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Old 26th February 2010, 14:31   #871
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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Arka - whatever axle Thar comes with will work perfectly on it. Therefore, please do not worry. I will lay all speculation to rest by saying that it shall be semi floating axle, obviously Scorpio family derived, track changed to suit NGCS leaf spring suspension. You saw it in Bangalore Sir.

By the way, in a recently held Great Escape (dry sand dunes), it ran rings around everything else.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
I can not imagine all the variables involved in trying to midwife this thing into the marketplace...CMVR, pollution standards, parts availability, production impact and schedules, stodgy management, CYA marketing...rather yappy public input on web sites (hee, hee, hee)....

That being said, Behram, you really do have my sympathy on this...now how about LSD or lockers, 'ay?
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Old 26th February 2010, 14:33   #872
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@Arka, refer your post no.862 on homologation, there are certain things which a manufacturer cannot do under "prevailing conditions", fixing a 6 point roll cage, that too to the chassis is one among them, i don't say it is not doable BUT.. keeping all you guys in mind the "Mastermind" of this project has ensured that you will get maximum options for customisation depending on your tastes,this is something you guys must appreciate, infact we are testing a few things that you guys had mentioned during the Chikaballapur OTR, hope it will come out fine.

Spike

P.S. Arka when you call Dhabhar Sir an expert it is understood, although he is my Guru, i stand nowhere in comparison to where he is now, i am a dilettante/novice as far as 4WDs are concerned,and i hope to learn a few things from you guys (offroaders). How can you call me an expert yaar??
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Old 26th February 2010, 14:40   #873
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Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR View Post
BUT.. keeping all you guys in mind the "Mastermind" of this project has ensured that you will get maximum options for customisation depending on your tastes,this is something you guys must appreciate,


infact we are testing a few things that you guys had mentioned during the Chikaballapur OTR, hope it will come out fine.

Spike
Spike/ Behram sir,
Thanks for all your efforts on the options for customization and i am glad that the vehicle has gone for homologation.

Would be glad to know 'those few things' which you are testing after chikballapur OTR. Feels nice to see you guys are taking field inputs as much as possible
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Old 26th February 2010, 15:30   #874
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Default Track & Retrack

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM;1753676 [U
I INFORM ALL OF YOU ONCE AGAIN THAT ONLY A VEHICLE WHICH MEETS CMVR CAN EVER BE SOLD.[/u] I hope all will appreciate.

Dear Arka - whatever axle Thar comes with will work perfectly on it. Therefore, please do not worry. I will lay all speculation to rest by saying that it shall be semi floating axle, obviously Scorpio family derived, track changed to suit NGCS leaf spring suspension. You saw it in Bangalore Sir.

By the way, in a recently held Great Escape (dry sand dunes), it ran rings around everything else.
Hello Sir,

1) What has SFRA got to Do with CMVR, it only the Differential Ratio which acts up on the Chassis Dynamometer.

Please Define working perfectly in TOTALITY.

2) Please Confirm or Negate.
Isn't there at least 2 Lawsuits against Mahindra & Mahindra wrt. failure of Scorpio Rear Axle (Dana 44 SFRA) resulting in the loss of life.

3) What will be the subsequent track Difference in the rear?
Scorpio Front is 57"
Scorpio Rear is 57" (SFRA)

Bolero Front is 57"
Bolero Rear is 53" (FFRA)

MM550XD Front 57"
MM550XD Rear 53" (FFRA)

Some of the Load vehicle Maxx Series have a 59" Rear Track.

What is the Rear Track (FFRA) of a Bolero Storm?

4) Please spare us the M&M Great Escape Off-Road performance report.
We realized the Thar's true worth/performance/capabilities in Bangalore Avalakonda OTR.

And how come a vehicle only month's ago static displayed at INDIA's largest OTR event, became road worthy/Off-Road Worthy for a Mahindra Great Escape?

Regards,

Arka
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Old 26th February 2010, 17:35   #875
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Dear Arka - I also happen to be a professional vehicle test engineer (I have the best job in the world). We are permitted by law to drive test vehicles. Everybody is not allowed to drive test vehicles. So, that's how the "rings were run".

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 26th February 2010, 18:08   #876
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Dear Arka - I also happen to be a professional vehicle test engineer (I have the best job in the world). We are permitted by law to drive test vehicles. Everybody is not allowed to drive test vehicles. So, that's how the "rings were run".
Tussi Great Ho Sir Ji,

But I guess you got the Test Driver Qualification just after the Bangalore OTR.

Too bad we missed seeing you & the THAR in action.

Or maybe you were scared that your baby will not_______________.

IIRC the Static Display Thar had a MH15XX XXX Regn. Plate inside the vehicle, and donned it on select road movements.

Regards,

Arka

PS -Still waiting for your "Official" Line about the Scorpio SFRA Failure.

Last edited by ex670c : 26th February 2010 at 18:16.
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Old 26th February 2010, 22:16   #877
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Sorry to jump in. But I guess Thar will be more costly now as Excise Duty is increased in this Budget. It is higher for SUV category vehicle.

Thank for delayed "Indian" launch. Why M&M didnt start govt formalities before expo? Or alongside European version?
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Old 27th February 2010, 08:53   #878
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Dear Arka - ref your post no 876 above, if you must know, I joined M&M on 16 June 1980 as a trainee and have been officially qualified for testing vehicles from 16 June 1981 (28 years, 8 months and 10 days as of today, there is an exam to pass, very few make it). The Bangalore event was an excellent event but it was one amongst numerous such events in India as well as abroad. There is nothing to get scared of. I am totally against doing anything stupid, just for the heck of it so I just won't do it. If you break it, you repair it, nobody else does it for you, either free or paid, so what's the big deal? I think that a majority of people come to enjoy themselves, not to do something which would break their cars. I know that people are understanding this.

Therefore, let's move on, shall we? My wishlist now is to do the Camel Trophy. Now that's what I call an ultimate event. Now what would such a vehicle specification sheet look like? We Indians are second to none. We are out to become world beaters..

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 27th February 2010, 10:29   #879
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Default Camel Trophy M&m

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
The Bangalore event was an excellent event but it was one amongst numerous such events in India as well as abroad. There is nothing to get scared of. I am totally against doing anything stupid, just for the heck of it so I just won't do it. If you break it, you repair it, nobody else does it for you, either free or paid, so what's the big deal? I think that a majority of people come to enjoy themselves, not to do something which would break their cars. I know that people are understanding this.

Therefore, let's move on, shall we? My wishlist now is to do the Camel Trophy. Now that's what I call an ultimate event. Now what would such a vehicle specification sheet look like? We Indians are second to none. We are out to become world beaters.

Hello Sir,

Glad you agreed that THAR would have dismantled itself all over the Avalakonda Trail.

Please list out other similar off-road events in INDIA.

How come you pitted your company's Service Team MM550XD & Marshal 4WD on the same trail? They preformed admirably, without any worry of breakages and damage.

Well Sir, the Camel Trophy has now become the G4 Challenge.

Regards,

Arka
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Old 27th February 2010, 15:20   #880
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... I am totally against doing anything stupid.....
I think you have ruffled Headers' feathers with this bold and brassy statement. He is pro-stupid so expect a passionate rebutal from him soon. (Just kidding H-man, please don't poison my cat this time, 'ay?)


Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
... I think that a majority of people come to enjoy themselves, not to do something which would break their cars. I know that people are understanding this.
Four wheel drive tractors will likely out perform any stock jeep ever made in most off road situations. So will tracked vehicles such as army tanks. Like it or not jeep off roaders are driving vehicles that are highway compromises. I certainly hope that this new buggy retains all the toughness that is legendary in the jeep lineage. So does Arka, I gather.

And, Behram, most of us know that you are constrained by many factors and variables that you face in producing a jeep for a manufacturer, constraints and compromises that you would not choose if you were building or restoring an off roader for yourself. Perhaps sometime in the future when you are free you can tell us what you had to overcome to produce an off roader such as this.

Last edited by DirtyDan : 27th February 2010 at 15:22.
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Old 27th February 2010, 16:19   #881
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The arguments across the table goes on and on and on..

BTW how much of the OTR capability of a vehicle is dependent on driver skills? Surely there should be some ratio here.
Guys the specs of the Thar was long frozen so don't keep dishing out "if that" and "if this" phrases.
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Old 27th February 2010, 19:50   #882
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Dear Ken - you hit the nail on the head, my dear Sir. There are numerous things I can do not only on the Thar but also on our regular models but the hindering factors far outnumber the facilitating factors. Actually I think there should be a detailed CMVR thread because I think I will have to handhold most of you from the kindergarten class of CMVR. By the way, for starters, do you know that there is something like L,M,N and O categories of vehicle classification? Well, by the time you know, you will tear your hair out. In the midst of all this, I have to make the vehicle also..

I do not think I will ever get time to tell you all this in detail. Colleagues of mine have started and ended 40 year long careers in CMVR. I am not an expert on CMVR. I am just a user department.

However, there is as always a silver lining (AAL AJH WELL, AAL AJH WELL). I am feeling good now because I am now finally seeing Thar vehicles being made on the assembly line, one behind the other. That's what the ultimate level of "Actionable Auto Passion" (if I may put it that way), is all about, isn't it? Believe you me Ken, the feeling I get when I see M&M vehicles running on the road where I have contributed to they being born, the feeling is indescribeable. I still follow such vehicles in my Scorpio in a daze for some time, before overtaking and driving off. This is what drives me all the time.

I shall always make vehicles to be born. Period.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Last edited by DHABHAR.BEHRAM : 27th February 2010 at 20:05. Reason: add info
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Old 27th February 2010, 21:19   #883
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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
the feeling I get when I see M&M vehicles running on the road where I have contributed to they being born, the feeling is indescribeable. I still follow such vehicles in my Scorpio in a daze for some time, before overtaking and driving off. This is what drives me all the time.

I shall always make vehicles to be born. Period.
Tussi Great Ho Sir Ji, And we are happy to be associated with you via this forum.

And I'm Glad that the THAR is finally made it to the assembly line
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Old 27th February 2010, 21:37   #884
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@Headers if by chance anyone among you happens to visit Nasik plant you will notice 50+ yrs old operators zipping around the company premises with their cooling glasses on , with production Thar vehicles (although Female population is less, but it still works) this is something apart from the "regular stuff" which makes heads turn (from Canteen supervisor to Security guard), i believe it is time to post pictures of the white RHD that we have built, what do you say Sir? please do the honours.

Spike

Last edited by SPIKE ARRESTOR : 27th February 2010 at 21:54.
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Old 27th February 2010, 22:21   #885
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Dear Sir, we are very happy to hear that the Thar is on the assembly line now. Thanks to you for giving birth to this vehicle keeping in mind most of our interests & requirements.

I know there are still a few who feel that their wish lists are not met, however the greater majority feel that we now have a 4WD that we were long wanting.

Thanks again to you and you're team
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