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Old 15th July 2010, 16:01   #796
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Default thar rear seating format

I was always been sceptical about old mahindra rear bench seats (side facing)...i always wished to have forward facing comfortable seats with good seat belts..as human being we tend to look in the direction of movement...neck-ache..need to grab something to hod on to it...therby being criticised by family members...

In my hard-top Invader...I had to remove them and I've planted a customised seat bench (easily acommadating 3 adults) facing forward and I've also installed 2 seat belts...this vehicle also has a front navigator double-folding seat (Toyota Innova)...for passenger entry/exit.

All this from a local fabricator...and I hated him when he drilled / welded the floor and the side walls to do so...still not sure how good are they if I stretched them to hardships..

I wish M&M offers a boltable shaft (both hardtop/softop) allowing users to customise the rear seats after the vehicle has been sold (if they've any restrictions to sell them in this seating format)..without having to drill/weld and ruin anything inside the cabin..

Thanks
Pavan
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Old 15th July 2010, 16:09   #797
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Good to know its roomy. Now I am waiting when this Thar will come to Delhi area. Need to check her out. Right now I guess she's mostly in south and west India.
Why don't you come down to this area, will be glad to show you the vehicle and then may be a ...

Spike
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Old 16th July 2010, 09:07   #798
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Exclamation The Buying Experience Aspect

Dear Vinod Nookala, Behram Sir, Spike-Prateesh,

The discussion on Thar has touched all aspects from the famous IFS/Solid, SFRA/FFRA and low-hanging cat-con, CMVR aspect, Farming Equipment in SA/Euro, to the current series of valid questions from Tanveer-TSK about high altitude testing and Range.

Few of them have been answered convincingly, few not-so, few yet to be... We can understand why...

I have a to ask a simple question, with a bit of (my) history to it with valid reasons. This is to be classified under 'Buying Experience'.

Back in 2005, the Jeep/4WD bug had bit me, and one night sitting in the office I came across a superb pictorial advertisement of a vehicle from TATA - it was a lifestyle 4x4 and looked promising. The same weekend, me and my fiancee drove to Prerana Motors in Lalbagh road and walked into a Swanky Showroom (then) and sifted thru the Indica's and Sumo's and Safari's.

I asked the 1st person who greeted me, "I am here to check out the TL 4x4".

"Blink - Blink -- TL What?"

"It is a TataMobile Kinda Vehicle, 4wd, etc"

"Sir, this is the PASSENGER Car Division, Please go a few buildings ahead, you will see the goods vehicle div"

I went, had to, loved the looks (back then) of the TL.

"I am here to see the TL 4x4"

"Ennu saar"

"TelcoLine...."

Had a horrid time as a 'Passenger division' customer to walk into a 'commercial vehicles' sales center and ask for a test drive...

"Saar, ennuku saar, farm idhiyaa?, cement bag haakutiraa"

"NO - I dont have a farm and dont intend to drive cement bags around...!! - Can I just get a TD"

"OK saar"

In the TD (This was my 1st ever Drive of a 4WD)

"So by turning the 4wd knob, it goes from a 2wd to 4wd eh?"

"Yes sir, just press clutch once after engaging 4wd, and it will engage"

'Ok, at least he got that right'

"Saar - also check out the 407 DCPU DI PwrStr, its much smoother than this and can carry more load"

"DAMN..!!"

Fiancee - "Are you going to start a truck company"

"Saar - it is 11L on road, if its expensive for you, try the 407 'S'CPU or even better - the new ACE - it is selling HOT"

I ran out of the place...!!

I frankly had a HORRID time just because TATA could not decide whether the TL 4x4 was a Passenger Div vehicle or a Commercial Div vehicle.

Why all this blah about TATA, when this is a M&M thread?

FF to 2008, After the 11Lakh experience of a TL Test Drive - I mustered enough courage to take my fiancee again to the great "Vijay" motors in Museum Road. After all they are the "#1" Showroom in this part of the world"

"Hello, I am here to check out the Major 4x4"

"Saar, go talk to manager, he will give you address of Commercial Vehicles div"

"Duh - it is made to carry 8-10 humans, it is not a commercial vehicle"

"Sorry sir, all Commanders, Maxxi's, Major's, 650DP's, taxi kind of Vehicles are sold from there - here you go... Lalbagh road, Vijay motors"

No way I am going again to a commercial Vehicles showroom with a lady beside me. Exit quickly and few days later rode alone to the Comm vehicles dept.

It was a 'shop' with 1 shutter, a table+chair, and a fan on the top. They were displaying the M&M Pickup inside the shop and one had to squeeze through the sides of the Jeep to go behind it and sit in the chair. They seemed to understand why I needed a 4x4 and told me for a TD i need to go till Peenya Yard (which is around 30kms from city center), and just drive a few 100 meters inside the yard. I dropped the idea and a year later got my current Jeep...

--------------------------------------------------------------

What ever you do, please remember that no-Way a customer (passenger unit) will walk to a "Shop" with his lady and kids in any car, and face a barrage of questions like "Farm, cement, why 4x4, et all". Please make up your mind whether the Thar is going to be a Life Style Vehicle to be sold thru a showroom, or a 7-8 seater commercial vehicle sold through..."

Going by the drift of this thread, it looks like M&M is going to target the larger 2Wd population 7 seater market. This customer base will seldom walk into a passenger showroom, they know where their 'kind of' vehicles are sold...

It is going to be a tough call you have to make...

PS - I did not learn till that day in 2005 that DCPU is Double Cabin Pick Up and SCPU is for Single...

Last edited by svsantosh : 16th July 2010 at 09:11.
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Old 16th July 2010, 09:17   #799
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Nice experience Santosh, I had similar experience when I walked into Force motors dealership with wife, 6 years old kid and a 4 month old infant to test drive the Force Gama. I only got to test drive the 2WD Gama since they didn't have 4WD in stock.
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Old 16th July 2010, 09:46   #800
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svsantosh View Post

Fiancee - "Are you going to start a truck company"

FF to 2008, After the 11Lakh experience of a TL Test Drive - I mustered enough courage to take my fiancee again...
svsantosh,
That was a very good example of how the sales division sometime works.

Also congratulations, as you have a very brave lady as your wife.
Regards,
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Old 16th July 2010, 10:13   #801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svsantosh View Post

What ever you do, please remember that no-Way a customer (passenger unit) will walk to a "Shop" with his lady and kids in any car, and face a barrage of questions like "Farm, cement, why 4x4, et all". Please make up your mind whether the Thar is going to be a Life Style Vehicle to be sold thru a showroom, or a 7-8 seater commercial vehicle sold through..."

Going by the drift of this thread, it looks like M&M is going to target the larger 2Wd population 7 seater market. This customer base will seldom walk into a passenger showroom, they know where their 'kind of' vehicles are sold...

It is going to be a tough call you have to make...

PS - I did not learn till that day in 2005 that DCPU is Double Cabin Pick Up and SCPU is for Single...
Very well said. I also endured the same thing while buying my Bolero and know what you talking about.

Front sales executive education is must if this vehicle has to have any success in the market.
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Old 16th July 2010, 11:23   #802
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Savantosh - thanks for sharing your experience. Puts a lot of things in perspective.

Think about the treatment you will get when you take it for service! Hope these isnt a seperate service division for COMMERCIAL vehicles!!

Cheers
Ankit
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Old 16th July 2010, 11:35   #803
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Thankfully, Tata got their act right, and now have the twin cab Xenon in private car showrooms.
Mahindra will need to do the same. Thar should be sitting next to the scorpio, and not be sold with "major and stuff".
Ditto for service.
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Old 16th July 2010, 13:43   #804
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svsantosh View Post
Going by the drift of this thread, it looks like M&M is going to target the larger 2Wd population 7 seater market. This customer base will seldom walk into a passenger showroom, they know where their 'kind of' vehicles are sold...

It is going to be a tough call you have to make...
Hi Santosh,

This is a very good feedback. Let me state once again the vehicle has 7 seater configuration only because of a few regulations and not because we want to make it a people mover. Your inputs were already at the back of our minds while the domestic version was still being planned. We as a team are fully committed in ensuring the same.

Spike
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Old 16th July 2010, 13:59   #805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
similar experience when I walked into Force motors dealership with wife, 6 years old kid and a 4 month old infant to test drive the Force Gama...
Very brave of you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fazalaliadil View Post
That was a very good example of how the sales division sometime works
Somehow I feel the commercial guys know more about a vehicle than a Passenger div. It is a life and death situation sometimes, and I have a very good (but OT) example for that. So not writing it here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MileCruncher View Post
Front sales executive education is must if this vehicle has to have any success in the market.
Also M&M has to decide which front sales exec is going to sell it - the passenger or the commercial one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSlow View Post
Think about the treatment you will get when you take it for service! Hope these isnt a seperate service division for COMMERCIAL vehicles
The Autho service station is only for the passenger div. For the commercial vehicles there is always the Galli Ka Mechanic...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Thankfully, Tata got their act right...
How true, they took the risk and it was worth it. After all the Xenon is not a goods carrier...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR View Post
This is a very good feedback.

Your inputs were already at the back of our minds while the domestic version was still being planned
Thanks Pratheesh - anything to make one's hardwork not go in vain. Plz plz push Vinod and team to avoid my post's experience...
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Old 16th July 2010, 14:04   #806
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All that is being said about seating arrangements, I am having second thoughts on Thar now. Its going to hurt (financially) taking out the original seatings at the rear and putting up front facing (2 Seater). Wonder if the damage would be anything less than 50K.

Further, I am yet to buy a sofa for the living room of my new place. So maybe I can use those rear seats (7ers) and use them as sofa. I don't mind but then my wife is an Architect. And for the sake of repetition, she is my wife. She always wins :(
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Old 16th July 2010, 15:30   #807
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All that is being said about seating arrangements, I am having second thoughts on Thar now. Its going to hurt (financially) taking out the original seatings at the rear and putting up front facing (2 Seater). Wonder if the damage would be anything less than 50K.
If swapping out the side facing seats with front facing rear seat is giving you second thoughts about the Thar, the Thar maynot be vehicle for you. In order to do this, you will need the following:

1) A set of spanners
2) Used middle row seat from Scorpio/Safari/Qualis, etc which has the 1/3 and 2/3 rd split (The used parts market of your city will have this).
3) A drill
4) Butch of nuts and bolts
5) Decent mechanic can do this for you under two hours flat.

I know this since I have done this in my 540.
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Old 16th July 2010, 16:05   #808
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If swapping out the side facing seats with front facing rear seat is giving you second thoughts about the Thar, the Thar maynot be vehicle for you. In order to do this, you will need the following:

1) A set of spanners
2) Used middle row seat from Scorpio/Safari/Qualis, etc which has the 1/3 and 2/3 rd split (The used parts market of your city will have this).
3) A drill
4) Butch of nuts and bolts
5) Decent mechanic can do this for you under two hours flat.

I know this since I have done this in my 540.
I live in Mumbai and will never have time to go offroading (unless in times like these ofcourse when it rains in Mumbai and the entire city gets converted to a huge sewerage and makes for pretty challenging offroading track). I am a sucker for the good looks of the Jeeps and that would be the sole reason why I was interested in Thar in the first place. There are seldom things that turn my head the way a Classic does it and expect Thar to be a headturner as well.

When I think of driving a Jeep with the soft-top off and 7er rear seats visible, I somehow feel that this would make Thar look terribly boring (read drab) to look at.

Customization (I am taking the liberty to call changing seats customization) is not something that I had in mind for a vehicle that would be a fresh fruit straight out of a showroom.
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Old 16th July 2010, 16:21   #809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animesh View Post
All that is being said about seating arrangements, I am having second thoughts on Thar now. Its going to hurt (financially) taking out the original seatings at the rear and putting up front facing (2 Seater). Wonder if the damage would be anything less than 50K.

Further, I am yet to buy a sofa for the living room of my new place. So maybe I can use those rear seats (7ers) and use them as sofa. I don't mind but then my wife is an Architect. And for the sake of repetition, she is my wife. She always wins :(
Its an age old philosophical question. If you say something in a forest with nobody else around including your wife, are you still WRONG???

I expect you could do this with new plush seat covers over a reconditioned seat or seat(s) for under 4,000 rupees depending how fancy you get. As Tini, 4x4addict, said, this is very easy to do.

I gave my double inward facing seats to a friend who uses them for outdoor seating on his porch.

Last edited by DirtyDan : 16th July 2010 at 16:24.
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Old 16th July 2010, 20:28   #810
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animesh View Post
When I think of driving a Jeep with the soft-top off and 7er rear seats visible, I somehow feel that this would make Thar look terribly boring (read drab) to look at.
Unfortunately a certain set of people are going to be disappointing with every product. It is tough to make every body happy. As spike explained our crazy regulations require them to make it a seven seater and the only way to do this in the Thar is to make make rear seats side facing. Any body who really wants the Thar will not let the seat configuration prevent them from buying a Thar.

Last edited by 4x4addict : 16th July 2010 at 20:33.
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