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Old 29th January 2010, 15:07   #16
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Originally Posted by fazalaliadil View Post
Tejas,

THAR will never be a mass production vehicle.
Off-roading and owning a 4X4 is not a cheap hobby, it is meant to be an additional four wheeler which is a hobby tool in your garage and the ones who can afford and need it will buy it.
Any four wheeler can transport passengers from one place to other, then why are the very high end cars sold, priced between 30-80 lakhs and upwards? Status symbol for the ones who can afford them.
THAR will not be bought by people who want a family car, a hatch back or a sedan though it has all the creature comforts required for daily driving unlike its predecessors. An average family person will not be on the list of potential buyers of the THAR.
Gypsies are obsolete in design and technology like the 540/550's and are petrol driven (wallet) but still are good offroad machines due to their compact size and power to weight ratio.
Mahindra would love to but will not look at huge numbers should they launch THAR in the Indian market.

Regards,
Fazal bhai,
This is the precise point that I wanted to throw across to Dev with whom we had an argument regarding its production! I just hope now that the jeepers should have a good unbiased look at the vehicle.

Tejas
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Old 29th January 2010, 15:10   #17
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@ Tejas: I guess you have misinterpreted the issue:

THAR will be a production vehicle catering to a niche segment - It is not a MASS production vehicle selling 10K per month unlike the Boleros and other UVs from Mahindra Stable.

The THAR is a good vehicle but has its limitations. The pricing IMO is the key to its success!
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Old 29th January 2010, 15:23   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
@ Tejas: I guess you have misinterpreted the issue:

THAR will be a production vehicle catering to a niche segment - It is not a MASS production vehicle selling 10K per month unlike the Boleros and other UVs from Mahindra Stable.

The THAR is a good vehicle but has its limitations. The pricing IMO is the key to its success!
Headers! sorry again for the misinterpretation. I am in a meeting and forgot to type the most required word: "mass". My bad. As I said in my older post, it is for people who can afford it!

My question again to jeepers: I like off roading but I do not have any technical info about the jeeps/gypsies/thars. I have just followed most of the threads related to the building of the jeeps etc. The bug has bitten me but due to some constraints, I am not able to make it to any of the OTRs.
My question to you all is this: If I have an option of say 7.5L, why would I go for a Thar as I can have a full blown customized jeep/gypsy in the same amount of money or as a matter of fact in lesser. Is the question valid in the first place?

Tejas
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Old 29th January 2010, 15:37   #19
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Originally Posted by bantejas View Post
If I have an option of say 7.5L, why would I go for a Thar as I can have a full blown customized jeep/gypsy in the same amount of money or as a matter of fact in lesser. Is the question valid in the first place?

Tejas
LOL Tejas : Option 1 : Gimme the money and I'll build you one for that - A Gypsy or a Mahindra.

OK, getting serious, you could go for the THAR as it comes as a ready made package with 4x4 and a decent engine. It is definitely OK for a novice off road and will not let you down. The reliability has been taken care of, by M&M and you should not be disappointed. But Having said that - A MG413W Mpfi is equally capable!!!
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Old 29th January 2010, 16:21   #20
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Thats a great report, Fazal sahab, hope to catch up with you as we seem to be in the same city and gather some more first hand info on Thar.

so what is not clear is during your test drive, did you or Behram ever engage 4lo/hi at all or not.
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Old 29th January 2010, 16:25   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adzegeek View Post
Thats a great report, Fazal sahab, hope to catch up with you as we seem to be in the same city and gather some more first hand info on Thar.

so what is not clear is during your test drive, did you or Behram ever engage 4lo/hi at all or not.
adzegeek,
There wasn't any necessity to engage in the 4WD mode even on the huge incline.
Regards,
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Old 29th January 2010, 16:27   #22
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Awsome! First hand report! Was this way back in Apri'2009 you said? Were these test mules or ready-for-production vehicles?
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Old 29th January 2010, 18:30   #23
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Originally Posted by fazalaliadil View Post
On the straight part of the track both jeeps were taken up to +90kmph ( I had forewarned the on-board team that I would test the Brakes by jamming them at high speed so brace yourselves). When I hit the brakes as hard as I could for sudden braking, at this speed it came to a dead halt between 12-15 feet.
I'm not really a 4x4 guy, & to be candid I think some of the things 4x4 people do with their jeeps is simply crazy. Anyway, sorry to nitpick but I find it hard to believe that a 1.7 ton vehicle can stop from 90 Kmph in just 15 feet - that's like 7Gs of deceleration ! I think a more realistic braking distance from 90 Kmph is 30 meters or so (100 odd feet).
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Old 29th January 2010, 18:58   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by im_srini View Post
I'm not really a 4x4 guy, & to be candid I think some of the things 4x4 people do with their jeeps is simply crazy. Anyway, sorry to nitpick but I find it hard to believe that a 1.7 ton vehicle can stop from 90 Kmph in just 15 feet - that's like 7Gs of deceleration ! I think a more realistic braking distance from 90 Kmph is 30 meters or so (100 odd feet).
Maybe that's what he felt like; better stopping power.

The initial driving impression is very surprising as I described things I would never do on a 540/550 as you said. People who want reliability with power and highly practical 4x4 will buy the Thar if what we read is true and for the price mentioned ( nothing than 6 lac OTR IMHO).

Wasn't the 4x4 ever used during the drive? And photography wasn't allowed?
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Old 29th January 2010, 19:10   #25
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How about taking an incline on slush Fazal? Can you do it again courtesy DB. Anyways nice report !
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Old 29th January 2010, 20:19   #26
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Dear Fazalaliadil,

Thanks for sharing your experience here. Its nice.
So far the conclusion is:
* Thar is great on-road jeep w.r.t speed, handling & braking
* It has a nice & linear torque, that 4Wd is not necessary on most of the cases?
* Its ECU settings can be changed later on for more performance
* The production numbers will be less as it will be considered a 2nd vehicle / marketed as a lifestyle jeep?
* Price is still unknown

So, is the Thar atleast launched in Europe or Africa? Here a Common person a newbie offroader may not buy it because of its expected high Price (Expected to be 7 lac+ now)
BTW, whats the Hard top design, did you get a chance to see it?
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Old 29th January 2010, 21:01   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by offroad_maniac View Post
BTW, whats the Hard top design, did you get a chance to see it?
Offroad_maniac,
There were only two topless, one of which is the silver with Mr. Behram in it (pics on THAR revealed thread). No hardtop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
How about taking an incline on slush Fazal? Can you do it again courtesy DB. Anyways nice report !
Headers,
Thanks. Maybe in monsoons, rains in Nasik are heavy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkdas View Post
Thar if what we read is true and for the price mentioned ( nothing than 6 lac OTR IMHO).
Wasn't the 4x4 ever used during the drive? And photography wasn't allowed?
jkdas,
All you guys who read my report, please do not doubt my honesty, what I have stated is unbiased and factual. I am neither a Mahindra guy or someone who is trying to promote the THAR. I am just one of you who was lucky to test drive it, in my place had it been someone else from T-BHP, possibly they would do better justice in writing what was.
The THAR demands admiration as the team behind it.
As this was a project under wraps until the Delhi Auto Expo, obviously photographing it would not be allowed and neither did I ask or attempt and break the protocol.
Quote:
Originally Posted by im_srini View Post
Anyway, sorry to nitpick but I find it hard to believe that a 1.7 ton vehicle can stop from 90 Kmph in just 15 feet - that's like 7Gs of deceleration
im_srini,
Most fighter pilots black out at 7 G's, which means 7 times your body weight acting against you, right?
The deceleration was huge as it was deliberate and the all in the jeep were braced up and ready for it. When I touched 90, I braked hard on long straight drive, I could have subconsciously brought it down to 85 or gone beyond 90 before braking, and the vehicle could have come to a halt a few feet more than I have stated, the point here is not the exact measurement but approximate (precision...that is the job for professional test drivers and company calibrators), I am none, but a Jeep passionate guy who knows the difference between 'good' and 'very good. THAR fits in the very good bracket.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nilesh5417 View Post
Awsome! First hand report! Was this way back in Apri'2009 you said? Were these test mules or ready-for-production vehicles?
Nilesh,
Prior to my drive, Mahindra has been exporting THAR as a fully developed vehicle.
Regards,
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Old 29th January 2010, 21:19   #28
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Quote:
Nilesh,
Prior to my drive, Mahindra has been exporting THAR as a fully developed vehicle.
Regards,


Fazalji and others, I am repeating my querry that was placed on the other thread. Any idea on how well the Thar is faring overseas?
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Old 29th January 2010, 21:21   #29
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Thanks, FazalAliAdil. Thats a comprehensive ON-ROAD review.
I like the THAR for being designed and built by enthusiasts for enthusiasts. This rarely happens here in our country.
I'm sure many of us would like an even more detailed off-road review on different surfaces (slush, sand, rock, water fording, etc.).

@DB: How about GTO doing his industry standard review on the THAR?
Offroad enthusiast + Vehicle critic. We wouldn't find a better man for the job, can we?
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Old 30th January 2010, 00:51   #30
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LOL! Nitrous, i dont think an official review is allowed at this point of development

I do believe Thar will be a good vehicle. Good "compromise" for people who would want a comfortable 4x4 vehicle, which can do few to many a things, BUT not all.

It has its task cut off, if it is aspiring to step into rough and tough land of MM's and Gyspy's, atleast in the form it was displayed in BLR.

Price above 6-6.5 lakh OTR would certainly kill its sales (for base model with something decent like MLD atleast). Even decent numbers would be difficult, unless we get another brilliant economic boom

From offroad perspective, chuck out the doors, fancy dash etc etc instead give us MLD!

EDIT: I saw a mention of Gypsy being outdated, i differ to this. They are basic and simple, and offer absolutely no comfort, but apart from that it will kick *** in OTR as a specialized tool can be, in "stock' form. Period!

Last edited by Jaggu : 30th January 2010 at 01:19.
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