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Old 17th September 2010, 15:47   #1
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Talking Project, Onboard air compressor & battery charger.

Dear All , for so many years I was looking for some solution to inflate tyres en route . I wanted a reliable source of compressed air .

In the mean while many years back , I saw a pic & an artical in Four wheeler mag ( Jan 1994 ) about a custom made equipment . there was an vehicular alternator mounted in a frame & driven by a small 2 hp petrol engine . This artical described it as a portable Battery charger .

The Idea got fixed in my mind & I decided to make one for myself . I also added My Idea of including a small air compressor to that .

Till now I was on the lookout of such thing but nothing is available in the market .

There are small ac 230 v gensets available ( I have one by honda 650 va ) but no 12 v dc gen set .
there are 12 v dc air compressors available ( also engine run compressors ) but no battery charger .

Air compressor running on engine means complicated mountings in tight space & also need battery in condition to activate its clutch .

Air compressor running on battery means more load ( 25 amps ) & it will not run for some longer period , also battery dependancy .

So I have drawn a conclusion that this unit will have following advantages
1) A totally separate source to charge battery.
2) also compressed Air .
3) total portability , not fixed to one vehicle .
4) can be used at my home work shop
5) no dependancy on either vehicle engine or battery

The disadvantages
1) will consume cabin space & add load ( 30 kg estimated )
2) need to carry petrol & kerosine ( that is required for my stove too )
3) will not be running when on move ( can be made possible but difficult )

I will be using a 2 hp petrol start ( or even run safely ) kerosine run Greaves engine , that weighs 12 kgs.

I request all of you to share your views , or show disadvantages ,or even Challange the basic Idea.

your replies are Important to me .

Sudarshan
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Old 17th September 2010, 15:55   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sudarshan View Post
..or even Challange the basic Idea
Dear Sudarshan,

Why all this trouble in the 1st place, when you get the chinese made 12V powered portable air compressors? Yes, they may take upto 15Minutes to inflate a 215/75 section jeep tyre from Zero PSI.

thx
san
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Old 17th September 2010, 16:04   #3
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We use 12 V Portable Air Compressors almost every week after a run in desert. We are down to 14 psi and do not inflate to 30 or so psi. Just something around 20 - 25 so that drive comfortably upto next service station. Occassionally we have to fill from Zero psi when we have a tyre pop out.

Never had any problem except burnt fingers if handled carelessly after use.
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Old 17th September 2010, 16:04   #4
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Dear Sudarshan,

Why all this trouble in the 1st place, when you get the chinese made 12V powered portable air compressors? Yes, they may take upto 15Minutes to inflate a 215/75 section jeep tyre from Zero PSI.

thx
san
Dear Santosh , forget the chinese ,I was about to put a 12v dc ARB compressor ( could be mounted in car ),comes with full wiring & switching .

But then Battery dependancy ( I already have a winch to drain it & will need an alternator upgrade for that ) it becomes too much .

Also as I said where can I get a battery charger ( if I find the battery low after camping )

anyways getting into trouble & comming out of it is 4X4 ,dont you think so ?

thanks

Sudarshan

Last edited by Sudarshan : 17th September 2010 at 16:06.
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Old 17th September 2010, 16:13   #5
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^^ Sudarshan, Now I understand what you are trying to address. I think since you have a LWB Landy (right?), you wont loose out on much space and the weight gain is negligible. Have you tried a diesel powered (greaves/lombardini) genset + compressor combo. I dont know if one exists, but I am trying to highlight anything to avoid kerosene/petrol inside a vehicle. Also with some more mods, you can also draw fuel from the stock fuel tank and lessen risk of spillage/fires.
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Old 17th September 2010, 16:37   #6
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Originally Posted by svsantosh View Post
^^ Sudarshan, Now I understand what you are trying to address. I think since you have a LWB Landy (right?), you wont loose out on much space and the weight gain is negligible. Have you tried a diesel powered (greaves/lombardini) genset + compressor combo. I dont know if one exists, but I am trying to highlight anything to avoid kerosene/petrol inside a vehicle. Also with some more mods, you can also draw fuel from the stock fuel tank and lessen risk of spillage/fires.
Dear Santosh , I thought about that & seen it also . Very bulky.
Though I will have it in my next ( dream) project - a camper on Tata S truck.( 4x4 ) or the leyland stalion .

have a loook at my engine choice & compressor ( ex truck )
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also the whole unit should look neat & tight like this 650 va set I have .
Project, Onboard air compressor & battery charger.-4bhpsend.jpg

Sudarshan

P.S. There is one important factor ,engines run for a long long time then dc motors ( like in portable units they get hot & that is bad for magnets ) .
this is another reason I opted to a gen set then Inverter at my house. ( long running time of engine )

Last edited by Sudarshan : 17th September 2010 at 16:46.
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Old 17th September 2010, 23:10   #7
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Dear Sudarshan,
I perfectly got idea what you want, infact similar setup am planning for my doublecab 4X4 for camping etc. Please access link below,please reply back as me too planning same. regret weight is on higher side but functionality is awesome.

Honda Gensets, Water Pump, Engines, Lawn Mowers & Brush Cutters

Best Regards



would like to add further,have you considered dual output alternator? One output will power the veh battery and other can be used to power inverter battery. Use inverter power to powerup your numerous gadgets. Regret I've not done it as I personally would opt for genset combo.

Many foreign vehicles have dual battery system and powering up second battery is done by this setup. As regards your query on battery charger, you do get stepdown transformers and hook it up to DC to AC convertor available on Ebay for about 1500 bucks.

Last edited by Grace : 17th September 2010 at 23:23. Reason: grammatical error and avoid back to back post
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Old 17th September 2010, 23:35   #8
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Attach the CD TVS unit with a PTO point in the vehicle, if you don't have a PTO gearbox in the vehicle try experimenting how to achieve it. Honestly speaking, I have a plan to do this setup in my Jeep and got PTO gear box and from last to last week I have already initiated search for suitable compressor which could sit between the chassis rails under the body.

My bro powertwin in helping me in designing and creating my required equipment, may be by now he has some parts sourced for me.
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Old 18th September 2010, 00:11   #9
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Nice thread. I have plans to build a gen set as well, wanted to couple a hero Honda splender engine to an alternator. But then need to work out the cost, if I could buy a Honda gen set with same power rating at a lower cost, then why the hassle!

Last edited by GrayBerry : 18th September 2010 at 00:12.
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Old 18th September 2010, 09:46   #10
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@ Grace , I have seen the Honda range but no compressors ( up to 2 hp ). I have two units of gensets already a 650 va ( in above pic ) & a 2.4 kva.
Now this 650 va ( ebk 1000 ) fits in crate measuring L 24"X W 16" X H 19" . I bought it for portability , I can run a 350 watt mixer/grinder on that but havent run a compressor of half hp .

Any ways thease are only gen sets of 230 v , I need something to charge battery & an air compressor in the middle of Nowhere .I need this to work even if the car engine is not running.

I havent seen a dual output alternator , are you talking about the split charger /battery isolater ? this thing charges the battery first which cranks the engine & after that is fully charged it charges another battery which bears all other load . But this setup again depends on vehicle engine & its alternator .

@ trammway, L R PTOs are difficult to find & costlier too , I thought that option for a winch also . Again this compressor will be run on vehicle engine . If one needs to run it on engine there are two options 1) a belt driven on the block or 2) taking a drive from front end of the crank shaft ( difficult to workout on point of alignment ). In addition to that a engage/disengage mechanism ( clutch ) needs to be installed.

even Jeep pto's are hard to get ( tell me a source & cost ,I want one )

@ GrayBerry I thought that too , the problems
1) runs well on Petrol only
2) No forced air cooling if kept stationary
3) 100 cc means 1 hp , insufficient
4) No separate engine , it is coupled with the gb so a bulky package
Initially I was thinking about a two stroke engine of M 80 ,it could have been cheaper. Also you need to find a good condition Honda bike engine at cheaper rates . Only cheaper option is to find a Kinetic honda two stroke engine & cut the transmission side at a proper spot ,but again spares are going to be a problem in longer run .

All and All the need is of a 12 v battery charger & a Compressor to do its duty in Jungle .

Sudarshan
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Old 18th September 2010, 13:54   #11
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Have you considered a solar charger for the battery?

No need for extra fuel!
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Old 19th September 2010, 10:49   #12
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solar chargers are too heavy and then there is the problem of mounting without affecting CoG. 2 heavy panels on the roof on an already high-strung vehicle is not going to be good for its dynamics.

I am guessing it would less of an issue with a Landy than with my light-weight Gypsy.
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Old 19th September 2010, 13:19   #13
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Solar is a good idea but in theory ,as far as automobile is concerned its not practicle.

Important factors why Solar is a no no to auto

1) cost in relation to output.
2) Area (pannel) Vs. output in wattage
3) now weight ,
4) consume the area of roof rack ( optional, for long journeys & light load )

Solar is effective as long term investment ,& where area + weight is not an Issue, that is on the Terace of your house .

Sudarshan
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Old 20th September 2010, 15:06   #14
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bulky and fixed on the roof?

You may want to take a look at these.

I dont have any experince with this, other than the google/youtube knowledge.

4XFORUM.COM - The Comprehensive 4X4 Information Portal[_id]=365

will this cost more than a petrol driven charger /or a pto charger ?
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Old 21st September 2010, 11:06   #15
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Hi Sudarshan,

Found this site which has loads of stuff for all kinds of Outdoor Activities & also has some 15-20 different kinds of onboard chargers & Inverters for automobiles - Cabela's Official Website - Quality Hunting, Fishing, Camping and Outdoor Gear at competitive prices.

Regards,
Kumar
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