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Old 16th January 2009, 18:02   #46
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Default Engine Swap NOT POSSIBLE

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Originally Posted by Astleviz View Post
I immediately gave him a call to hold those expenses and use that money for an engine swap instead. After a 30 minute discussion,
Sir, The Engine Swap is not possible and is a complicated change!

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or use and mpfi engine but run it with carb.??
Amit, can you explain the above? IS it because of 4 valves per cylinder or am i missing something?

cheers
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Old 16th January 2009, 18:38   #47
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Sir, The Engine Swap is not possible and is a complicated change!
cheers
Oh! I'm a bit confused now. From what I know, the gypsy king engine is the same as the esteem engine so what exactly are the problems we would be facing? Is the older gypsy (1.0 L) chassis very different from the gypsy king (1.3 L) chassis? What if we decide to go in for the 1.3 L carburetted esteem engine and not the mpfi engine?
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Old 17th January 2009, 00:54   #48
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Hi all

My friend just acquired an old gypsy (1.0 L) which is currently undergoing repairs and some upgrades in a garage. It seems that my friend was planning to spend 40-50,000 bucks on .......... is itching to get it home.
Astleviz,
From what I understand,your friend has a narrow track 1000cc gypsy. Yes you can put in the 1.3 litre engine either carburetted or fuel injected but its not just that. Here is all that you will need to do for a 1.3 mpfi conversion.

1) Buy 1.3 mpfi engine complete withe alternator, starter, throttle body, exhaust manifold, complete wiring harness, ecm, distributor etc. In short everything the engine needs to run.
2) Buy the 5 speed gearbox (transfer case is same)
3) Buy the wide track differentials (complete with axles and ring pinion)
4) Upgrade the radiator.
5) Change the bonnet to accommodate the engine.
6) Install fender flares from the gypsy king along will the running board trim.
7) Fabricate new exhaust system.
8) New fuel pump
8) Install brake booster, necessary with the increased power.
9) Change the meter cluster ( Yes, even that is different)

And these are just the major things which come to my mind.

All this will cost you a lot more than the 50,000 rupess budget.
IMO, all the above if done at a professional garage will cost around 1.1 lakh rupees( rough estimate).
For the carburetted version, you would only save in the cost of the engine, meter console, fuel pump and brake booster ( though I wouldn't recommend skipping this), rest everything would stay the same.

Question is, will your friend be willing to spend that kind of amount on the old gypsy?

Cheers


(experts, please don't flame me if i have written something wrong )

Last edited by gotzuk : 17th January 2009 at 00:57.
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Old 17th January 2009, 02:37   #49
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Thanks gotzuk for the detailed feedback. There are a couple of guys I know who converted their 1.3 L carburetted gypsies to diesels a few years ago and they have the engine, throttle body, alternator and some other stuff that came off the gypsy lying with them. I asked with the mechanic who is working on my friend's gypsy to talk to them and he has informed us that we can source all that stuff for approx. 25-30,000 bucks (I'm not sure about the condition on the engine and ancilliary parts though).

Assuming that we can get all this stuff for 25,000 bucks, would it be possible to bring down the overall costs to 60,000 Rs or so if we decide to skip point no. 3 (buying the wide track differentials with axles and ring pinion)? Or is the wide track conversion an essential part of the whole conversion process?
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Old 17th January 2009, 08:39   #50
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Originally Posted by gotzuk View Post

3) Buy the wide track differentials (complete with axles and ring pinion)

what is the difference between old & new track (in mm or cm) gypsy?

are there any changes in chassis?
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Old 17th January 2009, 11:07   #51
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Originally Posted by gotzuk View Post
(experts, please don't flame me if i have written something wrong )
Vaibhav,

Comeon, you are more of an expert on this buddy with all that experience.

No doubt!

Cheers!
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Old 17th January 2009, 11:11   #52
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Originally Posted by Astleviz View Post
Assuming that we can get all this stuff for 25,000 bucks, would it be possible to bring down the overall costs to 60,000 Rs or so if we decide to skip point no. 3 (buying the wide track differentials with axles and ring pinion)? Or is the wide track conversion an essential part of the whole conversion process?
I would not suggest putting in a 1.3 engine without the wide track differentials for safety/handling reasons.
Although you can get the gearing correct with just the ring/pinion from the king version( I have however never seen this being done and can't say for sure that it can be)
The total cost of your project will depend on how much you pay for buying
the parts, whether you buy new or used and how much the workshop charges you.


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Originally Posted by jeepster View Post
what is the difference between old & new track (in mm or cm) gypsy?
are there any changes in chassis?
jeepster,
IIRC, MG410 had a track of 1210mm front 1220 mm rear.
The MG410W and MG413 are 1300mm front and 1310mm rear.



Edit1: Vinay, I am no expert buddy.. Just know a li'll bit and beat up a froth around it with tech terms to make it look good

Last edited by gotzuk : 17th January 2009 at 11:15.
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Old 17th January 2009, 13:35   #53
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Ok, I think we'll put the engine swap idea on hold for now till we have a better idea of the cost of parts.
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Old 17th January 2009, 13:43   #54
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Ok, I think we'll put the engine swap idea on hold for now till we have a better idea of the cost of parts.
I suggest that you get hold of a competent mechanic / garage and ask him to list the essentials.

I've attempted that mod before and realised it was not worth the effort and cost!
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Old 17th January 2009, 15:02   #55
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Astleviz , There used to be a guy with a decent garage by his house somewhere between the airport and Vasco - Angelo. He used to take care of my Gypsy when I lived in Margaon 1995-96. Was knowledgeable. Everyone knows everyone in Goa, right?

I have used both, an MG410 and an MG413W. (Had both for a while actually). The Gypsy uses the additional engine power in the 413W for some added fuel efficiency with the 5-speed gearbox. If your needs are a bit of off-road driving I personally do not think you need the engine swap, unless the old one is worn.

Have fun, buddy - some pictures?
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Old 17th January 2009, 18:20   #56
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headers,
yes to get the 4 valves per cylinder and more power
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Old 17th January 2009, 18:27   #57
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Originally Posted by Walterdee View Post
If your needs are a bit of off-road driving I personally do not think you need the engine swap, unless the old one is worn.
The gypsy will not be used for hardcore offroading. It will primarily be used for jungle trails (to indulge in some wildlife photography) and 1 annual visit to leh and laddakh. If you think that the 1.0 L engine is competent for these duties, then I guess we'll just go in for a custom FFE and maybe a larger carburettor for a bit of extra power.

Unfortunately no pics for a while since the gypsy is being worked on in a garage in jodhpur (where it was bought) and I am in Goa.
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Old 18th January 2009, 00:06   #58
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i'd suggest looking for a later widetrack gypsy and start working with both the cars, making the specs of your choice and then selling the other one off.
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Old 18th January 2009, 02:56   #59
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BTW, can anyone let me know when was the gypsy king 1.3 L with the wider track launched? Was it 1996? And which year was the mpfi engine introduced in the gypsy?

The reason I wanted to know is that while looking for my friend's gypsy, we came across 2 models- the owner of the 98 model claimed that it was gypsy king while the 99 model we saw was the MG410 model. Is it possible that maruti was still selling the 1.0 L engine even after launching the 1.3L engine for an year or two? Or was the 1.0 L engine discontinued as soon as the 1.3 L engine was launched?
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Old 18th January 2009, 03:19   #60
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i am sure they were both offered for a while, mines a mg410w, and i know they also offered the mg413w at the same time but it was not mpfi.. mines a 95 model
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