Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > 4x4 & Off-Roading > 4x4 Technical


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 2nd March 2010, 15:32   #1
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default Gypsy '09 Heating problems!

I bought a Gypsy mpfi '09 2 months back done 10000kms.
It has a authorised dealer fitted Aircon and PS .
With the AC on the car heats up IF I am driving at 50kmph+, i.e. on the highways/expressways. In slow traffic there is NO Heating Whatsoever!!
Changed the electric fan but still no change. Everything works fine, the radiator fan comes on when the guage shows a lil below half, the aux fan comes on with the AC, both the fans come on with the AC in any condition.
Guage shows 100+ and water goes to resevoir, does not return to radiator after engine has cooled down?
Experts, What could be the reason??

Last edited by scooby05 : 2nd March 2010 at 15:37.
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 15:46   #2
Senior - BHPian
 
pramodkumar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gods own country
Posts: 1,971
Thanked: 819 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scooby05 View Post
I bought a Gypsy mpfi '09 2 months back done 10000kms.
It has a authorised dealer fitted Aircon and PS .
With the AC on the car heats up IF I am driving at 50kmph+, i.e. on the highways/expressways. In slow traffic there is NO Heating Whatsoever!!
Changed the electric fan but still no change. Everything works fine, the radiator fan comes on when the guage shows a lil below half, the aux fan comes on with the AC, both the fans come on with the AC in any condition.
Guage shows 100+ and water goes to resevoir, does not return to radiator after engine has cooled down?
Experts, What could be the reason??
Check the water circulation system and the pump, get it completely flushed and see if the problem still persists, as per you discussion its a clear case of more load on the engine.

Pramod
pramodkumar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 16:19   #3
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramodkumar View Post
Check the water circulation system and the pump, get it completely flushed and see if the problem still persists, as per you discussion its a clear case of more load on the engine.

Pramod
Yes, it seems like more load! but the system is flushed, the water pump works, does not heat in slow speed or stop start traffic. Only heats the moment i travel more than 50kmph!! very strange. kept the car standing with the engine and ac on for 1 hour and nothing. Why and from where is the strain?
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 16:28   #4
Senior - BHPian
 
pramodkumar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gods own country
Posts: 1,971
Thanked: 819 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scooby05 View Post
Yes, it seems like more load! but the system is flushed, the water pump works, does not heat in slow speed or stop start traffic. Only heats the moment i travel more than 50kmph!! very strange. kept the car standing with the engine and ac on for 1 hour and nothing. Why and from where is the strain?
If the vehicle heats up during bumper to bumper traffic the fan is the culprit. if it heats up during running, then there can be 2 issues.
1. The air flow to the radiater is restricted.
2. The cooling system has a problem.

If it was a carb gypsy i feel running it little rich would have kept the engine cold, this is not a solution but a work around. I feel your cooling system needs attention its either you need a bigger radiator or you need to get the cooling system inspected. Try this, when ever the vehicle heats up keep the engine running and pour cold water on teh radiator and watch is the temprature comes down.

You can also try bypassing the thermostat switch to chek if thats causing the problem.

As far as i can see the problem its an issue with the cooling system and nothing else.

Pramod
pramodkumar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 16:37   #5
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,852
Thanked: 15,406 Times
Default

Your aux fan is fitted wrongly(direction of rotation).
The aux fan is fitted between the grill and the radiator, and it blows air towards the outside.
So when vehicle is slow, it can effectively draw air from the radiator and blow it outside. At speed, it basically is fighting against the wind.
So what you need to do is that ensure that the fans are fitted in this fashion
1. Radiator fan, between engine and radiator - This fan should blow air on the engine
2. Aux fan, between grill and radiator - This fan should blow air from the outside on the radiator.
Get this done, and everything will be okay
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 17:13   #6
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 613
Thanked: 116 Times
Default

scooby05, will you please post a few pictures of your AC install?

Thanks

Nitin
ntomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 17:29   #7
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,491
Thanked: 6,768 Times
Default

09 MPFI? I thought they came much later? EDIT: I misread!! thanks Blue Thunder for pointing it out.

Since its a brand new vehicle, the whole story has changed. Check radiator cap and see if coolant circuit is proper, check ac fan if its working properly/turning in the right direction. This should set it right

Below mentioned can be ignored!

Anyways first thing is to get the cooling circuit checked thoroughly. Water pump, radiator, radiator cap, thermostat. If they are working properly switch ON the AC and see how its holding.

If its heating up, then first check if the aux fan fitted in front is turning in the right direction ie throwing air from front to the radiator. If this is fine, look at the AC radiator grill installation, if its properly done with good airflow. Also check if the radiator fan shroud is in place.

Also what compressor is the vehicle running?

Last edited by Jaggu : 2nd March 2010 at 17:47.
Jaggu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2010, 20:57   #8
BHPian
 
GoSlow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Noida
Posts: 507
Thanked: 68 Times
Default

scooby05 - get the AC Radiator and aux fan moved to under the vehicle. The exact place is between the chasis rails just before the rear Diff.

This will solve the overheating problems in ALL situations. Will take a pic of this setup on my Gypsy and post the pic tomorrow. I had the same setup like yours for many years and there were always issues one way or the other. With the current setup there is no problem.

Although, you will need to get the AC Radiator washed from time to time (maybe once in 2 months) as mud, dirt may clog it. Just take it to a jet wash station and get the vehicle washed from underneath.

Cheers
Ankit
GoSlow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 11:13   #9
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Your aux fan is fitted wrongly(direction of rotation).
The aux fan is fitted between the grill and the radiator, and it blows air towards the outside.
So when vehicle is slow, it can effectively draw air from the radiator and blow it outside. At speed, it basically is fighting against the wind.
So what you need to do is that ensure that the fans are fitted in this fashion
1. Radiator fan, between engine and radiator - This fan should blow air on the engine
2. Aux fan, between grill and radiator - This fan should blow air from the outside on the radiator.
Get this done, and everything will be okay
Dear Friend,
Obviously both the fans are throwing inwards. The aux fan is to cool the heat exchanger by thowing air into/thru it and the electric fan between engine and radiator sucks air thru the radiator shroud. Both working perfect, and come on when the AC is on irrespective of engine temperature and the engine cooling fan comes on once the engine reaches working temperature, without AC on also. Checked the pump and cap etc all seems perfect. Only thing left is the thermostat, but why should that be a problem when the main fan does come on once the engine reaches 80*C. Will have to get an expert to try out the car and diagnose, Is there someone on Tbhp who can help?
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 11:32   #10
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,491
Thanked: 6,768 Times
Default

Scooby: What size compressor you are running?
Jaggu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 11:40   #11
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,852
Thanked: 15,406 Times
Default

Ok, since you have verified that the fans are throwing air as they should, I think problem lies elsewhere. As to why this problem happens only above 50kmph, I am stumped.
Can you do this experiment.
Disconnect the "aux" fan. Then drive above 50 and see what happens.
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 12:10   #12
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
Scooby: What size compressor you are running?
Boss, As the car doesnt Heat in slow traffic with AC on, how does the size of compressor matter, though we have a sanden 507 on her fitted by millenium motors, the pune maruti dealers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Ok, since you have verified that the fans are throwing air as they should, I think problem lies elsewhere. As to why this problem happens only above 50kmph, I am stumped.
Can you do this experiment.
Disconnect the "aux" fan. Then drive above 50 and see what happens.
How will this Help? and should i run with AC on without aux fan? I dont think we will get an answer. I am stumped too and thats why this thread.
I will probably change the engine oil, and also the coolant and radiator cap and check this weekend , since my car is in Khandala.
Any other suggestions are welcome.
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 12:39   #13
BHPian
 
Amar82's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Ludhiana
Posts: 290
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

I agree with TSK1979, there is definately mis-match of fan rotation. I would strongly suggest that if you disconnect the aux electric fan and run your gypsy on highway the problem will be vice versa.
Amar82 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 12:53   #14
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,105
Thanked: 83 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amar82 View Post
I agree with TSK1979, there is definately mis-match of fan rotation. I would strongly suggest that if you disconnect the aux electric fan and run your gypsy on highway the problem will be vice versa.
I put a piece of cardboard on the grill and it stayed there with the suction of the aux fan! I held a piece near the water pump and the inside fan was throwing it towards the engine. Does this explain that the fans are rotating in the right directions?
My question remains, what could be causing the extra load on engine in higher RPM that causes the heating?
scooby05 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 13:08   #15
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,852
Thanked: 15,406 Times
Default

If your car is at slow speed in first gear(high rpm)? Does this problem come?
If so, it means that the cooling system is not adequate.
Reasons could be many
1. some blockage in the radiator
2. Lower capacity of the radiator
3. May need a stronger fan.

Also remove the "Thermostat valve". Its called the winter valve. Removing it will mean more water circulation. I remember in old 800s, removing this valve used to solve overheating in extreme summers with AC. Its also called the "summer valve" in local lingo.
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Virus problems/spyware problems! post here! SirAlec Gadgets, Computers & Software 10 16th July 2014 00:05
Mahindra Scorpio CRDE 2007 - Problems 'n' Problems chandrda Technical Stuff 3 13th November 2009 09:59
Heating & oil pressure problems on MM550 wayfarer 4x4 Technical 24 2nd October 2008 18:30
Power Steering and Over heating Problems In my Sierra sag_kv Technical Stuff 8 9th May 2008 12:42


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 09:44.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks