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Old 29th December 2008, 14:38   #121
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B.D., the Inspira does not inspire. Please use your influence and make it the Stryker. We will guide you in totality.

Ha ha , Btw who is the "we", is it you and me?
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:07   #122
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Last week I drove 320Kms in the CJ340 in a day over some really bad roads. By night about 10PM when I was still an hour away from home, I was totally fatigued. It was not sleeplessness or restlessness, I started in the morning and had many breaks in between. But the exposure to elements like sun, wind, dust, heat, cold wind (at night in ghats), smoke (from trucks/Buses) and the SWB Jeep suspension that makes you feel every bump, completely wore me down. I had done the same roads just 5 days before on GV and hadn't felt a thing. DerAlte who was seated in his Safari following me most of the day had felt neither the bumps nor elements.

I drove for next 10-15 minutes very slowly (not hard in the Jeep) until I recovered myself on some good roads before switching back to regular speed.

This was my trial run to see how I'll fare in the 580Kms one day drive to Munnar. My wife who was riding shot-gun gave up the idea after this drive. BTW, Munnar OTR event is cancelled on account of Great Escape. So, I don't have to go now.

A long cruiser should also have protection from elements (that means A/C) apart from powerful engine. This will definitely pushing the price to base Scorpio territory.

Most guys who are into offroading have a regular hatch/sedan apart from a dedicated offroading Jeep/Gypsy. Any brand offroader that can be used only for offroading at >5L price tag won't replace the cheapo offroad vehicle we already have. I just hope Mahindra will realise they need to provide us not just an Juggad Jeep replacement, but also Jeep+Sedan replacement. Who among us will replace a <3L Jeep/Gypsy with a >8L jeep to be used just for offroading?

Last edited by Samurai : 29th December 2008 at 15:09.
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Old 29th December 2008, 16:05   #123
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Samurai:

I hear you man. I liked to do long drives on my jeep and the underpowered 2.1 liter engine and 4 speed gear box made the drives a pain. Once I plonked in the DI Turbo engine and 5 Speed it's a different story. I can maintain 90 to 100 and without stressing the engine and still maintain a conversation.

As Dan pointed out the earlier 540 chasis doesn't inspire confidence to go over a 100. Although the jeep is capable, I think of my kids and stay below 100.

If you guys notice in the picture of the Striker posted above, it appears to have IFS with electric free wheeling hubs. The picture is not very clear to identify if it is a leafspring or IFS, but to me it looks like IFS upfront.

Last edited by Samurai : 29th December 2008 at 16:18. Reason: back-to-back post
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Old 29th December 2008, 16:36   #124
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Samurai:

I hear you man. I liked to do long drives on my jeep and the underpowered 2.1 liter engine and 4 speed gear box made the drives a pain. Once I plonked in the DI Turbo engine and 5 Speed it's a different story. I can maintain 90 to 100 and without stressing the engine and still maintain a conversation.

As Dan pointed out the earlier 540 chasis doesn't inspire confidence to go over a 100. Although the jeep is capable, I think of my kids and stay below 100.

If you guys notice in the picture of the Striker posted above, it appears to have IFS with electric free wheeling hubs. The picture is not very clear to identify if it is a leafspring or IFS, but to me it looks like IFS upfront.

4x4 addict,
The striker in the pic as you rightly identified has an IFS with 4wd. This is the same suspension set up used on scorpio. I read it in a auto magazine that even in new Bolero CRDe the front suspension is that of Scorpio type and there has been a merge of scorpio front end chassis architecture with the original tubular design of bolero chassis.

I have seen IFS with 4wd combination on export bolero pickup models. Iam sure the same is the case with striker in the picture. Also i suppose the Bolero CRDe when offered in 4wd will do away with the rigid axle set up as the the new chassis can offer 4wd with IFS upfront.

Also a stable jeep with good road manners can do 120 kmph speeds, all depends upon the package offered. As samurai said the latent desire is to have a best compromise vehicle with Jeep like off roadability + car like on road ride comfort with low NVH.

All mahindra has to do is offer Jeep Rubicon/pajero SWB kind of vehicle at indian prices of about 6.5 lakhs to 7.5 lakhs maximum.
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Old 29th December 2008, 16:45   #125
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Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
indian prices of about 6.5 lakhs to 7.5 lakhs maximum.
If its marketed as a niche vehicle meant for enthusiasts we might see a higher price tag.

Give us a bare basic MM540 4WD jeep with the right suspension and engine, dont even put a hardtop or doors on it. Price it for 5 lakhs OTR. Is it asking for too much?

Forget the AC and PS in the cheapest model. But give these as options. all bells and whistles and doors and hardtop should be options.

All markets are covered from the rural to the urban folk.
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Old 29th December 2008, 17:02   #126
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Give us a bare basic MM540 4WD jeep with the right suspension and engine, dont even put a hardtop or doors on it. Price it for 5 lakhs OTR. Is it asking for too much?
You just defined Mahindra Major, how many are buying it for offroading?

What we really need is Jeep Rubicon or Pajero SWB at around 7L, as Vinod put it succinctly.
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Old 29th December 2008, 18:09   #127
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You just defined Mahindra Major, how many are buying it for offroading?
It does not have snob value

Dont ask me to define that
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Old 29th December 2008, 18:19   #128
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Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
It does not have snob value

Dont ask me to define that
I know what snob value is, but we are talking about MM-540 here. I never heard anybody attach snob value to MM540, may be with a SWB Jeep, but not MM540. If I go around in a 7-8L MM540, who would know the difference between that and the older MM540?
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Old 29th December 2008, 18:28   #129
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Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
Give us a bare basic MM540 4WD jeep with the right suspension and engine, dont even put a hardtop or doors on it. Price it for 5 lakhs OTR. Is it asking for too much?
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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
but we are talking about MM-540 here.
I did say MM540. Let me put it again. Give us a Major at the same price with the MM540 shell or an Invader shell(i am not sure how good or bad this one is though, assuming the army uses the SWB it will be good enough)

I always recommend a Major to lot of guys who come asking for a good offroader. I do add the caveat that i have no experience on it. But they somehow dont like the look of it and it ends there.

Also i dont see anyone buying a Major here too. Why? No AC or PS?

Last edited by Spitfire : 29th December 2008 at 18:36.
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Old 29th December 2008, 18:37   #130
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I know what snob value is, but we are talking about MM-540 here. I never heard anybody attach snob value to MM540, may be with a SWB Jeep, but not MM540. If I go around in a 7-8L MM540, who would know the difference between that and the older MM540?
Couldn't agree more!
Right, if it was Classic, one could attach snob tag!
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Old 29th December 2008, 18:45   #131
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Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
I always recommend a Major to lot of guys who come asking for a good offroader. I do add the caveat that i have no experience on it. But they somehow dont like the look of it and it ends there.

Also i dont see anyone buying a Major here too.
I know the answer to that. I too considered the Mahindra Major before looking at used Jeep option. Paying 6L on road for pure offroading vehicle is just too much. And this is coming from a guy who paid nearly 17L for the GV. The GV gives snob value, luxury feel, lots of space, fantastic family transportatiion, great ride quality over bad roads and is literally trouble free. The Major gives none of these.

That is what I keep saying, if Mahindra expects us to pay above 5-6L, they better give basic sedan features like family transportation (A/C and lockable cabin) and good ride comfort along with the hardcore offroading ability. Nobody is expecting snob value or luxury from the MM540.
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Old 29th December 2008, 18:58   #132
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I know the answer to that. I too considered the Mahindra Major before looking at used Jeep option. Paying 6L on road for pure offroading vehicle is just too much. And this is coming from a guy who paid nearly 17L for the GV. The GV gives snob value, luxury feel, lots of space, fantastic family transportatiion, great ride quality over bad roads and is literally trouble free. The Major gives none of these.

That is what I keep saying, if Mahindra expects us to pay above 5-6L, they better give basic sedan features like family transportation (A/C and lockable cabin) and good ride comfort along with the hardcore offroading ability. Nobody is expecting snob value or luxury from the MM540.
Valid reasons.

Then why didnt anyone get the Invader 4WD?

This one below - with aftermarket AC fitted was quoted for 6.10 lakhs on road. This is a brand new machine.

Ignore the wheels and stuff. How many could have bought this? The Invader never took off, now we are asking for the same.

PS: Before someone goes no doors and AC? They were removed to try and design ones which can be easily removed for offroading.
Attached Thumbnails
MM540-4WD wish list - what you really want in your MM540-4WD?-invader-4.jpg  


Last edited by Spitfire : 29th December 2008 at 19:03.
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Old 29th December 2008, 19:04   #133
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This a souped up version, so looks appealing, otherwise Invader is horrible looking vehicle, doesn't match the lifestyle vehicle appeal.
Also, engine supplied was hugely underpowered.
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Old 29th December 2008, 19:13   #134
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This a souped up version, so looks appealing, otherwise Invader is horrible looking vehicle, doesn't match the lifestyle vehicle appeal.
Also, engine supplied was hugely underpowered.
Ignore the looks. Other then the bling wheels and the front lights and bull bar its a Invader.

Invader "looked" ok to me.

So plonk in a CRDe(since one is already available), voila we have a Dream MM 540 or whatever you want to name it.

If i am not mistaken it came with the XD3P engine and later the DI Engine (same as Major but without the Turbo i guess). Competent engines as per me.

Any other reason why this failed to enthusiase the offroader crowd?

PS: Remember its the Stryker without the army colours.

Last edited by Spitfire : 29th December 2008 at 19:18.
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Old 29th December 2008, 19:23   #135
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Maybe looks Ok to you, but I've always found it ugly.
Plonking Crdi as in Bolero, would take its price through the roof, as is the case with Bolero. Again if people did not find favour with earlier engines, Crdi is not going to invoke huge passions.

Maybe earlier engines were ok, so this points to some other thing which went wrong. I can only think of Looks!

Invader lacks that true Jeep DNA, I mean looks play a big part, Jeepers are enthusiastic people, they won't even like to be seen sitting in a cheap Invader.

Instead of using same platforms ie. Bolero's platform for the Invader, M&M should design a Jeep from scratch or maybe exploit their older resources viv Classic/550.
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