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Old 21st April 2009, 12:24   #46
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...IMO if the SPOA is not factory fitted, you will loose power and traction which will negate any gain by the increase in articulation etc.
He he. Hey Vikram, why did you not tell this secret to me some 4-5 weeks back man.
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Old 21st April 2009, 13:02   #47
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My travelling on highway in my stock CL340 says that it is not a good idea at all. Where as for the stock Jypsy it was easy.. Same was for the riverbed sand rally trail.

Gypsy is more logical choice for someone looking for practicality than CL340 and also for someone who likes it. For MM550 and others with gates and hoods its a different story.

The advantage of Jeep is that first it is a "Jeep thing" and second at places superior in offroading, third FE. These are enough reasons for me to go with Jeep..

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To go to Leh, you don't need a offroader, a high GC 2WD vehicle will do.
To go to Leh you do not need 4x4 but to play around there it would be fun to have a 4x4..

Last edited by Ym-enjn : 21st April 2009 at 13:07.
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Old 21st April 2009, 13:15   #48
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Parm, the replies thus far have pretty much covered it all. In a nutshell : if you want peace of the mind + reliability, get yourself a well maintained Gypsy (if possible, try stretching to a brand new. Nothing like it).

A Jeep has it's share of niggles and requires attention from time to time. Only if you have the spare resources (money + time on your hands) should you get a used Jeep.

P.S. : I wouldn't trade my Classic for any other Indian offroader.
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Old 21st April 2009, 14:21   #49
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Originally Posted by Ym-enjn View Post
To go to Leh you do not need 4x4 but to play around there it would be fun to have a 4x4..
Exactly the reason I asked what I asked. I already have a Honda City for myself and now want one vehicle which will be traveling as well as some "play around - indian offroading".
Classic case of confusion between Gypsy KING and say a MM5X0 or bolero 4X4. :(
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Old 21st April 2009, 18:39   #50
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Default New MM550 OR New Gypsy

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if you want peace of the mind + reliability, get yourself a well maintained Gypsy (if possible, try stretching to a brand new. Nothing like it).
Perhaps Mahindra is going to come with a all new MM550 in the market. If that is available, do you still recomend Parm to go for Gypsy. Some of them have pointed out here about the reliablity of MM5x0 but I guess it is because one has to buy a old one and than restore it at his own from the local workshops.

Parm :: Perhaps you can wait for a bit longer and book 1st MM5x0 rolling out from Mahindra factory. Give it a light thought though
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Old 21st April 2009, 18:43   #51
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Originally Posted by DesertKing View Post
Perhaps Mahindra is going to come with a all new MM550 in the market.

Parm :: Perhaps you can wait for a bit longer and book 1st MM5x0 rolling out from Mahindra factory.

Hey Naren,

Are You sure ? When? Do you have any concrete info on this? Pics? Lots of Ques????

Tarkesh
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Old 21st April 2009, 19:38   #52
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Dear Tarkesh,
Everyone seems to be reaching exactly the situation that i am in.
If you read through a few other threads in this forum, you see some experts talking about it.
Atleast, i am waiting from the last one month, hoping that MM brings my dream come true.
Let us wait and see.
Cheers,
Deepak

PS: @Behram Sir, how long would you keep us waiting?
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Old 21st April 2009, 20:02   #53
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Sir we do some pretty tough off roading where the vehicles and the men are tested to the limit. Some call it crazy, some curse the organiser for the event
@Headers What i mean by extreme off roading is the kind of offroading that is done outside India with higly modified rigs, IMO we are still to catch up on it.

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Sir, IMO if the SPOA is not factory fitted, you will loose power and traction which will negate any gain by the increase in articulation etc.
I guess Khan is the best to shed light on it as he has done the SPOA and I am aware that its not factory fitted.

Last edited by khan_sultan : 21st April 2009 at 20:46.
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Old 21st April 2009, 20:04   #54
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If that is available, do you still recomend Parm to go for Gypsy.
Well, Parm has the budget for a used Gypsy at the moment. Thus a new Gypsy at 6.0 lakhs will anyways be a stretch. I don't know if he'd want to spend even more on the rumoured 550!

However, a brand new Gypsy has met its match in a brand new 550 (if & when she ever sees the light of day).
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Old 21st April 2009, 23:53   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertKing View Post
Perhaps Mahindra is going to come with a all new MM550 in the market. If that is available, do you still recomend Parm to go for Gypsy. Some of them have pointed out here about the reliablity of MM5x0 but I guess it is because one has to buy a old one and than restore it at his own from the local workshops.

Parm :: Perhaps you can wait for a bit longer and book 1st MM5x0 rolling out from Mahindra factory. Give it a light thought though
The 550 coming back finally M&M is listening.

I guess it would be around the 5-6L mark?

And I guess its out of Parm's budget?

If not you have a choice of Used Gypsy / Used 540 / New Gypsy / New 550.
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Old 22nd April 2009, 10:35   #56
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Originally Posted by khan_sultan View Post
Sorry to burst the bubble, but we don't do ANY kind of tough off-roading in India. We ALL are doing LKG stuff and we call it whatever we want. That's the reality and in serious off-roading the stock Gypsy or MM's don't even stand a chance -- whichever they may be.
Hi Shahnawaz,

Don't worry about the bubble.

AFAIK there are 3 4x4 off-road competitions in India.

i) Coorg organized by Red Rooster Racing. 1 Day
ii) The Palar Challenge 2 Days
iii) Mud Challenge/rally in Bhopal 1 Day

BTW for the stock vehicles we use we have some really tough events, not many people who talk about hardcore or serious off-roading attend it.

The Indian OTR scene is quite different from what is happening all over the world, it will be futile to try and copy an event from outside and do it in INDIA.

for a few reasons
1) Time - Longest OTRs are 2+2 Days
2) Money - Are you willing to Roll your vehicle once a year.
Parts & Modification & availability.
3) Preparedness (Mental/Physical/Vehicle)


There is not point in cribbing about something being LKG, what have we all done to take it to PhD. level.

Regards,

Arka


PS - While we are at it lets try to define Serious/Hardcore Off-Road.
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Old 22nd April 2009, 11:38   #57
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Default severe offroading means what?

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Hi Shahnawaz,

Don't worry about the bubble. ....
BTW for the stock vehicles we use we have some really tough events, not many people who talk about hardcore or serious off-roading attend it.....

...... it will be futile to try and copy an event from outside and do it in INDIA.

for a few reasons
1) Time - Longest OTRs are 2+2 Days
2) Money - Are you willing to Roll your vehicle once a year.
Parts & Modification & availability.
3) Preparedness (Mental/Physical/Vehicle)


There is not point in cribbing about something being LKG, what have we all done to take it to PhD. level.

Regards,

Arka


PS - While we are at it lets try to define Serious/Hardcore Off-Road.

Well, well, this requires a new thread altogether!! Well i think the difficuilty level of off road event is dependent on types of vehicles used for the contest. Few bench mark off road events according to me and my limited you tube experience are-

1. Camel Trophy (was done on stock vehicles with some minor modifications)

2. Malasyian Rain forest Challenge (lots of heavily modified vehicles contest here)

3. Moab trails (both stock and modified vehicles take part in this)

A stock vehicle has its limitations. So, what we people do in india can be equated to what people do with it abroad in loose sence. There their pockets are deeper and offroad culture is far more mature. Further the 4x4 choices available with engine power ratings are far superior to what we get in india from OEM's. So, they cannot be compared. So, i must say we do respectable offroading with what is available to us in sub 100 bhp engine categories with open diffs.

We in India are yet to see heavily modified vehicles for deep warter fording, rockcrawling etc etc...

so, khan is right saying that we are yet to catch up with abroad interms of what they do to their machines and arka is right in saying what we do is severe enough in stock form.

Last edited by khan_sultan : 22nd April 2009 at 13:05.
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Old 22nd April 2009, 14:19   #58
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I think in India it more due to the lack of general know-how about the stuff.
Abroad, those guys make their own rigs because they cannot afford the costs, and they have been taught about these things since childhood. Incase of a breakdown on the trials, they have the spares and they have the on-board welder to sort things out. More so ever they have lots of other ppl to share this hobby with, and yes, the most important thing is that the culture is such, that they really don't mind spending all that they've earned during the week on the weekends(maybe Dan can help here), therefore they usually tend to buy a kabbard and throw in tens of thousands of dollors, something no body in his right mind in India would want to do.

Here firstly there are few ppl who do offroading, and even there, only half are seriously into it. The rest all do it for wanting to do something different, and the moment they get their expensive clothes dirty they want to go home.
Check the Dabwalli clients out. They shove in almost every accessory they can lay their hands on, and probably the fattest rubber they can find. But going down a further 6 months, their jeeps are giving them trouble, and they just cannot stand the heat, and they just miss the comfot of their safaris and scorpios, so thats the end of their hobby.

Secondly, the lack of offroading accessories, but thats catching up. There's one shop in Bangalore and soon enough, there would be a offroad cum sports gear shop in CHD, that would also take up modifications.

Thirdly, we can get our vehicles built by someone, but what if something breaks up in the trial. And since these super modified vehicles will alway remain jaugards, something or the other always would always go wrong. I mean the drivetrain and the motor will always be abused on the trials, so its pretty obvious that oil leakages, and seal breakages, amongst other thing will be regular stuff. Most of the ppl just don't want anything to do with these sort of vehicles. They want a totally reliable, do everything and ask nothing kind of vehicles, andas we all know, nobody's perfect.

And yes, finally, time that nobody has. Also the family relations are so strong here, that a person cannot just go against them. If a guy want to do it or vice-vesra, the spouse or the folks always have to mess it up.
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Old 22nd April 2009, 14:44   #59
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Note from the support team: Please do not paste entire quote to say this only.

Well said brutus...every point is so relevant

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 23rd April 2009 at 13:18.
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Old 22nd April 2009, 18:50   #60
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And yes, finally, time that nobody has. Also the family relations are so strong here, that a person cannot just go against them. If a guy want to do it or vice-vesra, the spouse or the folks always have to mess it up.
I agre with Brutus here, my Gypsy acquisition was stalled by parental dictum.
Even now both my parents and In-laws were against the Gypsy.

Fortunately my wife likes the Gypsy and supported my cause.

GB
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