Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > 4x4 & Off-Roading > 4x4 Technical


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 24th March 2009, 13:41   #166
Senior - BHPian
 
fazalaliadil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 2,022
Thanked: 623 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by josepeter View Post
Fazal, if the wrinkles can disappear it would make the Jeep much more perfect. That's what I think!
On the metal itself there is nothing that can be done now once the wrinkles are formed. The only way is to encase it in foam wrapped by artleather or PU.
fazalaliadil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th March 2009, 22:14   #167
BHPian
 
4x4 loaded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 133
Thanked: 2 Times
Default ...This is an example of just one component of many things to be done on an engine ov

Thanks Fazal. One of my friend and I am going to buy an army disposal mm550 of 98 model. Its going to be brought to calcautta very soon. will start a thread once the restoration starts. UBS is helping me to buy it and then also restoring the mechanicals. got to know a lot from your thread
4x4 loaded is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 02:26   #168
BHPian
 
4x4 loaded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 133
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

Can anybody tell me the difference between 98 model mm550 and a 2000/2002 model mm550 both from the army disposal? does the xd3p engine of the 98 model mm540 has the same bolero engine?
4x4 loaded is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 08:00   #169
Senior - BHPian
 
harjeev's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,896
Thanked: 256 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4 loaded View Post
Can anybody tell me the difference between 98 model mm550 and a 2000/2002 model mm550 both from the army disposal? does the xd3p engine of the 98 model mm540 has the same bolero engine?
On the top of my mind are
  • the tail gate is different on post 2001 models
  • No Free wheeling hubs in later models
  • Blackout lights are installed on the bumper in post 2001 compared to the fenders on older one
  • The instrument panel has a black rectangular display for the heater, oil etc compared to small individual light bulbs on older models
These are some of the thing that come to my mind. Others will add to the list
harjeev is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 18:24   #170
BHPian
 
4x4 loaded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 133
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by harjeev View Post
On the top of my mind are
  • the tail gate is different on post 2001 models
  • No Free wheeling hubs in later models
  • Blackout lights are installed on the bumper in post 2001 compared to the fenders on older one
  • The instrument panel has a black rectangular display for the heater, oil etc compared to small individual light bulbs on older models
These are some of the thing that come to my mind. Others will add to the list

Any difference in respect to engine, gearbox or other mechanical stuff and also chassis?? I needed to know as I have to chose between a 98 model and a 2000 model.
4x4 loaded is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 20:14   #171
Senior - BHPian
 
fazalaliadil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 2,022
Thanked: 623 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4 loaded View Post
Any difference in respect to engine, gearbox or other mechanical stuff and also chassis?? I needed to know as I have to chose between a 98 model and a 2000 model.
4X4,
Just go for the later model. The variation in the above two models is nominal, would not make much of an overal difference.
fazalaliadil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 21:52   #172
BHPian
 
4x4 loaded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 133
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

I would have definitely gone for the 2000 model but the rear differential of the same is open and it might take 5-6 k to fix it as was told by Mr. Uday Bhan singh. I had already confirmed him about the 98 model but just wanted to make sure that I am not going to compromise on the mechanicals in respect to the year of its manufacture. Mr Sadhan who works as a freelance in Uday sir's workshop has visited the jeeps and he is recommending the 98 model at the first inspection
4x4 loaded is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 00:52   #173
BHPian
 
4x4 loaded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 133
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

I would also like to know the options to install a 5 speed gear box with the XD3P engine and the 4wd set up from the army disposal mm 550 jeep. Do the Bolero 5 speed gear be installed with it? what are the other options of 5 speed gears..or are there any cons?
4x4 loaded is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 08:45   #174
Senior - BHPian
 
harjeev's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,896
Thanked: 256 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4 loaded View Post
I would also like to know the options to install a 5 speed gear box with the XD3P engine and the 4wd set up from the army disposal mm 550 jeep. Do the Bolero 5 speed gear be installed with it? what are the other options of 5 speed gears..or are there any cons?
I think that the bolero 5 Speed gearbox can easily be installed. Will talk to my mechanic today and confirm in the evening.

I might be wrong as I have not confirmed this, But somebody told me that the final gearing ratios in the 5th gear on the 5 speed gearbox is the same as the 4th in the 4 speed one.
Can anyone confirm this??
If this is so, I dont thing that its any use to do this conversion.
harjeev is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 11:19   #175
Senior - BHPian
 
fazalaliadil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 2,022
Thanked: 623 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by harjeev View Post
I think that the bolero 5 Speed gearbox can easily be installed. Will talk to my mechanic today and confirm in the evening.

I might be wrong as I have not confirmed this, But somebody told me that the final gearing ratios in the 5th gear on the 5 speed gearbox is the same as the 4th in the 4 speed one.
Can anyone confirm this??
If this is so, I dont thing that its any use to do this conversion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4 loaded View Post
I would also like to know the options to install a 5 speed gear box with the XD3P engine and the 4wd set up from the army disposal mm 550 jeep. Do the Bolero 5 speed gear be installed with it? what are the other options of 5 speed gears..or are there any cons?
The XD3P came fitted with a 5 foward gearbox in the earlier models of Bolero.
fazalaliadil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 20:47   #176
BHPian
 
4x4 loaded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 133
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

[quote=harjeev;1232758]I think that the bolero 5 Speed gearbox can easily be installed. Will talk to my mechanic today and confirm in the evening.
quote]
hi harjeev, did you contact your mechanic? and as fazal said its true that the bolero was fitted with 5 speed gear. so are you sure about the top gear ratio?- as surely the topspeed of the bolero (xd3p + 5 gear) will be more than a mm550 on its fourth gear..isnt it? can somebody please clarify
4x4 loaded is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th March 2009, 19:14   #177
Senior - BHPian
 
jeepster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: MH24 aka LATUR
Posts: 1,521
Thanked: 941 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by harjeev View Post

I think that the bolero 5 Speed gearbox can easily be installed.
I might be wrong as I have not confirmed this, But somebody told me that the final gearing ratios in the 5th gear on the 5 speed gearbox is the same as the 4th in the 4 speed one.
If this is so, I dont thing that its any use to do this conversion.
g.b.ratios

t 90
3+1 3rd 1:1

kmt90
4+1 4th 1:1

ba10
5+1 5th 0.842:1

ba10 5/v1
5+1 5th 0.79:1

ngt 520
5+1 5th 0.79:1

hm 5mx
5+1 5th 0.84:1

isuzu msg5t
5+1 5th 0.775:1

( correct mistake's in above if there are )

Last edited by jeepster : 28th March 2009 at 19:17.
jeepster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th March 2009, 20:18   #178
BHPian
 
Brutus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chandigarh
Posts: 374
Thanked: 45 Times
Default

The point is that you would have to go for a Borg & Warner transfer case, which i think would be a little difficult to source, not to mention more expensive. Or you could go for any of the divorced xcases in the market, leaving aside the gypsy units(which not only isnt strong enough, but the high ratio itself is a 1.4:1 gearing, whereas the others have a 1:1 high gearing).The Dana 18 xfercase is not only easier to locate, but locating parts too is not much of a problem either(that is,if it goes kaput, which it seldom does). Right now, i am not aware of anyone who has been able to shoehorn a Ba10(or any of the mahindra 5 speeders for that matter) to a Dana18, so a 5 spped gearbox would need the more expensive xfercase.
As far as the Borg & warner xfercase is concerned, i dont know what model it is, but most of the xfercase made by them use a chain drive system, which is a lot quiter than the dana18 geardrives though, but chain drives aren't known to be as strong as their gear driven counterparts, and since i have never owned a vehicle having one of these units, i really comment if they are as reliable as the dana18 or not.
Brutus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th March 2009, 10:10   #179
Senior - BHPian
 
fazalaliadil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 2,022
Thanked: 623 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brutus View Post
The point is that you would have to go for a Borg & Warner transfer case, which i think would be a little difficult to source, not to mention more expensive. As far as the Borg & warner xfercase is concerned, i dont know what model it is, but most of the xfercase made by them use a chain drive system, which is a lot quiter than the dana18 geardrives though, but chain drives aren't known to be as strong as their gear driven counterparts, and since i have never owned a vehicle having one of these units, i really comment if they are as reliable as the dana18 or not.
Brutus,
About the Borg Warner, and the chain drive mechanism, I would like to know more about it's relaibility, why should it not be rugged as the gear driven? It is an upgrade of th gear driven, hence. Is it that because of it's rarity that many people are not aware of it's prowess? As it a tendency with mechanics here.... if they do not understand a mechanism or have not worked on one, they immedeately start condenming it... is it a similar case?
Many Transfer cases in the new generation vehicles are chain driven.
Await your's and other learned forum members to enlighten me here.
Thanks

Last edited by fazalaliadil : 29th March 2009 at 10:19.
fazalaliadil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th March 2009, 10:51   #180
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Madurai
Posts: 1,007
Thanked: 643 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brutus View Post
The point is that you would have to go for a Borg & Warner transfer case, which i think would be a little difficult to source, not to mention more expensive. Or you could go for any of the divorced xcases in the market, leaving aside the gypsy units(which not only isnt strong enough, but the high ratio itself is a 1.4:1 gearing, whereas the others have a 1:1 high gearing).The Dana 18 xfercase is not only easier to locate, but locating parts too is not much of a problem either(that is,if it goes kaput, which it seldom does). Right now, i am not aware of anyone who has been able to shoehorn a Ba10(or any of the mahindra 5 speeders for that matter) to a Dana18, so a 5 spped gearbox would need the more expensive xfercase.
As far as the Borg & warner xfercase is concerned, i dont know what model it is, but most of the xfercase made by them use a chain drive system, which is a lot quiter than the dana18 geardrives though, but chain drives aren't known to be as strong as their gear driven counterparts, and since i have never owned a vehicle having one of these units, i really comment if they are as reliable as the dana18 or not.
Yup! It is indeed tough to source a Borg Warner transfer case! For anyone interested I have a electric shift transfer case. I also have a plate to mate the T90 gearbox to the BW transfer case. Mating a Dana18 transfer case to the BA10/NGT can be done but not a very good idea
Attached Thumbnails
Working on a 540 (Now Completed)-19032009375.jpg  

Working on a 540 (Now Completed)-19032009376.jpg  

jyobeb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fiat Punto 90 HP Sports: My Companion. Now, 80000 kms completed! parimal_g Long-Term Ownership Reviews 30 23rd May 2017 19:04
Restoration - 1962 Jawa Type 353 Kyvacka. EDIT : Now Completed! TuffRyder Post-War 194 5th March 2013 09:42
The Story of MIKE - My Ikon Flair 2006 EDIT : Now completed 60,000 kms + New Footwear benbsb29 Long-Term Ownership Reviews 544 17th October 2011 13:07
"Kuch khatta, kuch mitha!!" 'Now completed 1 year, 10,000 km review of my i10 Sportz ulhas.ahirrao Long-Term Ownership Reviews 9 12th January 2011 20:42


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 09:21.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks