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Old 2nd March 2009, 00:23   #16
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A 550 is better behaved than SWB's on the highways is what I have heard here, if you plan to come to delhi for OTR. Though let me assure you that a drive down from jaipur in any will kill you.
A 550 is 90% capable of doing what SWB can. And you can get one as early as 2001 model from army disposal in mayapuri. Most of these are in pretty good condition body wise.
Buy one from there and get it rebuilt. It will be a learning process. Buying it all built never works with jeeps.
You got randeep and alfakilo to pester for support and help in jaipur. Don't be shy go ahead and talk to them.

cheers
vishwas

p.s. Dint alfakilo start a thread mentioning him starting a jeep workshop in jaipur and he doing his own jeep as the first project? Alfakilo where art thou? Whats the status with the workshop and your jeep, please update your thread.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 00:45   #17
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Originally Posted by vishwaschettri View Post
Dint alfakilo start a thread mentioning him starting a jeep workshop in jaipur and he doing his own jeep as the first project? Alfakilo where art thou? Whats the status with the workshop and your jeep, please update your thread.

I'll update my thread as soon as I get some new pics. It is difficult to use a digital camera with oily hands you see...

Things are coming along nicely. I should have the vehicle ready before the month end.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 11:47   #18
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Hi Yogesh,

I see that you have started looking for a Jeep eh. Awesome !!
As everyone mentioned please do not go in for the 4x2 cj3b turned into a wannabe classic. As Vishwas mentioned, for you a MM550 would be ideal as its got good handling on the highway and performs fairly well off road too. As you would be driving from Jaipur for OTR's i'd say the 550 is the best option.

Harjeev has already given you a breakup of the expenses that you'd be incurring. When i'm down in Jaipur I shall give you a call and we can visit my mamaji's workshop and also go caeck up on Alfa Kilo. We'll click the pics for him. lol.

I'd also suggest you come to Delhi and we can visit Mayapuri for the MM550's and other 3b's for sale.

Cheers !!!!!!!
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Old 2nd March 2009, 13:00   #19
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Yogesh
Try to schedule your visit to delhi around the day before Id & Holi. We might be having an OTR too on Holi.
Also I will be getting my jeep on the 9th and will be in mayapuri getting the soft top seat covers, mats etc etc on 9th & 10th march.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 14:52   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfa_Kilo View Post
I would not conside a CJ3B (or whatever is left of it) with non orignal engine, axles and no 4x4. If you want a good offroader, don't consider a modified 4x2 jeep. It can be converted back into a 4x4, but it is not worth the money or the effort.

You may get a good second hand MM540 4x4 for ~2l, or get an ex-army 550 rebuilt for 2.5-3l.
Thanks Alfa, point taken. But I would really prefer a SWB than a LWB jeep after seeing the performance of same. I am eagerly waiting to see Randeep’s as well as Harjeev’s 550s, may be they change my mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 0333 View Post
hi yogesh......great to see OTR'S having this effect on people.

the vehicle in the pictures is not a willys . for the price he is asking i would not suggest you to buy it. keep looking around and post what you find.make a good , informed decision and try to get a fitted 4x4 because fitting it later will cause troublres for you. look for an ex-army 550, like you must have seen at the manesar OTR, the military green mahindra driven by mr.sanjeev is a very capable and reliable vehicle.
if you find a genuine cj3b with complete papers and orginal engine(petrol) and 4 wheel drive....buy it.these are soon becoming collectables in their own right and are simply THE best off roaders.romi jis off white cj is an excellent example.
Yes, I really liked that white CJ3B and it was unstoppable. It had a diesel engine. Noted the point to buy pre-fitted 4x4. That Sanjeevs green 550 was doing great stuff but the driver was also excellent (and not like me). But kids in my street will die to sit with me in a SWB one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tusker4x4 View Post
Dear Yogesh,

Pls speak to RBjee in NIOC, he has a friend Mr.Tony Singh in Jaipur who own a neautifull CJ3B in original condition. Infact he was one of the organisers of the Jeep & Willys rally in Jaipur.

He has some veichle in Jaipur that Pushkin was planning to pickup before he picked up a MM Major.

Take RBjees advise also.

Redgs

Amit
Thanks Amit, I will soon speak to him. That I am sure will work out well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tusker4x4 View Post
Yogesh,

Alfa Kilo is right. This 3B is modified. If you can get a MM540 with original engine or even a 550 it would be great.

A MM540 conversion to 4x4 costs about 19,000/- in mayapuri. I had got it done for my 540 as it was originally a 2x4 an Airport Authority disposal.

Though I would recomend it to be done in Jaipur only as there are good mechanics there. mayapuri work is not up to the mark.

Redgs

Amit
That’s the same thing I told the dealer that why has he converted it to a classic if it was a Willys(as he told). I said there are equal hardcore fans of original Willys too and it hold more value than a look alike.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
These days it is becoming risky to buy Jeeps of spurious or unknown source. In the south it has come to light that some workshops are making SWB Jeeps from scrap, not restoring, but literally making them. They take a LWB chassis, cut in the middle and reweld them to make SWB Jeeps. They also fabricate any old model Willys Jeep to satisfy the demand.

Please make sure you are buying from reputed source or sources known to people you trust.
Thanks Samurai, didn’t had any idea about it. That’s where T-Bhp showers confidance.

People don't know it in the begning an later only after few months they are fedup with their jeeps. I think there are many people who don't buy a jeep for Off road purpose, but just for name sake. Even I found out what a Jeep can actually do only after I attended the OTR. I also learned that an original condition jeep holds more value than a modified one, only after the OTR.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigman View Post
Tusker is right, Randeep is getting his MM540 restored in Jaipur at his mamas garage and from the pictures it looks like an excellent overhaul.
Eagerly waiting to see that when he is here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by starter View Post
Hey Sharath,
+1 to that. I came across a CJ340 in Bangalore. After some convincing, i took it to a mechanic and got it examined. It was exactly a LWB chassis cut and welded to make it into a SWB. Isn't that simply like killing 2 jeeps, the SWB & LWB? Also, it is running on a Ford Fusion diesel engine. The quote was 2.75 lakhs!
Cheers,
Deepak
Will be careful about that.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 15:20   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harjeev View Post
My opinion is the same that I gave you last week.
Increase your budget to 2L
• buy a army disposal 75k
• regn 14k
• tyre 22k sandgrips
• paint 10k
This comes to 121k. And leaves you an ample amount of about 79-80k for the restoration. Which I think can be comfortably be managed.

Atleast you would be sure if what you are getting. If you buy a jeep like the one you are considering, you would never be sure what package you have got. But atleast in restoration you know what has gone into your vehicle and you will know the limits of the vehicle and how far to push it in the OTR's etc. Which I think is quite important.

So the restoration way is what I think is the best atleast you know what has gone into your jeep.


Even if you pickup this jeep for lets say 1L The the expense sheet will work out like this
20k for 4x4, 20k for tyres, 4-5k for transfer the misc exp like oil change, brakes overhaul etc etc all this will cost about 20k
The final tally will come to 165-170k.
The difference comes to just 30k. So ask your self are you saving alot.


One think I do not understand about the jeep pics you have posted is
from the side it appears to be a SWB
The rear door/ is of a Mahindra Major CL550
Its not a 4x4 but CL550 came as 4x4
then if it was a CL550 they were 91" wheelbase, why this this been shortened??
The front fenders are also of a CL550

I might be wrong but all this dosent quite add up.
May be the experienced gurus can comment.
Some great calculations there. Totally agree with you. Already forgotten that lookalike jeep. Agreed that 540s and 550s are the easiest and most practical option. But there are few points:
1) I have a big hitch for going for restoration of an Army jeep all by myself. For reasons:
a) Don’t have knowledge,
b) Have very little time so can’t gain knowledge,
c) I am too simple to bargain for acquiring jeep, parts and labor, so I know will end up more expensive.
d) Not in hurry, can wait for a really good deal to come. (May be after restoring your next jeep that is CJ3B, someday you give your 550 to me)

Now the next point is that I am very inclined towards SWB jeep, even if we decide to go for restoration I would like it to be a SWB. A CJ3B is my favorite, even more than Classic. But not with petrol engine. I striectly want a diesel engine. So all gurus want your advice on that:

What would be best option for lookout for a diesel SWB jeep?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfa_Kilo View Post
The owner has added the 550 badge, along with 'classic' on the bonnet
You can imagine, if the rider doesn’t need a 4x4 and is happy with 4x2 than for surly he needs as many badges on the jeep. Which ever is available in the spear shop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harjeev View Post
yogesh!
Just saw that youve mentioned a budget of 200k.
So go ahead and buy a MM550 you wont regret it.

If you want a SWB then the best bet would be to hunt for a CJ3B. But then that would be a petrol and to & fro delhi to jaipur would be a big burden on the pocket each time!!!
No a petrol one is ruled out. Diesel for sure.

The budget is actually 3 lakhs. 2 for jeep, and another 1 for making wife happy (that includes a vacation on Andaman in May)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigman View Post
So you get a 2 in 1 Jeep, a bit like a ladyboy.

Maybe he could not find a 3C Turbo High Turban badge like one of the dabwali creations has in another thread.

Credit to Susan for the picture.

Seriously avoid any of these cut and shut jobs with fancy names and engines. All that bling will not stand much abuse and you will be wishing you took the MM550 approach mentioned by Harjeev.
I had gone for something like that if I wasn’t a t-bhpian… Regarding 550, I like Randeeps approach, he has taken a reasonable good body and given it a new engine and all work done in a nice way and well as few modds, he is going to be a proud owner soon. I will see his jeep first and then would finalize for 550, otherwise a SWB.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 15:32   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starter
Also, it is running on a Ford Fusion diesel engine. The quote was 2.75 lakhs!
Cheers,
Deepak
Never heard of that one before. I am sure it isn't.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 15:45   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vishwaschettri View Post
A 550 is better behaved than SWB's on the highways is what I have heard here, if you plan to come to delhi for OTR. Though let me assure you that a drive down from jaipur in any will kill you. .
Hey Vishwas, why do you say so. Is it really going to be that difficult to drive in a Jeep from Jaipur to Delhi. If yes than what can be done. For me Delhi will be a priority.
Does anyone knows about offroad events in Jaipur?
Quote:
Originally Posted by vishwaschettri View Post
A 550 is 90% capable of doing what SWB can. And you can get one as early as 2001 model from army disposal in mayapuri. Most of these are in pretty good condition body wise.
Buy one from there and get it rebuilt. It will be a learning process. Buying it all built never works with jeeps.
You got randeep and alfakilo to pester for support and help in jaipur. Don't be shy go ahead and talk to them.
I am eagerly looking forward to Randeeps next visit to Jaipur, his 550 is promising.

Quote:
Originally Posted by randeep04 View Post
Hi Yogesh,

I see that you have started looking for a Jeep eh. Awesome !!
As everyone mentioned please do not go in for the 4x2 cj3b turned into a wannabe classic. As Vishwas mentioned, for you a MM550 would be ideal as its got good handling on the highway and performs fairly well off road too. As you would be driving from Jaipur for OTR's i'd say the 550 is the best option.

Harjeev has already given you a breakup of the expenses that you'd be incurring. When i'm down in Jaipur I shall give you a call and we can visit my mamaji's workshop and also go caeck up on Alfa Kilo. We'll click the pics for him. lol.

I'd also suggest you come to Delhi and we can visit Mayapuri for the MM550's and other 3b's for sale.

Cheers !!!!!!!
Sure Randeep, give me a call whenever you are here and we will all meet up. It would be great to see your jeep here, that might change my views on 550. In 550 I specially do not like the double side back seats, that take the charm of open jeep away, what have you done have you kept them sideways or changed?.


Quote:
Originally Posted by harjeev View Post
Yogesh
Try to schedule your visit to delhi around the day before Id & Holi. We might be having an OTR too on Holi.
Also I will be getting my jeep on the 9th and will be in mayapuri getting the soft top seat covers, mats etc etc on 9th & 10th march.
Thanks Harjeev, but 9th won’t be possible. We can work it out sometime on a weekend just before or after and OTR.
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Old 2nd March 2009, 15:52   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ym-enjn View Post



Sure Randeep, give me a call whenever you are here and we will all meet up. It would be great to see your jeep here, that might change my views on 550. In 550 I specially do not like the double side back seats, that take the charm of open jeep away, what have you done have you kept them sideways or changed?.
Hi Yogesh,

Well I dont plan to keep the side seats either. Infact I'm looking for the Tata Sierra rear seat. I am thinking of installing that in the centre. The best part is if installed properly it can double fold and the whole place is available for storage. Looking for one but no luck as yet.

Its not mandatory to keep the side facing seats. One can always change them.

Cheers !!!!!
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Old 2nd March 2009, 16:12   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ym-enjn View Post
...Now the next point is that I am very inclined towards SWB jeep, even if we decide to go for restoration I would like it to be a SWB. A CJ3B is my favorite, even more than Classic. But not with petrol engine. I striectly want a diesel engine....
If you are inclined into a diesel SWB, better not to consider the CJ3b. This legendary machine is best in its original form, with petrol engine. As such these are quite rare so kindly don't turn them into diesels. May be a CJ340 or a CJ 500 or a 2nd hand Major may serve your purpose. Just some thoughts of a newbie.
-regards,
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Old 2nd March 2009, 17:49   #26
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Originally Posted by Kandisa View Post
If you are inclined into a diesel SWB, better not to consider the CJ3b. This legendary machine is best in its original form, with petrol engine. As such these are quite rare so kindly don't turn them into diesels. May be a CJ340 or a CJ 500 or a 2nd hand Major may serve your purpose. Just some thoughts of a newbie.
-regards,
Dear Yogesh.

CJ340 and a 2nd hand Major 4x4 is excellent option. The Major will have a DI engine with 5 speed gear box. It is great on the highway and good for offroading too.

Romijee has a DI engine with the old 4x4 2 lever grear box. and wow does that jeep perform !!

The Major is an option you must consider also.

If buying a 550 or a cj3b pls consider the cost of registration and also if it is possible to get it registered in Jaipur as in delhi it is not possible.

Regds

Amit
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Old 2nd March 2009, 17:56   #27
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Originally Posted by Tusker4x4 View Post
Dear Yogesh.

If buying a 550 or a cj3b pls consider the cost of registration and also if it is possible to get it registered in Jaipur as in delhi it is not possible.

Regds

Amit
@ Yogesh,

The registration is very simple for an MM550 as the Jeep already comes in diesel. But
can be a problem for a CJ3b if you intend to convert it into a diesel. These days conversion from petrol to diesel on the registration does not happen and if someone says it does then its fake.

My MM550 is also registered from Jaipur and its a very easy process. I got my computerized registration papers in 5 days.

Cheers !!!!!
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Old 2nd March 2009, 18:21   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kandisa View Post
If you are inclined into a diesel SWB, better not to consider the CJ3b. This legendary machine is best in its original form, with petrol engine. As such these are quite rare so kindly don't turn them into diesels. May be a CJ340 or a CJ 500 or a 2nd hand Major may serve your purpose. Just some thoughts of a newbie.
-regards,
Thanks for advice. I like CJ340 and major as well. Im not wrong, Samurai is having a CJ340 and it is a beauty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tusker4x4 View Post
Dear Yogesh.

CJ340 and a 2nd hand Major 4x4 is excellent option. The Major will have a DI engine with 5 speed gear box. It is great on the highway and good for offroading too.

Romijee has a DI engine with the old 4x4 2 lever grear box. and wow does that jeep perform !!

The Major is an option you must consider also.

If buying a 550 or a cj3b pls consider the cost of registration and also if it is possible to get it registered in Jaipur as in delhi it is not possible.
Amit
Major looks cool too.. Does it comes ex-army also, would it be available in Mayapuri or do i have to look for civilian one. I have contacts in villages near Jaipur, will that help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by randeep04 View Post
@ Yogesh,

The registration is very simple for an MM550 as the Jeep already comes in diesel. But
can be a problem for a CJ3b if you intend to convert it into a diesel. These days conversion from petrol to diesel on the registration does not happen and if someone says it does then its fake.

My MM550 is also registered from Jaipur and its a very easy process. I got my computerized registration papers in 5 days.

Cheers !!!!!
Thats for sure Randeep, you can get anything done in Jaipur RTO in 5 days. I once wanted to get address changed and renew my licence so the agent first renewed and then did address change and then gave me two new licences. Then when I wanted IDP, he took Rs 1000 and get it made in one day, (a laminated computer print, with RTO seal and sticker) in US and germany both, it was invalid. Its babu raj here and money talks..
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Old 2nd March 2009, 19:51   #29
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Originally Posted by Ym-enjn View Post
Major looks cool too.. Does it comes ex-army also, would it be available in Mayapuri or do i have to look for civilian one. I have contacts in villages near Jaipur, will that help.
Major is not an SWB Jeep it has almost the same length as MM5**. The Best bet for you is definitely a CJ340 or Classic(May not fit in you budget seeing the market trend on classic). Please don't go for a retrofitted Diesel engine Jeep.

Thanks
--Sree--
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Old 2nd March 2009, 21:23   #30
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@ Ym-enjn - I say that because it is so. A 550 will have a top speed of around 100 kmph and cj3b around 80 kmph. Most of the times you would be doing around 60 and that is what jeeps are most comfortable doing.
The super smooth Jaipur - Delhi road will suddenly become pot hole ridden. A simple deformation on road will look like speed breakers that will break your back .
I'm not trying to scare you but that is how it is. Your best bet will be to get a reliable driver to drive it from Jaipur to Delhi, and you later join in comfort of a car.
You might drive it all the way for the initial few OTR's but later fatigue will catch over to adrenalin. Though I would like you to prove me wrong and drive it every time from Jaipur.

The white jeep that romi has will work out much cheaper than any 550 restored to similar spec. Below is a brief of very approximate costs involved.
cj3b - 35~40 k (bought in a bad state with no engine no tires)
paint body job - 35~40k
DI engine - 30k (??)
overhauling DI engine and other mechanicals - 30k
Tyres and other misc - 40 k
registeration - ?? ask randeep.

All the prices are approximate and all the work will be done at one place only. Infact the same place where romiji's jeep was done. You may not even need to come even once in between. It is a authorised M&M service station and all the spares used will be MGP and everything will be billed and like. So the cost involved is almost double. But the quality of work and peace of mind that comes along with it is worth it.

Pros
excellent off roader with diesel DI torque
Economy of a diesel. DI engine gives close to 15km/lt
can be repaired anywhere and everywhere

Cons
DI engine is very unrefined. Isuzu are much more quieter and refined.
It's illegal to do so. The insurance for the vehicle will not be valid
even more fatigue on highway DI + SWB deadly combo.

At the end of it buy whatever your heart says, It's not a logical decision anyway to buy a jeep so why look for a logical choice.

cheers
vishwas
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