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Old 6th June 2011, 11:31   #76
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
[b][u]As far as AC is concerned, I am just trying to help you and provide clarity. Can somebody please tell me how to upload an excel sheet?
The excel sheet can be uploaded just like any image. The file size should be less than 3.00 MB.
Or I can upload it for you if you mail it to me.
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Old 6th June 2011, 13:34   #77
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
I also love off roading, which is why I made this vehicle in the first place. There is nothing which prohibits me from being an avid off roader. As far as AC is concerned,
@DB Sir: Will you please honour us with your august presence with an off road group in my city? We can explore THAR, AC etc in person.

I am surprised THAR is yet to make its official presence in chennai and I have "my friend" tell me about product launch etc etc.

We can have an off road together and then decide whether we require AC or not and other points of interest / conflict!

Welcome
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Old 6th June 2011, 13:38   #78
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
However, I totally disagree to your second statement. All our systems and processes revolve around the single most important entity for us, which is you as the customer. If this was not true, I would not be on this forum.

if you do, you will only hammer me one more time for nothing. I am on this forum because, apart from getting an opportunity to interact with all of you, I also love off roading, which is why I made this vehicle in the first place. There is nothing which prohibits me from being an avid off roader.

Can somebody please tell me how to upload an excel sheet?
unfortunately the ground reality is very different for the customers.

do you think i can get the Borg Warner (manual) shifting mechanism before AKC/AXAMM at my local dealer if i order now?. (even pune)
i can order the part as i need one & to prove the ground reality too.
& i always considered you as one of us. (the fact that you work for mm is + point )

i am not talking against you or the Thar.

& for the attaching the XLS file you do it just like we attach the pictures.
just locate the file by the browsing & you are done.
Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar-attachment.jpg

Last edited by jeepster : 6th June 2011 at 13:46.
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Old 6th June 2011, 13:54   #79
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

Despair, despair & more for a Thar customer. What would it take to wake up the Company from deep slumber. Such type of feedback should have reached the Company honchos long ago, what action have they taken! A project like this, an engineering debacle should be scrapped & started afresh. Think this will go the legend way.
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Old 6th June 2011, 23:40   #80
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Nikhil / Jeepster - personally, I will totally agree to your first statement but there is a difference between "Individual" and "Enterprise". M&M is a huge organization which has to abide by its laid down "Systems and Processes". This method of action is for everybody's benefit. You understand?

....

As far as AC is concerned, I am just trying to help you and provide clarity. Can somebody please tell me how to upload an excel sheet?

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Dear Mr. Dhabhar,

I do not know how to upload an Excel sheet.
But there is a way to get around the problem.
Select the cells of the Excel sheet, copy and paste the copied data to Windows Paint.
Save the file as a bmp file, the Excel sheet becomes an image.
Now upload the 'image' as you would upload any other.

Regards,

Bopanna
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Old 7th June 2011, 13:47   #81
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Spitfire - reference your comments above, let me clarify. The desire must of course come from the dealer because he is the interface with the customer.
How does this work? The desire part?

The dealer is free to fit anything he thinks right on to a customer vehicle? What if the above vehicle (TVS fitted AC) crashes and the pistons find a way out. Will Mahindra honor any claims?

If I am such a customer I will go to town blaming the issue on the THAR. I will say Manhindra gave me a machine which is not well engineered. Mahindra does not have the technical know-how to build a vehicle.

Note I will not say the dealer fitted the wrong AC and so I suffered. For a customer like me.

Dealer == Mahindra.

Period.

How can you let the fancy of the dealer override the decision of a company for its own product.

To give you an analogy in Software Products. If a reseller sells our product to customer who is on a wrong platform/Operating System not certified by us. We would even terminate the contract with the reseller.

The reseller would say - so what if you have not certified the change. It WORKS!!. But then that's absurd and we would be hurrying that contract termination.

Our products are complex and used by some of the top firms. Every customer is paying to the tune of a few millions for a single installation.

We cannot afford any of this lethargy of trying out un-certified/unsupported mixes.

Same for the THAR and its AC.

Quote:
If he wants to order the full kit, he is free to do so.
Quote:
The decision is entirely his.
I find these two sentences alarming.

Why does the company not insist that they fit the AC that only they recommend?

Another thing I have noticed, Behram Sir you oppose JUGAAD work of any kind. And always propose the right engineered and tested solution to a customer/enthusiast.

Then why in this case is the company letting JUGAAD being done on their own products?

Quote:
If somebody is doing something else, we do not endorse the same.
Would you act on dealers who are not aligning themselves with the SOP?

And what happens to customers who have already have their vehicles hacked?

OT: I had a PM sometime back from a well wisher.

It was "Why do I bother about THAR, you dont even own one".

My answer: I have only had two vehicles in my life - owned by me.

The Mahindra Classic and the Mahindra Bolero. I am a satisfied customer regarding the product/service/image. I always propose Mahindra products to friends/relatives and even strangers. Only because of the trust I have after using these for about 10+ years.

The AC thing on the THAR gets my goat because this is not the Mahindra I know.
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Old 7th June 2011, 22:53   #82
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
Why does the company not insist that they fit the AC that only they recommend? Another thing I have noticed, Behram Sir you oppose JUGAAD work of any kind. And always propose the right engineered and tested solution to a customer/enthusiast.
Then why in this case is the company letting JUGAAD being done on their own products? Would you act on dealers who are not aligning themselves with the SOP?

OT: I had a PM sometime back from a well wisher. It was "Why do I bother about THAR, you dont even own one". My answer: I have only had two vehicles in my life - owned by me. The Mahindra Classic and the Mahindra Bolero. I am a satisfied customer regarding the product/service/image. I always propose Mahindra products to friends/relatives and even strangers. Only because of the trust I have after using these for about 10+ years. The AC thing on the THAR gets my goat because this is not the Mahindra I know.
Dear Spitfire - Thar CRDe fitted with AC as per SOP is not a "juggad". When I am saying so, please believe me. We have gone through this route (dealer equipped) to help customers stay off the "ABC AC" syndrome which hits such a product as this one with a vengeance. We cannot stop people going to "ABC AC", we cannot stop the "ABC AC" guy from doing roaring business down the local road but we can certainly help people choose wisely / correctly by doing what we have done. Just because we do this, "ABC AC" fellow will not disappear but he will certainly become uncomfortable. We know exactly what he does.

My answer to your O/T comment is - Every time I drive a Thar, "KUCH KUCH HOTA HAI YAAR!". That's it. Someone will again say "self praise' and all that. To them, all I can say is that - WHEN YOU SEE YOUR BABY ON THE ROADS, IT'S A FEELING YOU GET WHICH CANNOT BE DESCRIBED IN WORDS. I thank God that I got an opportunity to create something in my life. I thank M&M who gave me this opportunity. What else do I want? Let's leave it at that. .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Last edited by DHABHAR.BEHRAM : 7th June 2011 at 22:56.
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Old 7th June 2011, 23:58   #83
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Spitfire - Thar CRDe fitted with AC as per SOP is not a "juggad". When I am saying so, please believe me. We have gone through this route (dealer equipped) to help customers stay off the "ABC AC" syndrome which hits such a product as this one with a vengeance. We cannot stop people going to "ABC AC", we cannot stop the "ABC AC" guy from doing roaring business down the local road but we can certainly help people choose wisely / correctly by doing what we have done. Just because we do this, "ABC AC" fellow will not disappear but he will certainly become uncomfortable. We know exactly what he does.
I think what spitfire ids asking what if Mahindra and Mahindra dealer appointed by the company which manufacturers Scorpio, Thar and some other vehicles including tractors, functions like ABC AC and fits an AC like a jugaad, or sends the customer to ABC AC.
In this case what do you recommend?
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Old 8th June 2011, 09:28   #84
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Spitfire - Thar CRDe fitted with AC as per SOP is not a "juggad". When I am saying so, please believe me.
No, please that is not what I meant.

I am saying that the AC fitment being provided to the customers by the dealers is the JUGAAD. Not the one as per your SOP.

Please do read my previous post after clearing this part.

I am sorry if my previous post came out unclear.
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Old 8th June 2011, 16:26   #85
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Spitfire - reference your comments above, let me clarify. The desire must of course come from the dealer because he is the interface with the customer. If he wants to order the full kit, he is free to do so. As 19 parts and 4 fasteners are common with Scorpio / Bolero with no change whatsoever, it is probable that he may already be carrying these parts as inventory in which case he can order only the parts that he wants. The decision is entirely his.

Finally, let me make it very clear that we have indicated to all concerned that AC kit as per SOP and the set of 30 parts only must be fitted. If somebody is doing something else, we do not endorse the same.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Dear Spitfire - my reply to your below query is given in my post no 65 of this thread, quoted here for your ready reference, please.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 8th June 2011, 17:53   #86
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

What I would like to know, is what action does/will M&M take against dealers who fit an AC to the Thar; either themselves or through outsourcing; which does not adhere to their own SOP.

As per Mr Behram's statement AC kit as per SOP and the set of 30 parts only must be fitted. If somebody is doing something else, we do not endorse the same. The owner went to the authorised dealer and got the AC fitted, now what. The poor owner is being penalised for the non professional approach of the Manufacturer's Dealers.

I feel that there has to be a tighter control of what the Dealers can do and what they cannot (else M&M may go the Skoda way). At the same time those whose AC were fitted by the Dealers, outside the SOP should be compensated and AC refitted using the correct procedure.
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Old 8th June 2011, 18:00   #87
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Spitfire - my reply to your below query is given in my post no 65 of this thread, quoted here for your ready reference, please.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Ok so what you are basically saying is we have given the guidance, the details everything required.

But Mahindra have no control over what the dealer actually fits in your THAR.

Am I the only one who thinks that is absurd?
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Old 8th June 2011, 18:39   #88
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

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Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
Ok so what you are basically saying is we have given the guidance, the details everything required.

But Mahindra have no control over what the dealer actually fits in your THAR.

Am I the only one who thinks that is absurd?
Not only absurd, but it borders on unethical practice, especially as they are quite prompt in voiding the warranty for small infringements, but leave the buyers at the mercy of (unscrupulous?) Dealers.

Had it been US, they would be wide open for a lawsuit by now!

Last edited by Aroy : 8th June 2011 at 18:40.
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Old 8th June 2011, 18:49   #89
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

I think further development on Thar has come to a standstill. I won't expect a factory AC job now. The product will probably go the Legend way.

For the ones who come up with the reply "use/drive it & then speak", kindly refer to my Sig.
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Old 8th June 2011, 19:07   #90
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Default Re: Advice on fitting an air-conditioner in the Mahindra Thar

Dear Behram , I still find the team hesitating in sharing the SOP and things what others a asking .Why not make it available to everyone .Make a PDF with write protect and share. Take pictures of installation and publish it . Make a video of it upload it in FTP or YOUTUBE .That should slove all the problems .Give all these to customers who buy thar along with manual .Finally have a option to have it fitted in Factory for peace of mind .
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