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Old 10th June 2009, 03:41   #76
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Dear all - the Bolero VLX that you refer to here comes equipped with 3.73:1 axle ratio, a CMVR fallout. Now imagine the Bolero VLX with 4.3/4.55 axle ratio plus 2.6 litre engine plus 4 wheel drive plus IFS minus hard top plus wheelbase reduced plus looking different plus plus plus -----.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Behram, people have been making serious decisions regarding business and money over the RUMORS that pop up on this site. I hope you are choosing your words carefully.
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Old 10th June 2009, 11:34   #77
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Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
BHP1,
No one crowned Bolero to be the best offroader in india yet! From what i can see people are discussiing various possibilities with Bolero 4wd!Thats it.

Also what does crudeness have to do with being an offroader? CL's and Gypsy's(to some extent) are crude by todays standards, but arent they best off roaders available in the country?
Atleast that is what the title suggest! If possibilities are to be discussed, better change the heading to "wishlist for a Bolero", on the same terms as "wishlist for MM550" & then wait for eternity for MM to act!

Bolero is designed to be a people mover & so the sales, few buy it for pure offroading. I would not call Gypsy crude but basic & that's what we love in offroaders. Whereas, Bolero is plain & simple crude, an ergonomic disaster & a complete slouch.
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Old 10th June 2009, 11:39   #78
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Bolero looks like a posh sedan compared to my Jeep. What is this talk about crude Bolero.
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Old 10th June 2009, 11:49   #79
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Atleast that is what the title suggest! If possibilities are to be discussed, better change the heading to "wishlist for a Bolero", on the same terms as "wishlist for MM550" & then wait for eternity for MM to act!

Bolero is designed to be a people mover & so the sales, few buy it for pure offroading. I would not call Gypsy crude but basic & that's what we love in offroaders. Whereas, Bolero is plain & simple crude, an ergonomic disaster & a complete slouch.
Bolero may be an aerodynamic disaster with Drag Coefficient of higher than 1, but then it is a Jeep which is not meant for high speed racing. But calling it a ergonomic disaster and slouch is definitely not on because:
  1. I did about 900 kms in a day in the Bolero and was not at all tired due to driving and nor were the passengers. I haven't been able to do this in a sedan before.
  2. I have hit GPS confirmed 146 KMPH on my VLX and hence its no slouch either.
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Bolero looks like a posh sedan compared to my Jeep. What is this talk about crude Bolero.
Absolutely agree. And in the VLX in cabin noise is almost non-existent.
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Old 10th June 2009, 11:59   #80
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6) Accessorize - Winch & Hi-Lift & GPS & Microwave
Throw in some sausages as well.
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Old 10th June 2009, 12:06   #81
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Whereas, Bolero is plain & simple crude, an ergonomic disaster & a complete slouch.
Did someone drive a Bolero over your toes?
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Old 10th June 2009, 12:16   #82
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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
Bolero looks like a posh sedan compared to my Jeep. What is this talk about crude Bolero.
Which jeep? A 20 yrs old/older piece of History!!! Offcourse its comfortable than a bullock cart too!
Arn't we living in the 21st Century A.D.!

@MC, I already said, its for hauling people.


@Spitfire, the eternal Bolero fan!! Or thy shall defend their own vehicle to death, even if its crap!

Though Bolero did not drive over my feet, too slow to be missed getting over but it does seem to have gotten to your head!

Last edited by bhp1 : 10th June 2009 at 12:18.
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Old 10th June 2009, 12:22   #83
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Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
Vinod:

Is the rear leafspring set up different for Bolero 4 Door and the Bolero Invader?
yes tini,
Bolero invader has inverted rear leaf overslung compared to bolero underslung unit. This gives invader poor articulation compared to other M&M's
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Old 10th June 2009, 12:25   #84
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Originally Posted by bhp1 View Post
Which jeep? A 20 yrs old/older piece of History!!! Offcourse its comfortable than a bullock cart too!
Arn't we living in the 21st Century A.D.!

@MC, I already said, its for hauling people.


@Spitfire, the eternal Bolero fan!! Or thy shall defend their own vehicle to death, even if its crap!

Though Bolero did not drive over my feet, too slow to be missed getting over but it does seem to have gotten to your head!
Just a small piece of advice, TD the VLX, over good and then bad roads and if that doesn't bring grin to your face, then may be you are not "Jeep" enthusiast.

No offence meant, just my P.O.V
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Old 10th June 2009, 12:35   #85
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Which jeep? A 20 yrs old/older piece of History!!! Offcourse its comfortable than a bullock cart too!
Arn't we living in the 21st Century A.D.!
Why don't you list out the specs for a 21st Century M&M Bolero.

Regards,

Arka

PS - Try keeping the budget under 8-10Lakhs.
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Old 10th June 2009, 12:46   #86
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Atleast that is what the title suggest! If possibilities are to be discussed, better change the heading to "wishlist for a Bolero", on the same terms as "wishlist for MM550" & then wait for eternity for MM to act!
Title suggests " will bolero be the best offroader ever" and not " Bolero crowned as the best offroadr in india"!

Quote:
Bolero is designed to be a people mover & so the sales, few buy it for pure offroading. I would not call Gypsy crude but basic & that's what we love in offroaders. Whereas, Bolero is plain & simple crude, an ergonomic disaster & a complete slouch
Truly your opinion Bhp1! If you dont like Bolero that up to you cannot change your taste about it. I agree with your point that Bolero is not bought for pure offroading purpose but for multiutility applications. Jeeps that are good offroad for that matter never sold for pure offroading purpose. They were also used as multiutility vehicle however they are good at offroading too. Ditto for Gypsy!! People enever tried Bolero for offroading hence passing comments is being judgemental. Iam doing so with my own experience driving Bolero 4wd hence can term it to be a good offroader if not the best!
Further on your comments like Bolero is

1. Plain- A/C , p/s, central locking, music system + vlx features like voice assist, meets euro iv compliance etc...are these things called plain??
2. Crude- Bolero Xd3p matches the noise levels of a Toyota (qualis to be precise), DI turbo adheres to the incabin noise regulations and passerby regulations, Vlx is supersilent and matches the levels of scorpio and safari. How is that it becomes crude in this case?

3.ergonimic disaster- I agree the ergonomics are nothing to write home about but if it was that bad then why so many sales?? You dont need ergonimics only for offroad i guess. We have people on the forum who find driving bolero comfy than a scorpio!

4. A complete slouch- Agreed, if you are comparing it with a BMW. VLX is fast enough and has best power to weight in the busniess in its class. Di turbo is slow no doubt, but you will not get bored to death.

Bhp1, there are some vehicles which one doesnt like no matter what others say. I see your point, but Bolero isnt that bad my friend
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Old 10th June 2009, 13:04   #87
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The much talked about VLX is not coming in 4x4 Avatar so far & asking price is too high, so much so that a Xylo looks brighter in comparison.

MM can give Xylo at a reasonable price, why demand so much for a older/Agrarian Bolero!

Give Bolero a new platform like Scorp/Xylo, new powerful engine, or 4x4 in VLX, better ergonomics(steering position, gear lever placement/execution), new looks & whatever can be given at a price for 4x4 experience.

After this, I don't see why Bolero can't be the best! As of now, it can't lay claim for the best offroader title.
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Old 10th June 2009, 13:31   #88
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Originally Posted by bhp1 View Post
The much talked about VLX is not coming in 4x4 Avatar so far & asking price is too high, so much so that a Xylo looks brighter in comparison.

MM can give Xylo at a reasonable price, why demand so much for a older/Agrarian Bolero!

Give Bolero a new platform like Scorp/Xylo, new powerful engine, or 4x4 in VLX, better ergonomics(steering position, gear lever placement/execution), new looks & whatever can be given at a price for 4x4 experience.

After this, I don't see why Bolero can't be the best! As of now, it can't lay claim for the best offroader title.
Hi BHP1,

Among all the INDIAN vehicles listed in this thread.

The advantage the Bolero has-

1) Chassis - NGCS 115X160mm Box-Section

2) Axles/Differential - Front Open Knuckle Ball Joint - rated at 1400Kgs
- Rear FFRA 1 Piece Axles - rated at 1800kgs

3) Body - Much sturdier than the competitors.

4) Engine - as you suggest a uprated engine is beneficial, but we off-road types prefer one with minimal electronics . But I can live with a m-eagle or a NEF2600.

5) Modifications - this is where the M&M Takes the Lead.
i) Engine Options (after market)
ii) OEM - 4 Lower Differential ratios & option of after - market LSD/Lockers
iii) Can so for Drastic Tyre Up-Sizes.
iv) SPOA - For more clearance.
v) gas-charged shock absorbers.

As far as marketing is concerned the Bolero is the Cash Cow, and its an Agrarian people mover/milk van/etc because its Sturdy....we wouldn't want to loose that in an off-roader.

XYLO/Scorpio is for Urban & Semi-Urban use.

Off-Road the scorpio performs because of its engines, the bolero performs as a platform.

Regards,

Arka

PS - the BOLERO feels left out as it is the 2004 NGCS MM550XD's Bigger & Elder Brother . If MM550XD then why not Bolero?

Last edited by ex670c : 10th June 2009 at 13:42.
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Old 10th June 2009, 14:38   #89
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@Spitfire, the eternal Bolero fan!! Or thy shall defend their own vehicle to death, even if its crap!
LOL. I have a Classic for the offroad duties. And the Bolero is used for hauling me and family over long distances.

I never said Bolero is best offroad. I got a 2WD only because i had a 4WD Classic.

I am no fanboy but believe in VFM(hard earned money) and Bolero when bought in 2004, it was VFM redefined.

But its beside the point.

So one did run over your toes then.. thats what i was looking for. Does it still hurt? Looking at your posts above it does

Dont bother replying to my posts. You can make an effort to reply to Arka's. I have no experience on 4WD Bolero but if you are talking Bolero as a highway cruiser at sane speeds there are more threads around then this one to take your load to.

Leave this one alone, you havent got the point of this topic anyways. Thank you.

Last edited by Spitfire : 10th June 2009 at 14:42.
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Old 10th June 2009, 17:26   #90
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Vinod - I like your reaction. I have a 4wd Bolero for 5 yrs now. No complaints as such xcept a broken power steering (rane) in first few months and It does the job as expected for a 4wd with costs just what a Bolero costs. My 2c..
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