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Old 11th August 2011, 21:50   #151
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

i just heard from the dealer selling the one in bombay responding to my question about no claims bonuses, outstanding loans etc. He says the insurance has just expired.

what are the consequences, ramifications of that for me?

Walk away? ask for a huge discount? suck it up and deal with it?

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Originally Posted by akshay1234 View Post
Hey I thought you don't beg dealers
arey yaar, this dealership was very nice to me and really impressed me and I was trying to take the heat off them (even though they are anonymous).

by beg and beseech, I basically meant that I called them 4 times . Once they said they had a new vehicle coming in and to check back in a few days, the next time they said they didn't have a vehicle yet, the third time they said they could arrange for me drive their owner's vehicle as a demo, the 4th time I called to arrange a drive in that vehicle and when I went there and expressed interest in the new unit that was there, it turned out to be the one they had originally said was going to be coming in, but it had already been sold, but since they'd led me believe that they were getting a 200PS unit that I could test drive, they let me take a short drive in it in addition to a drive in their owner's vehicle.

this dealership treated me extremely well and if I buy a new mitsubishi, it WILL be from them.

their treatment of me has been 180 degrees opposite to the treatment I've gotten from Toyota.

Last edited by Harbir : 11th August 2011 at 21:55.
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Old 11th August 2011, 23:15   #152
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
i just heard from the dealer selling the one in bombay responding to my question about no claims bonuses, outstanding loans etc. He says the insurance has just expired.

what are the consequences, ramifications of that for me?

Walk away? ask for a huge discount? suck it up and deal with it?

If the price is right , vehicle condition is as desired, lapse of insurance policy only means you will need to get insurance done yourself. No need to let go of the option if the insurance needs renewal just try to seek some discount if possible to compensate you to an extent for insurance renewal costs . Has the dealer answered your question WRT No Claim Bonus? Even if the insurance policy is no longer valid, you would need to find out if any claims were filed for this vehicle or not by the previous owner. Insist on seeing the insurance history - I would . It may so happen that some minor work may have been done without a claim being filed with the insurers but if any major problem occurs more often than not that is revealed by the NCB history.

Last edited by RS_DEL : 11th August 2011 at 23:17.
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Old 12th August 2011, 16:27   #153
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

i found a couple of 2007s that are local but higher mileage than I want. I've contacted the sellers to look at the cars, see if I even like 2007.

Though I must say all the used vehicles I have looked at, its been through brokers and I am not feeling happy about my interaction with these folks. for one thing, they can't tell you anything about the vehicle's history, the owners experience with it, etc and further all most all of them are shady characters in the sense that they don't bother calling you back, they don't answer their phones, they don't respond to their SMSes and emails, they have a sour attitude when you meet them. Its like their income is assured whether you buy the vehicle from them or not.

all of this is very iffy. and not confidence inspiring at all

does nobody sell their own vehicle themselves anymore?

what happened to the adverts in the sunday paper?
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Old 12th August 2011, 19:05   #154
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Originally Posted by RS_DEL View Post
If the price is right , vehicle condition is as desired, lapse of insurance policy only means you will need to get insurance done yourself. No need to let go of the option if the insurance needs renewal just try to seek some discount if possible to compensate you to an extent for insurance renewal costs . Has the dealer answered your question WRT No Claim Bonus? Even if the insurance policy is no longer valid, you would need to find out if any claims were filed for this vehicle or not by the previous owner. Insist on seeing the insurance history - I would . It may so happen that some minor work may have been done without a claim being filed with the insurers but if any major problem occurs more often than not that is revealed by the NCB history.
As far as I know, the Insurance is given to an individual, and as such not transferable from one owner to another. You can transfer the insurance from one car to another. What it means is that the no claim bonus on one car will not accrue to the new owner, but no claim for your car can be applied to another car owned by you (if you transfer the old car to another name).

Any way, once you buy a vehicle, you have to get the Insurance in your name, so whether the purchased one had any insurance or not is irrelevant. All you have to ensure that when you get the vehicle insured, there should be a survey/evaluation of the current condition of the vehicle, and the insured value certified (else if you lose the vehicle they may pay less than the insured value).

Another thing you must keep in mind is, that the most prevalent insurance format is one where they depreciate value of parts and exclude a lot of glass and rubber parts from repair claims. If you want full claim to be paid then you have to get that type of insurance (at around 2-3 times the normal rate), and very few insurers have those policies.
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Old 12th August 2011, 20:24   #155
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Its like their income is assured whether you buy the vehicle from them or not.
yes , thats the problem with most of the guys in this trade & more so in Real estate business if you happen to look a property , I can understand your situation . Many of these guys are not working hard and are earning because of booming economy in certain segment again partially because of Property boom . Anyone owning a piece of land is a Millionaire and they know these guys will be easy customers for them .

I could manage Test drive today - Asian Motors at Delhi arranged a Car and sent to my office in Gurgaon - this was the first time I drove Montero - this car had abut 33 T on odo but was in very good condition absolutely no rattles or engine sound . From my experience with fortuner Pajero & even X5 & X6 - I found the suspension very good , of-course the body roll was much than beemers but way lower than Pajero or fortuner . This car was automatic and in Auto Modes Gears were indeed slow but not too much , in Manual mode it was much better & one good thing was the Gears were not automatically shifting with increase of speed unlike Beemers which change on there own .

This car has lot of torque - was able to cross road divider about a foot high without any acceleration something i used to do in Pajero very often .

i will advise you to continue your search a little longer - Montero is a very different car and Old pajero is no match for its comfort but this is based on my impression with the new engine .

I will try to arrange finances and if everything goes good shall pay advance on Tuesday . They have assured delivery in about 15 days .

Last edited by Turbanator : 12th August 2011 at 20:27.
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Old 12th August 2011, 20:41   #156
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

if it was a manual, I would be fighting with you to buy it

Shall I call them and ask if they have any manuals in sight?

also, would you mind sharing how much you are paying?

I am getting sorely tempted to fly out to bangalore to check out this '07 that has 25,000km on it.........

but I am not sure I want the pre-face lift model.

THE big hinderance is that I plan to install to an ARB roof rack on the vehicle to carry a couple of spares, a couple of jerry cans of diesel and 40 liters of water (yes I realize its a lot of weight and may exceed the roof's weight capacity, in which case I will carry water inside the vehicle), but it seems that ARB has racks only for the pajero and the current montero but not the pre-facelift montero. I have contacted their india representative to find out.

if he comes back with a negative, I will be forced to wait for a minty low mileage manual 2008+.

but it is driving me nuts to contemplate waiting for a vehicle to appear in the classifieds.......
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Old 12th August 2011, 20:53   #157
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

oh no - I am buying the new one - its about 40,50 L Ex Showroom with Automatic , the one tested by me was also Automatic but it comes with Manual mode & this car behaves differently in manual mode - close to manual with advantage of clutch free shifting - it will downshift to lower gear in case speed / rpms are reduced but will not shift to Higher gear on own so you get thrills of driving in lower gear at higher rpm's in case you want & the pickup is better !

Last edited by Turbanator : 12th August 2011 at 20:54.
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Old 13th August 2011, 09:56   #158
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

the manual mode does indeed go a very long way towards alleviating the frustration of an automatic. I wouldn't think of buying an automatic without it.

but I'll stick to a manual. though I respect your choice.

As somebody asked me earlier, why not a new montero, for me the answer was very simple. for about 40 lacs, we could get a pajero and new Accord and get both a better off roader and a better on road luxury vehicle.

but no doubt, if it is desired to have both qualities in one vehicle, a new montero is the way to go. Not to mention that the image/prestige factor can be decisive one.

I am wondering when the 2009 Monteros will start showing up in the market.
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Old 13th August 2011, 13:26   #159
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Originally Posted by Ricky_63 View Post
Honestly I think the Pajero already has a lot of torque as is !! I would only be interested if the acceleration was faster or the top end speed increases.
The acceleration is definitely increased by a LOT

Top speed I hit on the way back from Bangalore to Chennai was 175 (170 on gps). It was still pulling as well. I just backed off because of traffic ahead. Would have gone to 180 had more room. Claimed top speed for my car is 161. So top speed has definitely increased.

Well worth the expense I'd say.
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Old 13th August 2011, 15:05   #160
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Originally Posted by Endeavour333 View Post
The acceleration is definitely increased by a LOT

Top speed I hit on the way back from Bangalore to Chennai was 175 (170 on gps). It was still pulling as well. I just backed off because of traffic ahead. Would have gone to 180 had more room. Claimed top speed for my car is 161. So top speed has definitely increased.

Well worth the expense I'd say.


Sounds good. Any idea who (if at all) is doing it in Delhi / NCR ?? Do you feel the engine being strained ? I for one would never drive an SUV at anything over 120-140 max, unless it is needed for any reason, it is the acceleration which needs to improve. Have you upgraded the brakes ?

What are the down sides if any ? What kind of mileage do you get after the tweaking ?



Cheers

Last edited by Ricky_63 : 13th August 2011 at 15:07.
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Old 13th August 2011, 18:12   #161
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Originally Posted by Ricky_63 View Post
Sounds good. Any idea who (if at all) is doing it in Delhi / NCR ?? Do you feel the engine being strained ? I for one would never drive an SUV at anything over 120-140 max, unless it is needed for any reason, it is the acceleration which needs to improve. Have you upgraded the brakes?

What are the down sides if any ? What kind of mileage do you get after the tweaking ?

Cheers
No idea who's doing it there but pretty much any tuning garage can do it. Stock turbo pressures are set pretty conservatively so there's not much harm in increasing the pressure. i got mine increased by around 6 - 8 psi.

The Engine actually feels much much better now. Much more responsive. Does not feel like the Engine is straining at all. It is making its usual sounds, just with more power and torque.

I dont drive over 140 on the highway either but I remembered your question on these forums about whether the top speed had changed or not and I wanted to test for myself as well so on just one single empty stretch of absolutely straight road on NH 46 I turned the A/C off, put my foot to the floor and let the Endeavour stretch its legs a bit. Got to 175 before I got close enough to some trucks ahead that I had to slow down. Never went above 140 the rest of the way back. I risked my life to answer your question! lol.

So if you want a quick, cheap way to increase performance, i'd say this is it. Also keep in mind that I got myself a K&N Air filter too to allow more air to be sucked in the engine. That probably made a difference in the high end of the rpm range as well. Great combo so far. I'm just loving the results.

On top of increased performance, the K&N air filter is actually a great investment too as it can last the life of the car whereas you have to change normal filter several times.

Diesel Engines are built tough and respond very well to turbos whether you're adding a new turbo, increasing the pressure, or upgrading. I got mine done at IgNite garage here in Chennai and he said that I could expect the turbo to last me around 100,000 KM. Plenty for the amount of fun I'm having with it
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Old 14th August 2011, 22:16   #162
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

i test drove a 1998 Land Cruiser Prado today. Diesel with manual trans. Its odo showed 55,000 km and it drove very nicely, except it had a slight stumble off idle and the went down the road in a wierd way at speed (needs new bushings I think). To drive, it was about half way between a pajero and a montero. Very plush ride, especially on broken surfaces but that could also have been due to extremely worn out shock absorbers (which would also explain the wierd ride at speed, if all four corners were heaving around because of weak shock absorbers). its advantage over a new pajero was mostly more room because of a wider cabin, and a much more comfortable seating posture and good room around the pedals, etc. I liked the engine, steering, shifter, but it shares the toyota fortuner's trait of a hood that obstructs your view of the ground close up to the vehicle.

If this vehicle could be had new for 20 lacs, I would be in a huge dilemma vis a vis the pajero.

on that note, I am beginning to see a pattern. a lot of vehicles I have seen show far more cosmetic and mechanical wear than would be appropriate for the mileage seen on their odos. In many cases, the mileage is too low for the age, given the amount of wear and tear seen.

I am beginning to suspect that there is a lot of odometer tampering going on.

Last edited by Harbir : 14th August 2011 at 22:18.
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Old 15th August 2011, 00:51   #163
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
To drive, it was about half way between a pajero and a montero.
Do you mean to say Prado is better to drive then a Montero? I don't have experience in both but what I have gathered from reading is that Prado's handling is little flawed and Montero is one of the best handler among SUVs.
But then handling and road manners come in to play at higher speeds and a good handler need not be nice to drive at slow speeds (from the driving comfort perspective)
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Old 15th August 2011, 00:55   #164
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

no, better than a pajero, not as good as a montero. but I am talking about a 1998, which is two generations old. I've no idea about the current prado
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Old 15th August 2011, 01:41   #165
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Default Re: New Fortuner / Pajero versus Used '08 Montero. Which would you pick?

The Pajero SFX will be the first pick always among these in terms of offroad performance as it is a masterpiece. Pajero is incomparable with respect to Fortuner in terms of offroad performance. Montero has a monocoque body not a ladder frame as compared to Pajero. Fortuner gives a feel as on advanced Innova platform. Although Fortuner has lots of new technology, Pajero stands apart of this.

Compared to after sales and service if a concern, Fortuner is the one.

Last edited by yogeshnaik : 15th August 2011 at 01:47.
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