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Old 8th April 2010, 15:45   #1306
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Originally Posted by headers View Post
@KMT:
@VN my friend, please dont dare compare the THAR with a Gypsy. Starting from Acceleration through gears or doing a slalom at 80 kph or having a drag at MMST, the gypsy will BEAT the THAR hands down .

The same articulation which is claimed to be great contributes to its lousy handling - Yes or No ?
Headers,
I have driven both, The acceleration of the THAR is supreme compared to Gypsy, there is no comparison, You will agree someday soon.

Regarding the handling, it is natural for us to envision a MM540/ 550 fitted with a high powered engine with the same handling, but the handling is something that will highly surprise anyone, though the body and dimensions are the same, the new generation hybrid chassis and suspension are a breakthrough that makes the handling very superior, in short I found the THAR to be much more easily maneuverable than Scorpio.
Believe me.
Regards,

Last edited by fazalaliadil : 8th April 2010 at 15:55.
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Old 8th April 2010, 15:55   #1307
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DB Sir,

When will the Thar be released.?, please can we atleast now get a decent launch date in India..?

Cheers
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Old 8th April 2010, 15:59   #1308
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Originally Posted by fazalaliadil View Post
Headers,

Regarding the handling, it is natural for us to envision a MM540/ 550 fitted with a high powered engine with the same handling, but the handling is something that will highly surprise anyone, though the body and dimensions are the same as 540/ 550, the suspension is a breakthrough that makes the handling very superior, in short I found the THAR to be much more easily maneuverable than Scorpio.
Believe me.
Regards,
Infact Fazal Sir, is one among a few people who have driven THAR with different suspension setups (total 3).

Spike

OT- Fazal bhai the black one has been laid to rest now!

Last edited by SPIKE ARRESTOR : 8th April 2010 at 16:02.
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Old 8th April 2010, 20:05   #1309
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OT- Headers have you done slalom on 80 kmph? If yes how, i mean the procedure?
Yes, I have in a car BTW, you are the forum instructor, not me, I just DRIVE!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
I would be happy if you be the Gypsy driver, i would stick to BMW x5. Heck...you are immune to roll over now, hence wouldn't hurt you
VN: Good video. The reason why gypsy is superior on road than a THAR is its suspension setup. You gotta drive one hard to believe me. The guys who rode shotgun with me some years ago at the undisclosed location would agree!!!

BTW, in the same video, a IFS vehicle like the THAR would not lift as dramatic, but if you push for higher speeds, it would NOT do the slalom - cent percent!

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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post

Been there, done that. This is hardcore softroading.

Come on Sharat, One could do that in a M800

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Originally Posted by fazalaliadil View Post
Headers,
I have driven both, The acceleration of the THAR is supreme compared to Gypsy, there is no comparison, You will agree someday soon.
Fazal, You are lucky to have driven both. But Please, I am not comparing comfort or ability to go over a rough patch at speed without feedback to the steering wheel, BUT am talking about high speed handling.

Sir, the THAR / STORM / M&M vehicles have ONE BIG DISADVANTAGE - Its WEIGHT.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR View Post
Infact Fazal Sir, is one among a few people who have driven THAR with different suspension setups (total 3).

Spike
Well, I hope next time you know whom to call
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Old 8th April 2010, 20:28   #1310
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this is the third post on this thread asking for a launch date... looks like nobody is interested in the launch and everybody wants to wait on the banks of river ganfges for the most beautiful girl to pass by...... so that he can marry her.

The suspense is worse than the OM611 from Force Motors for Gurkha..

Cheers !
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Old 8th April 2010, 20:41   #1311
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Originally Posted by shivshanker View Post
this is the third post on this thread asking for a launch date... looks like nobody is interested in the launch and everybody wants to wait on the banks of river ganfges for the most beautiful girl to pass by...... so that he can marry her.

The suspense is worse than the OM611 from Force Motors for Gurkha..

Cheers !
It was straight away designed as per European Norms and M&M needs more time to customize it to our INDIAN Norms . Lot of stuff have to be removed i guess and the quality wise there should be difference between export quality and indian quality. so they might be working on it.
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Old 8th April 2010, 20:45   #1312
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Originally Posted by shivshanker View Post
this is the third post on this thread asking for a launch date... looks like nobody is interested in the launch and everybody wants to wait on the banks of river ganfges for the most beautiful girl to pass by...... so that he can marry her.
A lot of us already know the answer, it is 6 months away. That has remained so for more than a year.

You should instead ask easier questions, like how to attain enlightenment.
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Old 8th April 2010, 22:49   #1313
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Originally Posted by headers View Post
Fazal, You are lucky to have driven both. But Please, I am not comparing comfort or ability to go over a rough patch at speed without feedback to the steering wheel, BUT am talking about high speed handling.
Headers,
That's what I am exactly talking about, not just acceleration or comfort.
I am no test driver but pushed both THAR's to my max on track and sat by Mr. Behram while we did a 6 km dash to an off-road destination, before going off-road, (he is much more experienced in off-roading than I am) though it was no hardcore stuff, but definitely a Gypsy could not take such harsh treatment on that rough terrain at the speed THAR went effortlessly.
The off and on road handling at high speed was impressive.
Regards,
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Old 9th April 2010, 00:02   #1314
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Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR View Post
Infact Fazal Sir, is one among a few people who have driven THAR with different suspension setups (total 3).

Spike

OT- Fazal bhai the black one has been laid to rest now!
Dear Spike, would it be possible to share what the 3 set ups were and why were they discarded?
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Old 9th April 2010, 06:52   #1315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fazalaliadil View Post
Headers,
That's what I am exactly talking about, not just acceleration or comfort.
I am no test driver but pushed both THAR's to my max on track and sat by Mr. Behram while we did a 6 km dash to an off-road destination, before going off-road, (he is much more experienced in off-roading than I am) though it was no hardcore stuff, but definitely a Gypsy could not take such harsh treatment on that rough terrain at the speed THAR went effortlessly.
The off and on road handling at high speed was impressive.
Regards,
Fazal, I agree that its handling of the bad roads [comfort wise] is better than a gypsy, BUT, the gypsy is a better overall suspension setup in stock form and that is why it is preferred in the rallying circuit. As you are aware, rallies are not hardcore offroad, but about TSD etc.

NOw, tell me, if M&M has an amazing suspension layout in their bag, howcome, none of the rally boys thought of the idea of toying around by putting a bigger better engine in the chassis and take it for a spin??

A simple test of the vehicle dynamics is a slalom test, and a better one a multiple slalom.

Lets put a stock gypsy vs a stock THAR on test and do the talking I Rule:

Else, we seem to be going nowhere


@VN: FYI, if a samurai did the slalom at 41 mph, you seriously think a thar can do better than that ? My take is 30 mph!
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Old 9th April 2010, 07:59   #1316
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Originally Posted by headers View Post
Come on Sharat, One could do that in a M800
Whatever happened to not judging the terrain from the video/photo? Forget 800, even stock GV can't do this as it will take huge hit to the transfer case. The GV shown here has massive skid plate protection. Notice the gap in the wheelwell as the GV skid plates hit the ground.
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Old 9th April 2010, 08:05   #1317
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Originally Posted by star_aqua View Post
Hi Arka,
The farm only vehicle usually falls under off-highway category. and it doesn't mean it is not road legal. The only thing is they are not Autobhan worthy. In most of the countries in Europe people are not allowed take their motored vehicle into the forest or off the highway. The exception is for only farmers or locals and polizie. And there is no OTR scene here anywhere except very few countries like italy and Austria offers a OTR park. These vehicles are used by farmers for the farming purpose and visiting nearby places through the slow routes. They are not allowed to take fast routes anywhere.
And the terrain is not worse as we have in INDIA.
here are some pics of country side where these vehicles are used.
The roads (country side) that you have shown here can be done in my 1991 M800. Why would I need a Thar here? I have actually driven my underpowered Sierra over terrain like the dug up farm patch on the side of the road with no issues.

Seriously, I am getting less enthusiastic with the approach of Mahindra by the day. Still no concrete information about the Thar except for tall (?) claims. The interiors are still as shoddy as they used to be about 20 years ago.
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Old 9th April 2010, 10:03   #1318
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Originally Posted by discoverwild View Post
The roads (country side) that you have shown here can be done in my 1991 M800. Why would I need a Thar here? I have actually driven my underpowered Sierra over terrain like the dug up farm patch on the side of the road with no issues.
And you think a regular offroad Jeeper like star_aqua wouldn't know that? He just posted the pics of farm roads where Thar will be allowed to drive in Europe. He was not trying to show OTR terrain.
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Old 9th April 2010, 11:09   #1319
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Lot of stuff have to be removed i guess and the quality wise there should be difference between export quality and indian quality. so they might be working on it.
Quality wise there won't be any difference. Please do not build castles in air, as you know homologatory requirements of EEC/ECE and CMVR are different, perhaps in some matters CMVR is more complicated. Even if a vehicle has cleared EEC/ECE norms it just cannot be put into Indian roads.

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Originally Posted by yikes6633 View Post
Dear Spike, would it be possible to share what the 3 set ups were and why were they discarded?
Soft,Medium,Hard

Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
A simple test of the vehicle dynamics is a slalom test, and a better one a multiple slalom.
Headers, i think you are confusing with "Slalom". Please differentiate between Slalom and Multiple Slalom.

OT- How do you determine the pitch for slalom on cars with different wheelbase and track?

Spike

P.S. Have you done Elks Test?

Last edited by SPIKE ARRESTOR : 9th April 2010 at 11:10.
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Old 9th April 2010, 11:33   #1320
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Default Swedish Elks test

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR View Post
Headers, i think you are confusing with "Slalom". Please differentiate between Slalom and Multiple Slalom.

OT- How do you determine the pitch for slalom on cars with different wheelbase and track?

P.S. Have you done Elks Test?
Hi Spike,

Why don't you share the Swedish Elks Test results for a few M&M Vehicles.

IVECO Massif Solid Axle Leaf Spring has a rating of 63Kmph for the 110 Wheel Base. (1Min 57Secs into the Video)

Whats the figure for a Scorpio or Bolero/Camper/Pickup.



Regards,

Arka
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