Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > 4x4 & Off-Roading > 4x4 Technical


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 23rd March 2010, 19:16   #61
Senior - BHPian
 
nitrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UAE/Lon/Madras
Posts: 6,965
Thanked: 265 Times
Default

I had this same problem when I fitted an aftermarket superking AC in my Sumo, a decade back.
The problem minimized when I fitted a shroud to the fan. And I did not upsize the radiator.

It would still heat when I'm driving on hills, or on the highway (high rpm since I have a pretty short ratio in the Sumo).

The diagnosis is simple: The condenser is restricting air flow to the radiator because its sitting right in front of it.
Solution I found for my car: Relocate the condenser to below the radiator in such a way it won't be vertical anymore. It would be at an angle near horizontal (30-40 degrees would be good) depending on vehicle.
I never did it since I retired the vehicle to just city use.
I don't know if this is viable with the gypsy if you're going to offroad. It might get damaged at approach.
nitrous is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 24th March 2010, 09:48   #62
Team-BHP Support
 
moralfibre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: MH-12
Posts: 6,562
Thanked: 6,029 Times
Default

Engine Overheating Causes & Cures

I think you have a blown head gasket. Can you check? What's the latest on this issue?
moralfibre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th March 2010, 14:47   #63
BHPian
 
GoSlow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Noida
Posts: 507
Thanked: 68 Times
Default AC fittment

Hi

Here are pics of the AC radiator fitted underneath my Gypsy. There are two electric fans above it as well. I struggled with the samde problem as yours for many years before taking this route and now everything works fine. Hope it helps.

I am a member of NIOC which and have done lots of challenging OTRs. None of this setup has been an issue.

Cheers
Ankit
Attached Thumbnails
Gypsy '09 Heating problems!-ac.jpg  

Gypsy '09 Heating problems!-ac2.jpg  

GoSlow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th March 2010, 15:58   #64
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,852
Thanked: 15,407 Times
Default

Did you get this done from Sai in sector 16. This setup has AC sitting above the prop shaft. So I guess, unless you hit something so big that it actually damages the prop shaft, the AC is safe.
Another way to protect it would be to fit a sheet with holes(aluminum sheet?) above the prop shaft which can act as a skid plate for the AC.
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th March 2010, 19:08   #65
Senior - BHPian
 
SPIKE ARRESTOR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Deutschland
Posts: 2,653
Thanked: 679 Times
Default

@Ankit still i would recommend you to fabricate something similar to a skid plate, covering the fin area, what do you say?

Spike
SPIKE ARRESTOR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th March 2010, 19:21   #66
Senior - BHPian
 
harjeev's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,896
Thanked: 256 Times
Default

@Ankit
Have you get the air con serviced and running??? Because last I remember it wasn't running.

Further was first the condenser in front of the radiator. Additionally I remember at the Chandigarh OTR last year the aircon was not on and still your gypsy was overheating in 4x4 H/L and you had changed the radiator to get that sorted out.
Any conclusions why was that?
harjeev is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th March 2010, 06:22   #67
BHPian
 
COUGAR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Delhi
Posts: 538
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSlow View Post
Hi

hmm naaish! +1 to the skid plate idea.

How are the pipes routed?
COUGAR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th March 2010, 07:19   #68
Senior - BHPian
 
DirtyDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Dharamsala
Posts: 1,781
Thanked: 694 Times
Default

The man said that the HIGH SPEED heating problem STOPS when he turns off the a/c. When there is no a/c going, there is no problem. Therefore placement of components is not the issue; and air flow is ok.

There is no problem at low speed or stopped in traffic. This is the greatest heat producing situation and his current configuration is handling this heat.

So, what is there about the a/c compressor running at high rpm that causes over heating? You would not think the addtional load of the a/c would be enough to cause the problem since low speed testing shows it is ok.

1.) Does this compressor have clutches that are supposed kick down or off at certain situations? Are they doing so?

2.) If you put 6 people or a heavy load in this gypsy, will it overheat at high speed with the a/c turned off? This will test the effect of additional load on the heating/cooling system.

3.) I presume there is a separate belt running the compressor? Belt slippage e.g. to the water pump, bad belt tensioner might cause the problem.

Last edited by DirtyDan : 25th March 2010 at 07:38.
DirtyDan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th March 2010, 14:21   #69
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
The man said that the HIGH SPEED heating problem STOPS when he turns off the a/c. When there is no a/c going, there is no problem. Therefore placement of components is not the issue; and air flow is ok.

There is no problem at low speed or stopped in traffic. This is the greatest heat producing situation and his current configuration is handling this heat.

So, what is there about the a/c compressor running at high rpm that causes over heating? You would not think the addtional load of the a/c would be enough to cause the problem since low speed testing shows it is ok.

1.) Does this compressor have clutches that are supposed kick down or off at certain situations? Are they doing so?

2.) If you put 6 people or a heavy load in this gypsy, will it overheat at high speed with the a/c turned off? This will test the effect of additional load on the heating/cooling system.

3.) I presume there is a separate belt running the compressor? Belt slippage e.g. to the water pump, bad belt tensioner might cause the problem.
Dan you have understood the matter perfect. It is Heating With AC ONLY at high engine rpm, static or moving vehicle. Without AC at any rpm it does not heat.
The compressor runs on a seperate belt that drives the compressor and ps pump, while the original belt runs the water pump and alternator, and tensioning of both are perfect, and no slippage.
The water pump is perfect and causes big movement waves and gushes in the radiator top tank when viewed without the cap. Even at High rpm the water pump does not foul.
drove back vehicle yesterday and touched 110kmph on Expressway so enough power, so Gasket seems perfect, no warpage on head.
So what could it be? slow speed with AC there is no heating AT ALL!!
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th March 2010, 14:41   #70
VEA
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cochin
Posts: 140
Thanked: 8 Times
Default

At the risk of sounding an idiot, let me ask you one thing scooby. You are not running in 4wd low over 50 kmph. are you?

Last edited by VEA : 29th March 2010 at 14:43. Reason: spell error
VEA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th March 2010, 15:07   #71
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VEA View Post
At the risk of sounding an idiot, let me ask you one thing scooby. You are not running in 4wd low over 50 kmph. are you?
No Sir, Its Heating even at Standstill at Very High RPM.
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th March 2010, 22:45   #72
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 3,441
Thanked: 1,936 Times
Default

Hi,
I might be sounding like a cracked record, but would still suggest you start from a known point + only one unknown at a time. In your case it means original radiator, fan etc + AC (without electric fan). Otherwise there's a high chance you'll be like a dog chasing its own tail.

Are the fins of the condenser and radiator parallel to or perpendicular to each other?
What is the gap between the two?
Is there a gap between the electric fan and condenser?
Is the electric motor a flat pancake one, or a normal pipe shaped one?

Pictures please.

Regards
Sutripta
Sutripta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th March 2010, 04:13   #73
Senior - BHPian
 
DirtyDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Dharamsala
Posts: 1,781
Thanked: 694 Times
Default

Your water pump may be marginal, your test did not convince me that it is okay. Have a mechanic check the weep hole.

One way to test it is to get 4-6 friends to sit in your gypsy while you drive with the a/c OFF at high speed. See if it heats up. Even if it is not the WP, this test may point to something else.
DirtyDan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th March 2010, 06:03   #74
BHPian
 
COUGAR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Delhi
Posts: 538
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

sorry to be the party pooper boys, but this doesnt sound like the AC is the problem here!

I had a similar problem with my old M-800, also 5-speed MPFI: the damn thing would overheat so much that the coolant would be boiling and steam poured out of the bonnets!

Problem was traced to a faulty fan/coolant pump that switched off at higher RPM's. My mech told me "common problem with MPFI 800".

I think it could be something similar here.

Last edited by COUGAR : 30th March 2010 at 06:05.
COUGAR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th March 2010, 13:02   #75
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
Your water pump may be marginal, your test did not convince me that it is okay. Have a mechanic check the weep hole.

One way to test it is to get 4-6 friends to sit in your gypsy while you drive with the a/c OFF at high speed. See if it heats up. Even if it is not the WP, this test may point to something else.
What is a weep hole?

Quote:
Originally Posted by COUGAR View Post
sorry to be the party pooper boys, but this doesnt sound like the AC is the problem here!

I had a similar problem with my old M-800, also 5-speed MPFI: the damn thing would overheat so much that the coolant would be boiling and steam poured out of the bonnets!
Problem was traced to a faulty fan/coolant pump that switched off at higher RPM's. My mech told me "common problem with MPFI 800".

I think it could be something similar here.
Both the electric fans and the water pump work fully at high rpm, checked.

Last edited by scooby05 : 30th March 2010 at 13:04.
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Virus problems/spyware problems! post here! SirAlec Gadgets, Computers & Software 10 16th July 2014 00:05
Mahindra Scorpio CRDE 2007 - Problems 'n' Problems chandrda Technical Stuff 3 13th November 2009 09:59
Heating & oil pressure problems on MM550 wayfarer 4x4 Technical 24 2nd October 2008 18:30
Power Steering and Over heating Problems In my Sierra sag_kv Technical Stuff 8 9th May 2008 12:42


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 12:42.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks