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Old 6th November 2010, 01:29   #16
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Chengappa, that seemed like a trick question. You being a Coorgi, I will assume that your knowledge of jeeps is above average and hence will also assume that you know that a MDI3200 engine is relatively new.
I am sure you also know that the 3 speed T90 was discontinued a whole lot before the MDI3200 was introduced.
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Old 6th November 2010, 08:05   #17
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@chenappa:

3-Speed came only with the MDI2500 and maybe the MDI3000 (not sure of this). Once the MDI3200 was introduced, it always had the 4-Speed KMT90.
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Old 6th November 2010, 21:43   #18
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@jyobeb

I sincerely didnít mean it as a trick question; it seems you have a good acquaintance with Coorgsí and The Land of JEEPS. Iím as you guessed well verse with the CJ/CL/MM series, but have a lot to learn from a veteran like you in doing engine swaps and extreme upgrades. Will be sending you a PM shortly.

@4X4addict

Thank you once again for the info, what would be a fair price to pay for a used MDI3200 engine in reasonable condition? If you donít mind could you mention the cost involved for procuring the MDI3200TC and NGT520?

Chengappa.
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Old 7th November 2010, 08:01   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timson View Post
@4X4addict

Thank you once again for the info, what would be a fair price to pay for a used MDI3200 engine in reasonable condition? If you don’t mind could you mention the cost involved for procuring the MDI3200TC and NGT520?

Chengappa.
MDI3200 should be available in the range of 50K. MDI3200TC will cost anywhere from 80K to 1Lakh depending on the condition. NGT520 with 4WD T-Case is extremely hard to find as it was launched only in 2007 or so. Hence not many end up in the scrap yard. My understanding is that a 2WD NGT520/NGT530 can be converted to 4WD by buying an adapter plate and changing the back cover of the gearbox. However, sourcing 4WD components from Mahindra is harder than getting a dinner date with Mr. Anand Mahindra.
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Old 10th November 2010, 08:49   #20
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Default XYLO D2 CRDe Engine

Hi Folks,

As you know, I have the DI Turbo Engine in my jeep with the 4.27 axle ratio. It makes good torque and is fine in city and rural kerala roads where you cannot go beyond 60 kmph. However, I took a few highway trips and the beyond 90/100 kmph the engine is really stressed. I know the DI Turbo range runs the 3.73 ratio but I don't want to change the ratio and give up on Torque.

From what I understand the 2.5 CRDe engine that is in the Bolero Storm, Regular XYLO and Thar will foul with the front differentials when you have solid axles. However, the XYLO D2 engine is basically a CRD version of the DI Turbo engine. Hence, I am thinking that this will not cause issues with the front diffs.

There is a Safari 2.2 VVTI engine available in Chennai. However, I would prefer to stick with a Mahindra engine from an insurance risk standpoint.

Would like to hear your thoughts on this?
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Old 10th November 2010, 10:21   #21
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stay away from tata 2.2 as it must be from first lot of 2.2 engines which are less reliable. (our friends safari 2.2 engine was changed twice in warranty)

the xylo d2 is a good option but there few of them.
lets hear what what gurus have to say about xylo d2 engine.

Last edited by jeepster : 10th November 2010 at 10:23.
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Old 10th November 2010, 15:58   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post

From what I understand the 2.5 CRDe engine that is in the Bolero Storm, Regular XYLO and Thar will foul with the front differentials when you have solid axles.
In some engines where space is a problem they simply move the oil sump elsewhere and retain a small sump around the crankshaft. Then they move oil from the relocated sump to the small sump at the crankshaft via the oil pump.

You would have to:

1.) chop down to size an existing oil pan cover (American term for it)
2.) come up with a sump (just a container) for the oil.
3.) assure that you have good oil flow around the oil circuit.

Simple in concept, but maybe difficult to do in India.
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Old 29th December 2010, 11:05   #23
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Default KMT90 is Dead

Hi folks,

The 4WD Pickup that I booked for the estate has reached the dealer at Kottayam. As spike had mentioned in another thread the KMT90 is dead. BSIII norms has forced Mahindra to upgrade technology again. The pick up now comes with the NGT520/T-18 combo. All the changes to the engine/gearbox combo from Mahindra have been driven mostly by BS requirements, including upgrade from 3 to 4 and now 5 Speed gearbox. Not to mention the upgrade from MDI2500 to 3200TC.
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Old 29th December 2010, 22:15   #24
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

congrats !!

please post a detailed report with pictures.
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Old 7th February 2011, 12:28   #25
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

Jeepers,

A few questions:

1) How do I differentiate a NGT 520 from a NGT 530 when I see one? I was at the local kabadi market and I couldn't figure out how to differentiate. Does the model year by itself help?
2) Does the T-18 transfer case fit to both the 520 and 530 gearboxes?
3) If there was a choice between the T-18 and the Borg Warner T/C, is there a reason to choose one over the other?
4) Does the Scorpio 2.6 Turbo Chain drive engine mate with both the 520 and 530 gearboxes?

Thanks
Adi
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Old 7th February 2011, 13:35   #26
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

Quote:
Originally Posted by AVR View Post
Jeepers,

A few questions:

1) How do I differentiate a NGT 520 from a NGT 530 when I see one? I was at the local kabadi market and I couldn't figure out how to differentiate. Does the model year by itself help?
2) Does the T-18 transfer case fit to both the 520 and 530 gearboxes?
3) If there was a choice between the T-18 and the Borg Warner T/C, is there a reason to choose one over the other?
4) Does the Scorpio 2.6 Turbo Chain drive engine mate with both the 520 and 530 gearboxes?
Hi Adi,

The NGT520 is basically BA10/5 internals inside a Cast Iron Housing. (Red)

The NGT530 uses the BA10/5 Aluminium Housing (Silver)except the Intermediate Housing.

The BA10/5 used an adapter plate (Borg-Warner Adapter Plate) to adapt the B-W T-Case.

AFAIK These Two can be used on the NGT520 & NGT530, also the NGT520 used the T-18 with the B-W Type Shifter.

Regards,

Arka
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Old 7th February 2011, 15:22   #27
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

Thanks Arka. That's very helpful.

So if I were to skip the Borg-warner and keep the T-18 from my current setup and just pick up a 2.6T engine and the NGT 2wd 5x0 gearbox, I think I have an interesting game on hand

Also, about the 2.6T, There was a chain drive version and a gear drive version right? Any pros and cons of the two? Any issues with the chain drive?

Also, is the Turbo on the 2.6T the same as the turbo on the CrDE? The gurjari guy said the same turbo but I want to make sure.

Last edited by AVR : 7th February 2011 at 15:24. Reason: added question
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Old 9th February 2011, 08:11   #28
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

Quote:
Originally Posted by AVR View Post
3) If there was a choice between the T-18 and the Borg Warner T/C, is there a reason to choose one over the other?
If the engine transplant leads you to Scorpio engines I would recommend BW TC, even T-18 will do but then you will need to do some amount of fabrication with adapter plates. First option will be bolt on. I have some idea in mind, will have to check it out in the assembly line and then update.

Quote:
4) Does the Scorpio 2.6 Turbo Chain drive engine mate with both the 520 and 530 gearboxes?
520 means 5 speed gearbox designed for 20 kgm torque capacity. So decide according to the torque of your engine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AVR View Post

Also, about the 2.6T, There was a chain drive version and a gear drive version right? Any pros and cons of the two? Any issues with the chain drive?

Also, is the Turbo on the 2.6T the same as the turbo on the CrDE? The gurjari guy said the same turbo but I want to make sure.
Noise is the main difference, Chain drive is preferred. Turbo, IIRC is not the same (although looks similar).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ex670c View Post

The NGT530 uses the BA10/5 Aluminium Housing (Silver)except the Intermediate Housing.
In addition to what Arka has said:-

Quote:
The NGT520 is basically BA10/5 internals inside a Cast Iron Housing. (Red)
NGT520 housing is Black and not red as mentioned, bell housing is red, 4 speed KMT had red housing. I will post a comparative pic of 520 and 530 in the evening. Adi is that OK?

Spike
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Old 9th February 2011, 10:56   #29
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

Thanks Spike,

1) If the Borg Warner is a seamless fit then I'll go for that. Only issue is that the one I saw was the electronic shift and not the manual one. I remember some Scorpio in B'lore has it so am assuming that the change is fairly simple? What do you think?

2) It would be really nice if you could post some comparative pictures of the 520 and the 530.

3) If the turbos look similar how do I differentiate the two? I surely can't rely on the gurjari guy's judgement here. Any differences in the Intercooler design?

So summing up, Does an old 540 have the required wheel base to handle the 2.6T engine mated with the NGT530 and the Borg Warner transfer case? *Drooling *

Thanks Spike!
Adi
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Old 9th February 2011, 18:36   #30
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Default Re: M&M Engines and Gearbox combos for JEEPs

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR View Post
NGT520 housing is Black and not red as mentioned
Just noticed today, apart from black housing there are 520s with red housing also, need to check what is the exact difference between the two. Basic structure looks the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AVR View Post

1) If the Borg Warner is a seamless fit then I'll go for that. Only issue is that the one I saw was the electronic shift and not the manual one. I remember some Scorpio in B'lore has it so am assuming that the change is fairly simple? What do you think?
BW with 2.6 Turbo engine will be a direct fit. Someone from Bangalore or Chennai has done this on a BA10 IIRC, if it can be done on a BA10 then no doubt about NGT 530, I would prefer a NGT over a BA10 any day. BW Electric to manual conversion is not recommended, they may work but not worth the effort. These pics must give you some ideas:-

BA10 2WD rear housing and 4wd Aluminium rear housing

M&M Engine and Gearbox combos for JEEPs-ba-10-2wd-rear-housing-4wd-rear-housing-gearbox-side.jpg

T-18 with Aluminium adapter housing

M&M Engine and Gearbox combos for JEEPs-t18-transfer-case-4wd-adapter-housing.jpg

Quote:
2) It would be really nice if you could post some comparative pictures of the 520 and the 530.
I am posting a few pics just for your reference, will post better pictures tomorrow.

520 Name:  520.jpg
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Size:  20.8 KB

530 Name:  530.jpg
Views: 5896
Size:  36.8 KB

Quote:
3) If the turbos look similar how do I differentiate the two? I surely can't rely on the gurjari guy's judgement here. Any differences in the Intercooler design?
Turbocharger for DI turbo 2.6 and 2.6 CRDe are the same, so is the Intercooler, turbocharger is different for M2DI.

Quote:
Does an old 540 have the required wheel base to handle the 2.6T engine mated with the NGT530 and the Borg Warner transfer case?
Yes, 540 has the Wheelbase (e.g. Thar), you will have to work with a good fabricator for Transmission and engine mounts, cross members etc, chassis strengthening is strongly recommended as the power and torque are almost getting doubled.

Spike

PS- If you are not changing the wheelbase with this combination (NEF + NGT 530 + BW TC), you will also need a smaller rear propeller shaft.

Last edited by SPIKE ARRESTOR : 9th February 2011 at 18:42. Reason: add info
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