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Old 9th May 2010, 13:39   #16
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Had seen this jeep ad atleast 6 months back. It looks good but it is not OTR ready. I would suggest Kiran's JEEP(Caterpillar), as his jeep is a daily drive and also OTR ready. It has AC too(not sure if it is working).
Caterpillar is a lovely jeep...but the owner has all but vanished from here...
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Old 9th May 2010, 16:07   #17
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Isn't it nice ... another convert

... check the engine shape (compression test is best), ..4 points are fine, you are okay.

...overheating, steering shake, how the brakes are.

...jugaad. It's okay to get your own jugaad done, but not okay to buy someone elses jugaad.

....allocate your 60K for tyres + misc repairs.



... absolutely shoddy build. Don't expect Gypsy-like peace of the mind. Niggles ...preparations



...Bangalore prices, but 1.5 lakhs seems awfully high for a 23 year old Jeep.


I'd go with GTO's approach to buying this vehicle. It's remarkably easy to reset odometers on almost any vehicle. I don't know much about Mahindra 4x4s, but the one thing I am sure of is that the basic build quality is rather shoddy (under-carriage rust, jittery suspension, hubs, steering column/dampers, electricals etc) for a 4by.


One spin in the dirt, and a few bumps on, and you'll have half the vehicle coming undone. I've seen some Mahindras with fantastic mods - but then, they're not stock vehicles.


Also, Wolf, with any second-hand 4by, you've gotta set aside some money... the more your car loves you, the more problems it reveals. Of course, branding helps - when I got my Patrol, she was in great shape, but from experience I knew there'd be issues. I got lucky, though - and the fact that it was a Patrol helped. Just new tyres and new shockers, a few diff seals etc. The actual transfer case and drivetrain were as bullet-proof as expected, and the electricals were top notch. My mate, who bought a Toyota 4Runner (now called Hilux, and sold in India as Fortuner, I think) and the poor guy suffered till he sold it in disgust.


However, I have no idea of the engines Mahindra 4bies come with. Don't Mahindras run on Diesel? That means you'll get some pretty good range for off-road trips(...my next Patrol will surely be diesel powered - diesels rock!)


I went 4WDing in The Holy Land in 1994 when I was there- which was the last time I was there - and I bought an ex-army Jonga via a friend in ND. It had only 3 gears, and could tow a shopping mall! no bells and whistles - but bullet-proof petrol engine (well, it's a 1950s Nissan engine anyway). I variably drove the J, and occasionally swapped with my mate's Suzuki Maruti Gypsy (couldn't remember the name till I saw it here!) when I needed some air-conditioning. Gypsies were sold in Oz as Vitaras back then, and are now sold with a 1.3 Litre petrol motor as Jimnies.


I'm familiar with a fair bit of Indie-lingo, but please do tell me what a Jugaad is, GTO? Sorry to sound like a noob


Khan Sultan's 540 (Mahindra?) is fantastic... looks like it's in good nick, though I don't see any spare wheel (fitted inside, perhaps?)


Oh, and does OTR stand for Off-The-Road, please?


Also, if you're really going to head off-road, with your family or so, at any point, this page'll give you some pointers on what kind of equipment you'll be spending on (keep in mind that there's a bit of sponsor-spin there, and that Indian brands/prices/equipment could be rather different - cheaper, I hope -- nothing like a li'l research!) though I don't know about a UHF tranciever or a DVD player in a Mahindra, which is much smaller than a Patrol. I also have no clue about what radios/frequencies are used in India.

Pats Patrol


For the drive-test, I'd go with GTO's pointers... and probably also recommend that you try driving it up a 10 degree gradient for about 2-3 kilometers. That way, ignition issues / a bad engine-tune / setting / radiator rust (via the coolant overflow) would show up


If the vehicle weighs about 1.3 tons (from memory) and runs a 1.5-2.0 Liter petrol engine, you should be able to climb a 10 degree gradient at about 45-50km/hr (at least) on second/third gear without having to pull in low-range power.


Diesel engines are not my forte, but from experience, if it comes with anything bigger than a 1.5 Liter diesel, it should pull you up the gradient on 3rd gear without any drama - avg speed would depend on whether it's turbocharged or not, and also on whether it is a direct-injection diesel.


Of course, I'm presuming that the a/c is turned off, and you're in 2WD mode on a tarmac road. If the gradient has any chicanes, you'll also get to test power steering / suspension performance.


I reckon I'm learning a fair bit myself about Indian 4bies - whenever my next trip to The Holy Land is... thanks folks!
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Old 9th May 2010, 17:22   #18
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News to everyone following this thred: most likely I will finalize on my purchase TODAY. I am meeting the owner of jeep that I have fairly finalized at 3pm today, hopefully I will nail the deal...wish me luck folks!!!

Thank you all for all the advices and suggestions, Tbhp never fails
Wolf, just get the silencer re routed to original spec and the rear foot board seems to be low or too wide which will obstruct when departing.
Wish you good luck.
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Old 9th May 2010, 17:30   #19
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Originally Posted by undrkvabrtha View Post


Khan Sultan's 540 (Mahindra?) is fantastic... looks like it's in good nick, though I don't see any spare wheel (fitted inside, perhaps?)
So Shahnawaz, you finally made the transit over to the dark side... Is this why you went spares shopping with us JEEPERS in JC road
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Old 9th May 2010, 17:38   #20
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....most likely I will finalize on my purchase TODAY. I am meeting the owner of jeep that I have fairly finalized at 3pm today, hopefully I will nail the deal...wish me luck folks
Congrats & all the best. Hope you have a jeep mechanic/garage sorted out to take care of your jeep. The bigger problem, then getting a good jeep, is finding a good garage.

See you at the next OTR :-)

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Originally Posted by undrkvabrtha View Post
...
I'm familiar with a fair bit of Indie-lingo, but please do tell me what a Jugaad is, ......
Oh, and does OTR stand for Off-The-Road, please?

...!
Jugaad: Home grown contraption...
OTR: Off The Road


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Originally Posted by Red Liner View Post
So Shahnawaz, you finally made the transit over to the dark side... Is this why you went spares shopping with us JEEPERS in JC road
He he. I think he refers to Kirans caterpillar I posted. No way I am buying a clatter box :-)
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Old 9th May 2010, 18:31   #21
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Bad news guys...I saw the Jeep, also had a detailed conversation with the mechanic who takes care of it. I told the mechanic that I intend to do some serious 4x4 off roading along with a few 1000K+ km tarmac trips as and when I feel like. Well his response was not negative as such but he suggested that I find a DI or MDI mill with a 5 speed gbox and swap the existing 87 rebuild (by himself) for my purpose

He was pretty confident that the existing engine is in good shape but as I pushed him on reliability and minimal maintenence he was quick to suggest a DI or MDI...

He stressed that the chassis, suspension and state of the budy is top notch but the 87 engine with a 4 speed gbox wasnt to his deep liking when I mentioned "long distance"!!! Also, the differential-propeller shaft joint was leaking quite a bit :(

The Jeep indeed is in a great state aesthetically with good engine and gbox but it just isnt something that the mech thought he should recommend as against the intent of my purchase.

I am thouroghly confused now, can someone help me with my desiion making PLEASE??!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 9th May 2010, 20:22   #22
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The mechanic has indeed deeply confused you. His suggestion is not correct from offroading point of view, that is probably because he has no idea about offroading.

More than 90% of the diesel offroading Jeeps run on the IDI Peugeot engine, the very same engine in that Jeep. My Jeep has the same engine. For offroading, that engine is just perfect. But for the highway driving, your mechanic is right.
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Old 9th May 2010, 20:51   #23
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Originally Posted by The Wolf View Post
Bad news guys...I saw the Jeep, also had a detailed conversation with the mechanic who takes care of it. I told the mechanic that I intend to do some serious 4x4 off roading along with a few 1000K+ km tarmac trips as and when I feel like. Well his response was not negative as such but he suggested that I find a DI or MDI mill with a 5 speed gbox and swap the existing 87 rebuild (by himself) for my purpose

He was pretty confident that the existing engine is in good shape but as I pushed him on reliability and minimal maintenence he was quick to suggest a DI or MDI...

He stressed that the chassis, suspension and state of the budy is top notch but the 87 engine with a 4 speed gbox wasnt to his deep liking when I mentioned "long distance"!!! Also, the differential-propeller shaft joint was leaking quite a bit :(

The Jeep indeed is in a great state aesthetically with good engine and gbox but it just isnt something that the mech thought he should recommend as against the intent of my purchase.

I am thouroghly confused now, can someone help me with my desiion making PLEASE??!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its a JEEP thing

Actually i am also confused now. First you need to decide on your priorities and compromises. you want to do serious off-roading as well as 1000km trips, which means a very reliable JEEP and you dont want to visit a mechanic often, obviously mechanics doesn't like this . if he has done a rebuild then he must be confident that it could travel 1000km. you cannot travel with the DI with the noise it makes.

Mine is 88 model, stock. Its my daily drive + OTR + long drives on weekends(500+ kms)

For your requirements, you better find one MM550 which comes with XD3P and 5 speed gearbox.

Or find a jeeper in your area or where the jeep is located and let him test drive and decide it for you.

Last edited by star_aqua : 9th May 2010 at 20:56.
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Old 9th May 2010, 21:03   #24
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Its a JEEP thing

Actually i am also confused now. First you need to decide on your priorities and compromises. you want to do serious off-roading as well as 1000km trips, which means a very reliable JEEP and you dont want to visit a mechanic often, obviously mechanics doesn't like this . if he has done a rebuild then he must be confident that it could travel 1000km. you cannot travel with the DI with the noise it makes.

Mine is 88 model, stock. Its my daily drive + OTR + long drives on weekends(500+ kms)

For your requirements, you better find one MM550 which comes with XD3P and 5 speed gearbox.

Or find a jeeper in your area or where the jeep is located and let him test drive and decide it for you.
You are right in almost everything you are saying I guess- I was contemplating a 550 but none are available for under 1.50-1-75L here in blore. But I know a bunch of them are available for that price up north, especially Punjab...but I dont know anyone there to check the vehicle! Driving down would be super fun if someone helps me find one there though

Have found a 550 in kerala, let me see if I can get that materialized...till then Blore jeepers please HELPPP!!! I need a Jeeeeep!!!!

One more question for the veterans here, as I have found quite a number of good 540s which are 2 wheel drives, what would be the ease and expense of converting one into a 4x4??? Does anyone recommend that at all???

Last edited by The Wolf : 9th May 2010 at 21:06.
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Old 9th May 2010, 22:54   #25
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Samurai has a smaller jeep and that old peugeot pushes it around very nicely. However, there is a big difference in performance between the old 4.90 and the army xd3p in the mm550. I think your mechanic is right. As suggested in an earlier post, go for a jeep with the xd3p engine, it is well worth it.
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Old 10th May 2010, 11:23   #26
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Samurai has a smaller jeep and that old peugeot pushes it around very nicely. However, there is a big difference in performance between the old 4.90 and the army xd3p in the mm550. I think your mechanic is right. As suggested in an earlier post, go for a jeep with the xd3p engine, it is well worth it.
Yeah the mech suggested I transplant the existing with a xd3p, DI or MDI and I guess he said I could retain the gbox as it is if I intended. I am not sure if that is feasible technically! The experts here could throw some light...

I will be meeting one Mr Fazil Khan near Kammanahalli today, he is a jeep reseller and supposedly has a couple of good mm540s which are '92+ models. Will click and bring some pics so that everyone here can guide me appropriately...

Last edited by The Wolf : 10th May 2010 at 11:28.
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Old 10th May 2010, 12:09   #27
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Wolf if your budget is around 2.5 lakhs then the best bet available is Caterpillar. Most of these jeeps i have seen and trialed (if not discussed with experts and people who knew the vehicles) and trust me nothing comes close to the cat. It will require very minor attention and you are ready to go, highway city or trail.

If budget is the priority check for jeep outside BLR, prices are crazy and gone over the roof.

Also note that jeeps are very different to regular cars and for that matter even the Gypsy, so be prepared before diving in. They need attention, will be cranky at times and don't believe in fast city life, they are used to lazy beach chair attitude. Either you love it and build a relation with it OR will hate it and put it in classifieds within a year.

All the very best.
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Old 10th May 2010, 13:10   #28
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Wolf if your budget is around 2.5 lakhs then the best bet available is Caterpillar. Most of these jeeps i have seen and trialed (if not discussed with experts and people who knew the vehicles) and trust me nothing comes close to the cat. It will require very minor attention and you are ready to go, highway city or trail.

If budget is the priority check for jeep outside BLR, prices are crazy and gone over the roof.

Also note that jeeps are very different to regular cars and for that matter even the Gypsy, so be prepared before diving in. They need attention, will be cranky at times and don't believe in fast city life, they are used to lazy beach chair attitude. Either you love it and build a relation with it OR will hate it and put it in classifieds within a year.

All the very best.
Hey Jaggu, my budget is 1.75L strictly for the Jeep, additional customization expense will be progressivley elaborated in the next 30-45 days. Having said that, I prefer Jeeps that havent done serious offroading due to irrepairable impact on the chassis. Mild OTR machines are acceptable I guess.

Dont worry about the lifestyle changes that I have to make after owning a Jeep, completely ready and prepared for it since last 6 odd months
I dont mind doing rounds to the garage on normal maintenance, precautionary checks etc but not to fix my previous owner's abuses, you see what Im saying.

Hey, you are from Kerala right, do you have any contacts there which can help the cause??

Thank you bro...



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Also note that jeeps are very different to regular cars and for that matter even the Gypsy, so be prepared before diving in. They need attention, will be cranky at times and don't believe in fast city life, they are used to lazy beach chair attitude. Either you love it and build a relation with it OR will hate it and put it in classifieds within a year..
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Old 10th May 2010, 21:19   #29
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Originally Posted by The Wolf View Post
Hey Jaggu, my budget is 1.75L strictly for the Jeep, additional customization expense will be progressivley elaborated in the next 30-45 days. Having said that, I prefer Jeeps that havent done serious offroading due to irrepairable impact on the chassis. Mild OTR machines are acceptable I guess.
On the contrary the chassis will be aok in jeeps even compared to gypsies and these vehicles better kept since reliability is an absolute must in OTR's.


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Hey, you are from Kerala right, do you have any contacts there which can help the cause??

Thank you bro...
And i bought the jeep from BLR!

I have contacts but mostly useless since they are busy with their professional lifes and lost interest in jeeps So am not of much use, sorry.
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Old 10th May 2010, 22:44   #30
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Default MM 540 with xd3p

Hey guys, an update, I have received a lead...an MM 540 with a bolero xd3p engine. Am going tomorrow noon to check the vehicle with Jammy. I am seriously hoping that I bump into a good build.

Pray for me guys
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