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Old 26th June 2011, 22:48   #91
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

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Originally Posted by Ragul View Post
Good thought.

Commonsense tells me repairing/replacing the windows/parts for an existing market popular vehicle will be easy for the owners after a mishap. Think 10+ year lifecycle. Are you folks willing to stock beadings and glass/acrylic for your customers for a decade or longer? Are you folks prepared to supply repair components anywhere in India at short notice without delay for a crashed vehicle? Or will the owner have to wait weeks to source his replacement parts?
I think he mentioned that he is getting safety glass cut to size and using free size beading, which a potential buyer should be able to source just as easily.

When you stand to face such delays and problems with the rest of the half baked vehicle from the manufacturer itself, is it not asking too much from these guys?

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Or are you folks only thinking of a local clientele?

Decisions like these might impact sales and marketability of your product.

--Ragul
Quote:
Originally Posted by manasm View Post

The deal with the wife is - "if you can get a hard top and A/C, you can buy a Thar"...that's where this whole thing started. So until the top is complete, no Thar! :(
His primary client. Unfortunately for him, he has to do the manufacturer's job and try to do it profitably while helping out other enthusiasts. Kudos to that, I say. Problems are solvable. Keep the spirit.

@manasm, cant really think of any existing vehicle window that would fit. Havent really looked hard from a transplant perspective to be honest. Maybe if you can cut the window to an existing model shape/size for the future?

I have heard of an acrylic called Crystal which is supposed to be scratch resistant, but will still suffer from hazing with age. If you can design them to be replaceable panels, perhaps. Just bouncing ideas.

Cheers.
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Old 26th June 2011, 22:57   #92
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

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Originally Posted by manasm View Post

The deal with the wife is - "if you can get a hard top and A/C, you can buy a Thar"...that's where this whole thing started. So until the top is complete, no Thar! :(
Quote:
Originally Posted by gthang View Post


His primary client. Unfortunately for him, he has to do the manufacturer's job and try to do it profitably while helping out other enthusiasts. Kudos to that, I say. Problems are solvable. Keep the spirit.
Ah I see, something like this ...

BEFORE:

Father-In-Law : "Show me that you have a roof above your head and you can marry my daughter ... "

AFTER:

Wife: "Show me that you have a roof for the Thar and I will let you live your dreams ... "

Does it run in the family?

--Ragul

Last edited by Ragul : 26th June 2011 at 23:10.
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Old 27th June 2011, 21:42   #93
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

I think what most Rally Gypsies run in the rear glass area is the Maruti 800 rear glass, that one is easy, the trick is to get the sides. I think you should be looking at Tavera / Innova / SUMO side windows, openable, not removeable, and most importantly AVAILABLE



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Old 29th June 2011, 11:59   #94
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

here some pictures of thar top. (looks like metal top)

Quote:
complete package was around 1.6 L it included, hardtop, front and rear bumper set in new deisgn, A/c, Power windows, 2DIN pioneer music system with DVD and BT, complete interiors including seats, LCD screen, Console between seats and a little more
Thar Hardtop Design-1.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-2.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-3.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-4.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-5.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-6.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-7.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-8.jpg

Thar Hardtop Design-9.jpg
source: facebook.com by Shiva Nag
metal top.
Thar Hardtop Design-10.jpg

source: facebook.com

Last edited by jeepster : 29th June 2011 at 12:03.
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Old 29th June 2011, 17:24   #95
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
here some pictures of thar top. (looks like metal top)
Looks good. Any way to find who made this and where.

nnn
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Old 30th June 2011, 02:17   #96
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

Pictures of the Armadillo fitting...

Some problems with the rear seats coming in the way. the back rests do not allow the top to seat properly in the back. Once the seats come out - the top will fit.
The rear door is still a slight problem and we are now doing away with the glass on sides and rear - will now be poly carb sheets with 3M film over it to make it scratch resistant.

The top still needs paint and internal work done - but we are getting closer...
Attached Images
      

Last edited by manasm : 30th June 2011 at 02:23.
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Old 30th June 2011, 10:36   #97
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

The top seems to have come out quite nice. The only suggestion I have is that the rear glass angle could have been a little less, would facilitate better headroom. Look forward to the finished product. I am not with you on the same page as far as the acrylic sheet goes. Coz even the best will develop cracks after continuous exposure to the sun. Automotive grade glass is the best option. Could you look at the rear glass of the Gypsy hard top as an option, think that should work.

In the pics posted by Jeepster The red one looks to have been done well. The glass area on the sides could have been lesser though. I see no need for things like a 2DIN audio / video and those "beige interiors" look quite out of place in a THAR. I'd be way happier with Army kind of printed seat covers in canvas or just plain black or dark grey with a piping to match the colour of the vehicle. Front facing seats are good. Carpeting is big no for any "Jeep".

The other picture with the silver thar is not to my liking at all, the spoiler kind of thing is totally out of sync with the THAR




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Last edited by Ricky_63 : 30th June 2011 at 10:46.
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Old 30th June 2011, 11:43   #98
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

Ricky - Thanks - we like the looks of the top as well!

Will look at what we can do regarding the glass vs poly carb - changing the size of the glass now will require a re-design of the rear door - but I think it is something we might have to do. Will look a the Gypsy rear glass

The headroom is something we need to look at as well, but I think that problem will be solved with the change in design of rear seats. At this moment, when the top is on, there is just about head room for a 5'8" person in the rear with the side facing bench seats. The forward facing seats will be lower than the side facing ones. We like the way the side windows look, so don't want to change that - it will also be too expensive to change in the mould anyway. We think the angle makes it look more aggressive and sporty!

We like the rear door (really well designed and built) of the red top posted by Jeepster - but I think the interiors are horrible. No offense to anyone, its just my opinion! We don't like the silver Thar top either - makes the Thar look like a minivan I think.

We plan on having vinyl interiors - in black, grey, beige, red, brown and green - should be easy to clean with a wet cloth only.

We are also working on a car seat cover with pockets which will match the interior colors of the top - once that is done, will post pics - don't know if anyone is interested, but I know I want one.

Thanks,
Manas

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricky_63 View Post
The top seems to have come out quite nice. The only suggestion I have is that the rear glass angle could have been a little less, would facilitate better headroom. Look forward to the finished product. I am not with you on the same page as far as the acrylic sheet goes. Coz even the best will develop cracks after continuous exposure to the sun. Automotive grade glass is the best option. Could you look at the rear glass of the Gypsy hard top as an option, think that should work.

In the pics posted by Jeepster The red one looks to have been done well. The glass area on the sides could have been lesser though. I see no need for things like a 2DIN audio / video and those "beige interiors" look quite out of place in a THAR. I'd be way happier with Army kind of printed seat covers in canvas or just plain black or dark grey with a piping to match the colour of the vehicle. Front facing seats are good. Carpeting is big no for any "Jeep".

The other picture with the silver thar is not to my liking at all, the spoiler kind of thing is totally out of sync with the THAR




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Old 30th June 2011, 14:11   #99
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

Hi Manas,

Good job my friend; I like your spirit in getting this done - many crib but few create an oppurtunity out of it.

I was a silent spectator until I saw your pics; it is indeed shaping up well and all the best on the remaining job at hand.

Few inputs from myside-
Exterior:
I have done the EXACT same job to my Invader couple of years back; the difference is, my top was made of sheet metal and was much heaver and welded into the body.
We used automotive glass custom cut for the windows - due to the strength of the sheet metail frame, it has easily taken the weight. We've stuck the glass on to the side windows (similar to Innova's rear corner window). Problems I've faced post modification - even after repeated requests cabin rear vents were missed-off and closing the door with the windows-up was a problem because of the arrested air inside the cabin (i was silently proud that I've used some superior interiors to make the cabin QUITE..i've struck dynamat, several coats of ceramic paint and Wyeth pads all over!!). The flip side, I had to use a bit of force to close my front 2 doors everytime I locked my cabin - this has created gaps between the side window frame and the glass; and at one point I can easily put my finger between them...and later rattled and I had to re-fix it again (i've used the best adhesives available but still..they wear off because of poor design)please check the new tavera's rear corner windows, it comes with an inner rubber beading with a solid clamp and it works well...the complete set can be readily available from any chevy spares shop.

I see that you are satisfied with the side window shape (they are indeed good); i would have prefered rear windows with the same height as the front glass..while you install the glass/poly carb, please add beading to make the arrangement long lasting and rattle-proof...and should contain the cooling from expelling and the dust from entering the cabin.

Seating - I used a brand new Innova's double folding (pilot seats) and I've fixed in the place of the co-driver seat; this enable 'easy' entries and exits. I've fixed a maruti omni middle bench as my rear seat which already has seat-belts...it was spacious and compact cabin..I've adjusted the bench height and the recline as per my taste...to make it comfortable for long drives..

Just wanted to share my thoughts so that this may give you some clues..

Thanks
your potencial customer
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Old 30th June 2011, 15:32   #100
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

Invader - Thanks for the input - very useful for us and something to think about - never thought about the air trapping inside the cabin at all!

Our top would be bolted on to the shell - not welded - so should have a bit more flex I think and should allow some air escape - although there will be rubber in between!

The problem with automotive glass we have is that the cutting is not being done correctly and we have some rough edges - would love to get the number of the guy you used.

The other problem is that safety glass cannot be drilled and will not come with holes - so mounting points for the side glasses cannot be built into the glass...hence poly carb - we have found a manufacturer who will supply poly carb with a 5 to 10 year crack/decolorization guarantee. The FRP frame has no problem with the weight of the glass. We are using a soft beading for the FRP and a hard rubber beading for the glass - when they meet, should provide a solid seal. The side glass will be completely removable and will be latched onto the FRP. Never thought about rear cabin vents - but will probably be a useful thing to add. Just need to figure out how to keep it waterproof.

As far as the interiors - we plan to use Dynamat and pads as well (don't know the brand we will use but will check out Wyeth).

We wanted to have the same height windows for the rear sides but did not have the Thar with us to measure correctly, so we have estimated what it would be and come up with this. It is too late to change the size/shape now since everything has been done in the mould already.

We are trying to fabricate, since I do not want to use Innova seats - they are quite heavy - we want the machine to stay as light as possible, but still be comfortable. So, seat fabrication is the next step - hopefully should not take as long as the top, since it will be tubing, cushion and fabric only. Just need the right mounting points for the bed of the Thar.

We should be able to use the same seat for the co-passenger, driver and 2 rear. Will be built as 2 seats which when joined together will work as a bench - kind of like the rear seats of the Yeti - which I loved!

We are also trying to get some seat covers done - will post pics later - am actually on holiday right now - but can't stay away from team-bhp - much to my wife's irritation!
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Old 30th June 2011, 16:16   #101
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

I think Invader has made some very pertinent points. As for the design of the cabin, the rear angle, it is beginning to grow on me already. Maybe it will look nice once firmly in place, but the headroom issue should be addressed. Remember very low rear seat (as in the Endy) are very uncomfortable, as your knees would be at an uncomfortable angle, which can be a huge pain over longish drives.

Waiting for the process to move forward.



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Old 30th June 2011, 23:08   #102
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

I like what's been done to the maroon Thar, although the finish of the Italian hard top (shown earlier on the black Thar) is better. Somehow, when you want something that looks like a Wrangler, doesn't make sense settling for the Jugaad look, where the finish has tell-tale marks of a garage product.

But it is a truly laudable effort, guys. Manasm, waiting for finished pics of the hard top you are designing. I, personally, would wait for Mahindra to give the hard top, a/c, and front-facing seats as standard. The side steps should make way for offroading bull bars in matte black and the Bridgestone H/Ts should be replaced with Bighorn Maxxis or BF Goodrich M/T tyres to complete the jeep look.

Frankly, what I see here doesn't really make me sit up and drool...but the Wrangler Sahara definitely does.

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Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
This is REDMM340's jeep with steel hardtop. I like its shape. I would also like a robust carrier rack on top like this.

But, to me, this top has visibilty, symetry and continuity with the JEEP retro look.
Completely agree with Dirty Dan on this. This hard top has no Mayapuri touches and looks like a natural part of the jeep. Why don't we find out who fabricated this? Much neater (and the white top makes it even classier).
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Old 1st July 2011, 02:17   #103
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

Hey Oreen - Thanks. Will post the finished pics of the once done...hope in the next couple of weeks! And hope that it does not look like a jugaad/garage project. Lets see!

After a couple of conversations with Mahindra, I wouldn't hold my breath for a hard top. But that's just the impression I got. That's why I started building this on my own.

Would have loved to have a Sahara type look, but like I said before, the construction of the Wrangler is completely different from the Thar...especially the B pillar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oreen View Post
I like what's been done to the maroon Thar, although the finish of the Italian hard top (shown earlier on the black Thar) is better. Somehow, when you want something that looks like a Wrangler, doesn't make sense settling for the Jugaad look, where the finish has tell-tale marks of a garage product.

But it is a truly laudable effort, guys. Manasm, waiting for finished pics of the hard top you are designing. I, personally, would wait for Mahindra to give the hard top, a/c, and front-facing seats as standard. The side steps should make way for offroading bull bars in matte black and the Bridgestone H/Ts should be replaced with Bighorn Maxxis or BF Goodrich M/T tyres to complete the jeep look.

Frankly, what I see here doesn't really make me sit up and drool...but the Wrangler Sahara definitely does.



Completely agree with Dirty Dan on this. This hard top has no Mayapuri touches and looks like a natural part of the jeep. Why don't we find out who fabricated this? Much neater (and the white top makes it even classier).
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Old 1st July 2011, 10:21   #104
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
here some pictures of thar top. (looks like metal top)....
The design of the 1st hardtop is really good. Just a little bit of angle at the rear and it would have been just perfect.

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Originally Posted by nnn View Post
Looks good. Any way to find who made this and where.
nnn
Looks like it has been done at Bimbra @ Gurgaon. These guys are pretty famous for their soft top and upholstery jobs. But seeing a hardtop 1st time from their stable. Though like any quality work, Bimbra's charges are pretty high.

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Originally Posted by manasm View Post
Pictures of the Armadillo fitting.......The top still needs paint and internal work done - but we are getting closer...
1st of all congrats for being able to make a real life prototype. I too really salute your patience & spirit to go all the way to convert the thoughts and designs into reality. Its indeed a very rare kind of an achievement.
Though, personally, as few others have also mentioned, the equal straight line from front to rear and a little less angle at the rear shape could have made this look even better. Nevertheless, with a proper finishing, i think this is going to look pretty good and with mass production, price will also be lesser compared to those one-off kind of job.
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Old 1st July 2011, 20:00   #105
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Default Re: Thar Hardtop Design

@manasm

Your effort is commendable & to be honest the rake at the rear is growing on me BUT for the head height clearance !! I am taking the liberty of posting some information of the RED/MAROON THAR HT...I really do hope you do not mind this !! If at all you do (and I respect that) please feel free to have the post deleted.

The red THAR is a Delhi vehicle & has been done at Bimbra in Gurgaon. I am visiting them in a day or so to find out what it is all about. The top is in sheet metal. Roll Bars have been removed !! That is an area of concern though. I would like to retain the roll cage & yet have the THAR with AC & a HT....No beige interiors for me.

Let us see how it goes.




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Last edited by Ricky_63 : 1st July 2011 at 20:04.
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