wanted to stay "all India" and not use imported parts, what would you do to get comparable crawl ratios? The reason I ask is that some of us live in remote places where spare parts, let alone imported ones, are hard to get.
DD, In that scenario I would be completely stock. The 'mechanical mods' (gearings/lockers etc) are yet to be available in India and I would not risk getting them fabricated here in a local place. 'Gear Cutting' is a serious business and while I do not discount the expertise of gear industries here, I do not not anyone who would cut 1 or 2 gears just for an off-road junkie :-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Khan_Sultan : You might want to consider a beefier clutch too.
GTO, I have yet to see (in large numbers) the mention of 'beefier' clutch for off-roading and rock crawling for a Suzuki Samurai. In fact, most of the literature suggests that once you have mods like say low gears and lockers, your stock clutch should become more effective. This is because in OTR scenarios, in stock gypsy one has to play with the ABC and this at times impacts the clutch -ve'ly. With the mods the need for playing with ABC reduces a lot. (in fact in a recent OTR many folks were asking me on how I am able to make my gypsy crawl [in relative terms] where as rest of the gypsy folks had to rev it up)

However, i will see if this is required at some point of time. I think you are mentioning it from the clutch being able to handle the 'increased toruqe' point of view.

Cheers,
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Old 27th October 2008, 14:12   #15
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Its so wonderful to see that as you use your Gypsy you are targeting its limitations systematically and upgrading it to overcome shortcomings. Considering what the Samurai does around the world you have the right machine and a huge aftermarket industry to support these upgrades. I have no doubt the rate at which you are going your machine will soon become formidable, not to mention your own prowess offroad.

Great going Shahnawaz. Your are an inspiration. I especially dig your camping trips, that's the ultimate way to enjoy this sport.
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