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Old 6th November 2013, 08:37   #196
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Default Re: Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!

Like the approach. Yes if you have a SUV you have got to flaunt it. More than lift wouldn't lockers be first priority?
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Old 6th November 2013, 09:19   #197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sudev View Post
Like the approach. Yes if you have a SUV you have got to flaunt it. More than lift wouldn't lockers be first priority?
Hi Sudev, there are 3 main reasons I haven't got lockers yet.

First and most important is that I want to learn to drive without the aid of lockers first. Want to learn how to position my wheels for best traction and experience what happens when I don't do it well. Arka also has told me from the beginning to not get lockers until I learn to drive without them. This has been very very good advice.

Secondly, lockers for the Endeavour will cost me about 1 Lakh as per the most recent quotation from ARB so it's a bit of an expensive proposition. The endeavour already has a Torsen LSD in the rear axle which is not as effective as a locker but still works well in a lot of situations and is aided by the left foot brake technique. I think it is sufficient for now but I agree that a locker will be needed in some time, especially as I start doing more and more extreme obstacles.

And lastly, there are other things which are higher on the priority list for me. I have to get new tyres (existing ones are nearing the end of their life), rock sliders, and a winch.

The new tyres I'm getting first because it will give me more traction (which will also make the Torsen LSD work better) and 1 inch of lift (for improving approach, departure, and break over angles) which is badly needed.

I think the locker will be the last step for me unless I am convinced otherwise through OTR experience or through your opinions / advice
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Old 25th December 2014, 04:50   #198
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Default Where to buy Rancho 9000 Shocks in India?

Hi all, I currently have nitro-gas shocks on my Ford Endeavour 4x4 but I find that they don't damp the movement of this Leaf Spring / Torsion bar setup quite enough which is causing a lot of bounciness on bumpy climbs. Could this be because I have upsized to 33x12.5x15 MTs? So to improve traction of this Leaf sping / Torsion setup I'm guessing that the shocks would be right piece to address? Here are 2 videos that show the behavior of my suspension on those bumpy climbs... Notice how the vehicle bounces and loses traction:

Video 1: Watch up to 1:20:

Video 2:

I really like the idea of adjustable shocks that would let me tune the damping to my liking so thought i'd try to get myself some Rancho 9000s. Not sure whether this is the right way to go or not.

Most importantly where can I get Rancho 9000s in India and which specification should I choose?

Appreciate the help!

Last edited by Endeavour333 : 25th December 2014 at 04:51.
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Old 26th December 2014, 08:40   #199
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Default Re: Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!

Yes it does seem that the shocks are not moderating bounces well enough. But in first place why so much bounce?

In Gypsy's used for rallying one most widely used method has been using of two shocks. The bottom point being same a arc is used to determine and add another shocker mount point. Over years this is tried and trusted method along with added leaves in the leaf springs.

Also you need to check if the leaf springs are "stiff" enough? They create the bounce and shocks moderate it.
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Old 29th December 2014, 16:06   #200
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Default Re: Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sudev View Post
Yes it does seem that the shocks are not moderating bounces well enough. But in first place why so much bounce?

In Gypsy's used for rallying one most widely used method has been using of two shocks. The bottom point being same a arc is used to determine and add another shocker mount point. Over years this is tried and trusted method along with added leaves in the leaf springs.

Also you need to check if the leaf springs are "stiff" enough? They create the bounce and shocks moderate it.
Appreciate the feedback Sudev. One of the reasons for the bounce is the throttle and auto transmission. When it bounces once it makes my leg depress the throttle accelerating the wheels while in the air. So when these spinning wheels land it causes another bounce. This is exactly what happened in the second climb attempt of the first video where I tried it in 1st low. Other climbs were in 2nd low where the bounce wasn't as bad. While this could probably be addressed somehow, I still feel that stiffer shocks are called for to reduce this bounce as I faced this problem in bangalore 2014 OTR as well, requiring me to use more speed than the similarly equipped Pajero with Coil springs that simply crawled up without bouncy suspension. I know that this is the disadvantage of leaf springs but I feel that it can be reduced by stiffening up the shocks.

Regarding springs, I want to keep them as soft as possible for articulation but stiffen shocks for body control. Since this is my daily drive as well, adjustable would be the best bet for me.

Anyway, I have figured out how to order these shocks from the US through ICCCWORLD.COM. Hope this Helps others.

Last edited by Endeavour333 : 29th December 2014 at 16:08.
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Old 17th April 2015, 19:42   #201
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Default Re: Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!

Hi Everyone,

I have decided to update this thread after a long time with my Experiences, Observations, some Sweet clicks, and Latest Modifications to my vehicle, one of the few (or only) Endeavour 4x4 ATs being used for hardcore Offroading in India.

RECENT MODIFICATIONS:
(I) Yes you can fit 33" MTs on the Endeavour and you damn well should
So few things I wanted to mention. First of all, the Ford Endeavour is one of the very few or only SUVs in which you can fit 33"tyres with a 2 inch lift (33x12.5x15). I have been running these tyres for the last 10,000 km or so daily in the city and on the highway.

Compared to the regular 31" tyres they are 2 inches taller and 2 inches wider. The extra height means 1 inch more ground clearance over the 31s and 2" more clearance compared to on the OEM tyres, which is very very important for the LWB SUV. The traction advantage and flotation I have noticed compared to my previous 31 inch tyres is HUGE! Especially on soft surfaces like sand.

There are some modification you need to do before fitting 33s, please contact me if you are interested. It is very well worth it, if JUST for the Looks:

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(II) Sway Bar Removal and Bump Stop Adjustment
I have removed both my Front AND Rear Sway bars (Anti roll bars) because I wanted more articulation. This has been extremely successful and has also improved the ride quality by reducing the bounciness drastically. The front IFS especially acts more independently and the difference is remarkable. The rear articulates much more than before and the sway bar removal actually provides another inch of lift at the rear!

The suspension articulates much better offroad and maintains contact with the ground, increasing traction. ON ROAD there is slightly more roll around fast corners but at regular city traffic speeds it is barely noticeable. The Torsion bar at the front and the leafs at the rear are inherently pretty stiff so they limit the body roll sufficuently combined with the lower center of gravity of the Endeavour compared to Fortuner/Pajero/Scorpio. Removal of the sway bar will not be advisable for those vehicles because the coil springs are inherently softer and rely on the anti roll bar more to limit roll.

The front extension bump stop was also trimmed 1/2 an inch to increase the downtravel of the suspension - again for more articulation and traction.

The Endeavour is not a race car anyway so you shouldn't be taking corners at speed. This is a good mod if you want to increase it's offroad ability but please know that although I am comfortable with this mod, you are doing it at your own risk.

(III) Snorkel
After a time or two where water splashed on to the air filter causing puffs of black smoke, I realized that it was time to get a snorkel so went to my usual Ironman 4x4 to get it fitted. I love the look too.

UPCOMING MODIFICATIONS (Vehicle is already in the garage so mods in progress)

After several offroad experiences pushing the vehicle to it's limits, I have identified a few weak spots that I intend to improve upon.

(I) Raised Winch plate and Baja style Front Winch Bumper

The main purpose of this mod is to increase the approach angle which had caused me a few issues despite my already customized front bumper. The chassis being low, along with a front mounted intercooler meant poor approach angle with a bumper that incorporated a winch plate like mine did. This is because the winch plate has to sit in front of the intercooler at chassis height. Unless... I raise the winch plate up above at the level of the front grille.

This is exactly what I have planned. The new winch plate will sit at the level of the grill and actually a little inside the grille in order to maximize approach angle (the chrome grille in front will have to be cut). This will be about 6 inches above the chassis height so extensive supports are being fabricated to distribute the force on the chassis. I have also purchased a 12,000 lb Garuda Winch to go along with this bumper.

Here are some shots of my current front bumper design. Imagine it around 6 inches higher when completed:
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(II) Stiffer Heavy Duty Shocks
Quote:
Originally Posted by sudev View Post
Yes it does seem that the shocks are not moderating bounces well enough. But in first place why so much bounce?
So my Ironman shocks have done around 70,000 km now and are showing signs of losing its damping effectiveness at this point. I've noticed this in the rear end being a little extra jumpy as I mentioned in the posts above. Apparently all the gas had leaked out of the shocks so they were not as effective as they once were. This was undoubtedly causing the bouncing suspension issues.

The basic comfort shocks are meant for occasional offroaders. I found it a bit too soft right from the start. Yes the ride was extremely comfortable but for my use, I really needed something that would control the body motion and especially the bounce of the leaf springs better. I did some research online for about 3 months and after looking at various options that I would have to import without any warranty support, and not wanting to deal with the hassles of importing and customs, I decided to go with the Ironman Foam Cell Pro shockers. I discovered these late in my research but these are now my first choice even if I didn't have to deal with customs, etc. They are built super tough and most importantly, they come with a FIRM VALVING option which was exactly what I was after. Nothing could have suited my use more perfectly. Ordered these already, arriving end of April

(III) Rock Sliders
Nothing too special, just something light weight to prevent damage to the running-boards. Don't want to reduce any clearance with this mod though.

So to conclude this post, I have been thoroughly enjoying my vehicle at any offroad event that I can possibly attend which has been about once a month on average in Chennai and sometimes even twice a month. So far nothing at all in the drivetrain has failed so I am extremely happy with the reliability and capability of the vehicle. The 33" tyres have really made it a force to be reckoned with on all terrains.

Here are some more pics from my Instagram account named "more_by_four" or you can search for "Vishnu Rajam"

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Last edited by Endeavour333 : 17th April 2015 at 19:57.
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Old 1st June 2015, 14:25   #202
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Default Re: Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!

hey Vishnu ! Awesome post as usual Update this with photographs of the new winch. Have you had a chance to use it ?
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Old 2nd March 2016, 20:28   #203
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Default High Mount Winch Bumper and FoamCell Pro Shocks!

Part 1: HIGH MOUNT WINCH BUMPER

This post has been long pending but my High Mount Winch Bumper is completed and I can say confidently that it has been tested and has met its demands. The winch plate is not only above the intercooler but it is also pushed inside into the grill. No over heating issues so far.

It was definitely pricier than I was expecting but I'm done complaining as it not only provides a MUCH improved approach angle but also is built strong enough to withstand the forces of winching the vehicle up challenging slopes (in the Bangalore OTR 2016).

WIP Pictures
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Finished Pictures: The Winch used is a cheap but effective Garuda 12,000 Pound winch with steel rope. It comes with a wireless remote and also a wired controller.
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NEW & Improved Approach Angle:
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OLD Approach Angle:
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Hey Look some articulation in the front thanks to the removal of front sway bar:
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I got the bumper done at CAREWELL Motors in Chennai next to Ega Theatre with a guy named Vinod. I DO NOT recommend him. He took more than 2 months for the Job and did not tell me the price until after it was done. Charged me 48k Which I thought was exactly TWICE what he should have charged for it (Max). Very bad experience dealing with him. I felt cheated but at least ended up with a good product. I know 2 others that have had exactly the same experiences as well. If you want more details on the bumper please feel free to ask.

Part 2: IRONMAN FOAM CELL PRO SHOCKS
I purposely got the firm spec shocks because of the need to control the bounce of the leaf spring via stiffer rebound damping of the shock. Notice the response curves on the left side of the image showing compression vs rebound stiffness.
Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!-ironmanshocks.png

I bought this shock with the above theory in mind but it has worked out just as I had imagined. Although at first it seemed just a bit stiffer than optimal for offroad, after 10,000 km it has softened up by around 20-30% and feels absolutely perfect now. I just hope it doesnt continue to soften at this rate though because that would not be good. I hope it will sustain this damping level for a long time. I am in love with these shocks though. The bounce has been totally arrested at both the front and the rear! They come with a 3 year / 60,000 km warranty. To see these shocks in action check out Part 3 below:
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Part 3: OFFROAD TRIP VIDEOS
Bangalore Annual Offroad 2016 playlist: (1080p Available)
BODA 2016 Part 1:

BODA 2016 Part 2:

BODA 2016 Part 3:

BODA 2016 Part 4:

BODA 2016 Part 5:

BODA 2016 Part 6:


Some amazing fun in Palar before TPC 2015 (with some epic music to accompany):


Captured the video in the wrong direction but it still looks great. Here's some fun in the slush in Chennai:
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Old 4th March 2016, 19:33   #204
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Default Re: Modifying my Endeavour 3.0 4x4 AT for Off Roading!

Vishnu, superb modification report and videos.
Thanks for sharing. I have sent you a PM. I need some assistance.
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