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Old 21st May 2010, 12:08   #61
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Originally Posted by Muzungu View Post
i heard something called 'THAR Sport' will also be coming as an upgraded version, from the factory itself for those with extra $$$!

is this true?
Muzungu,
No... not at all, it is not true.
The Thar itself has gone through much to try and get in the Indian market, lets welcome it with crackers. There is no SPORTS even in the far future.
Regards,
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Old 21st May 2010, 12:57   #62
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I totally agree with most people here. Since it is also mentioned that design changes cannot take place at this stage, a Army spec Thar is all we want with those lovely tyres, trinklets, handles, grills, etc. Also, as DKG or Fazal Sir mentioned, it would be lovely to see a slightly slanting back to cut out the boxy look.

Great to see M&M doing something as per what people have always asked for. Kudos to you guys!
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Old 22nd May 2010, 00:00   #63
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i would like to buy a 4WD THAR with PS, AC and removable & lockable HT with pricing being around 6L!

its my diwali/Xmas wishlist for the 'Santa'!
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Old 22nd May 2010, 11:08   #64
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Guys , don't get me wrong, we (regular 4x4 users) are grateful for the Thar however, the way the 'premature congratulations' on this thread are taking off, it feels like drinking a glass full of rasgulla syrup (ie makes me feel ill).
There is heaps more M&M could have done if it was serious about this segment. However they have given some enthusiasts in the Company a shoestring budget and told them to make the best they can with severely limited allowance.
We Indians have been given the Thar which is a farm implement (like a spade) in Europe and that is appreciated (kind of) by Africans.
The way the praise is flowing it looks like this is a replacement for the Space Shuttle Atlantis.
Any way, it looks like I will be buying one if it is circa Rs 6L - 7L OTR.

Mr BD, I hope this takes off and you get to set up a skunkworks like the original M team at BMW or the AMG Mob at Merc.
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Old 22nd May 2010, 11:44   #65
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Some of you may have very well achieved demigod status in the offroading world and ideally would like Nasa to build a suitable offroader worthy of your talents. Sorry you are in the wrong thread as I doubt any manufacturer is interested in catering to this limited exalted group of offroaders.

What we have here is the general population who are exploring their first forays into leisure offroading.

In the Thar we have an extremely capable vehicle which can deliver more than what most would expect of it

This is not the F1 world of offroading so there's no point in going on and on about the "compromise" solution many hardcore offroaders believe the Thar to be. For the kind of usage the car is most likely to be put to it is not a "compromise" offering. Please be very clear about that !

BTW F1 cars are not bought off the shelf. They are built to suit the driving styles of the respective drivers. Likewise hardcore offroaders don't expect Jeep or Toyota to build something to their requirements. They simply build their own machines

Last edited by DKG : 22nd May 2010 at 11:48.
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Old 22nd May 2010, 12:00   #66
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I seem to have hit a raw nerve, that was not the intent, I just thought you were over the top with the praise.
Also acknowledge that I check the Thar thread regularly and am keenly following the development of this aam admi (gen population)4x4 that you reckon it is.
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Old 22nd May 2010, 12:34   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KMT View Post
Guys , don't get me wrong, we (regular 4x4 users) are grateful for the Thar however, the way the 'premature congratulations' on this thread are taking off, it feels like drinking a glass full of rasgulla syrup (ie makes me feel ill).
There is heaps more M&M could have done if it was serious about this segment. However they have given some enthusiasts in the Company a shoestring budget and told them to make the best they can with severely limited allowance.
We Indians have been given the Thar which is a farm implement (like a spade) in Europe and that is appreciated (kind of) by Africans.
The way the praise is flowing it looks like this is a replacement for the Space Shuttle Atlantis.
Any way, it looks like I will be buying one if it is circa Rs 6L - 7L OTR.
I have the same feeling here.. and am not in a wrong thread.
Some more threads coming up in parallel with a different topic name and finally the discussion ends up with the same topic. over praising will always lead to over expectation and finally when the product is out, people may have disappointments. Finally we have only one topic, that is OTR price which decides everything. everyone wanted if not as an offroader then as a replacement for the hatches. yes i would go for it as my future car if it has car comfort i.e hardtop and AC. nothing else i want. And it is better to wait until the OTR price is decided by M&M. If they overprice it, then they will get the feedback immediately. later they will offer discounts(like they did with invaders).
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Old 22nd May 2010, 12:47   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKG View Post
Some of you may have very well achieved demigod status in the offroading world and ideally would like Nasa to build a suitable offroader worthy of your talents. Sorry you are in the wrong thread as I doubt any manufacturer is interested in catering to this limited exalted group of offroaders.

For the kind of usage the car is most likely to be put to it is not a "compromise" offering. Please be very clear about that !
You can tell all of this from a test drive?

Why all the sarcasm about demigods and Nasa? By the way, NASA is being reamed for their shoddy engineering and selling out to suppliers and private interests.

And, are you so sure M&M is not going to launch a more, excuse the expression, "pure" off-roader. I am not at all sure....
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Old 22nd May 2010, 13:04   #69
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Wow!! this is an intresting thread, I have missed a lot of happenings. Lucky I got it. I love jeeps and a modded jeep always attracts/fantacises me. I have a dream to have a Army 550 xd for its mean looks. As the experts comment it not only inspires me but brings in the refined knowledge, experince as learning. Thanks for that Gurus. I personally know Fazal Saab and he has been doing seamless work on jeeps esp 550 XD and I have become a fan of Fazal Saab. His recent make up of a similar 550 XD which he named as Safari made me drool.

DKG sir you've got a wonderful CJ I show it to all my guys (painter, denter) as an referance or inspiration to make my jeep a wonderful machine.
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Old 22nd May 2010, 15:31   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by star_aqua View Post
over praising
Many people here had decided the Thar is not an offroader. For a few people here who have driven the car that conclusion no longer seems foregone !! You call our rejection of the premise that its not a offroader over praising? On that score what do we call your emphatic rejection of a vehicle without ever test driving it?

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Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
You can tell all of this from a test drive?
Just drive the car DD you will be surprised

Quote:
Why all the sarcasm about demigods and Nasa?
A test drive report and subsequent discussions are called "sugar syrup", the Thar is judged to be a "farm implement", R&D engineers at M&M are called "some enthusiasts", and interestingly they claim the vehicle was developed on a "shoe string budget" and there is annoyance that the discussion makes the Thar sound like a "space shuttle replacement" !!

What sarcasm are you talking about DD?

Quote:
And, are you so sure M&M is not going to launch a more, excuse the expression, "pure" off-roader. I am not at all sure....
Where have I implied knowledge of M&M's future plans?

If you know a "pure" offroader is on its way good for you DD

Last edited by DKG : 22nd May 2010 at 15:34.
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Old 23rd May 2010, 06:32   #71
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Let me confirm that that the percieved sarcasm was statement of fact-
1) Is the Thar Road Legal in Western Europe -(No)
2) Outiside india, where else has it been well recd - (in Africa)
3)Shoestring budget for development -(dont even go there, the yanks developed this series back in the '50s, we have not even bothered to try and freshen up the apperance and crashworthiness, recycled MMBody, Bolero Back end , xylo engine, scorpio front end- I am sure go get the point).
4)Enthusiasts Developing it- Looking at the lack of safety equipment and and lack of any change in its appearance, do you think this is something that has been run out of 'mainstream' M&M?- I think not.
5)Basic things a lot of guys have been crying out for have not been included -(ABS, LSD/Difflock, Airbags, Collapsible steering column).
Does it deserve the praise it has got from some of the reviewers- the jury is out on that.
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Old 23rd May 2010, 08:12   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KMT View Post
1)Is the Thar Road Legal in Western Europe -(No)
Is the Mahindra Major or Commander or Force Trax road legal in India? Yes. We are not discussing the viablity of the Thar in Western Europe but India

Quote:
2) Outiside india, where else has it been well recd - (in Africa)
I'm afraid that logic really doesn't hold. India and many other developing markets will be unique. Ask Skoda about what they think of the Octavia's success in India. Do you know that Skoda is the last car you think of when trying to buy cars abroad?

You really think you could sell the Qualis abroad they way they sold in India?

Quote:
3)Shoestring budget for development
You seem pretty unclear about your facts. A modern offroader won't cost you anything less that 15 lacs minimum, maybe even more, with latest tech. Get real buddy, this is India where the bulk can't afford vehicles let alone buying cars at even 7 lacs

Quote:
4)Enthusiasts Developing it- Looking at the lack of safety equipment and and lack of any change in its appearance, do you think this is something that has been run out of 'mainstream' M&M?- I think not
Once again you seem totally unclear about facts. It costs close to a billion dollars to produce a brand new car my dear friend. Which world do you use as reference? No manufacturer on the planet is so foolish to spend billions of dollars to make stand alone products. Its all about component sharing, cost rationalisation. Sit with any production engineer and he'll explain why that has become so essential. If Mahindra has taken a parts bin approach to the Thar that is, to tell you the truth, the only way you can keep costs down. You call this not mainstream?

For your information the Q7, Toureg and Cayenne share the same floorpan. I forget but I think A6 and Passat too. You call that cars made on shoestring budgets? BMW and Mercedes will slot the same engine across different product lines, is that manufacturing on a shoestring to you?

Quote:
5)Basic things a lot of guys have been crying out for have not been included -(ABS, LSD/Difflock, Airbags, Collapsible steering column).
You have the Toyota Fortuner at 23 lacs to satisfy your wants !!
Quote:
Does it deserve the praise it has got from some of the reviewers- the jury is out on that.
It sure deserves every ounce of praise when you take into account that from a Major/Commander/540 type of vehicle M&M has made a big leap forward with the Thar. Drive it to know the difference in all these vehicles
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Old 23rd May 2010, 10:45   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKG View Post
Is the Mahindra Major or Commander or Force Trax road legal in India? Yes. We are not discussing the viablity of the Thar in Western Europe but India

I'm afraid that logic really doesn't hold. India and many other developing markets will be unique. Ask Skoda about what they think of the Octavia's success in India. Do you know that Skoda is the last car you think of when trying to buy cars abroad?

You really think you could sell the Qualis abroad they way they sold in India?

You seem pretty unclear about your facts. A modern offroader won't cost you anything less that 15 lacs minimum, maybe even more, with latest tech. Get real buddy, this is India where the bulk can't afford vehicles let alone buying cars at even 7 lacs

Once again you seem totally unclear about facts. It costs close to a billion dollars to produce a brand new car my dear friend. Which world do you use as reference? No manufacturer on the planet is so foolish to spend billions of dollars to make stand alone products. Its all about component sharing, cost rationalisation. Sit with any production engineer and he'll explain why that has become so essential. If Mahindra has taken a parts bin approach to the Thar that is, to tell you the truth, the only way you can keep costs down. You call this not mainstream?

For your information the Q7, Toureg and Cayenne share the same floorpan. I forget but I think A6 and Passat too. You call that cars made on shoestring budgets? BMW and Mercedes will slot the same engine across different product lines, is that manufacturing on a shoestring to you?

You have the Toyota Fortuner at 23 lacs to satisfy your wants !!
It sure deserves every ounce of praise when you take into account that from a Major/Commander/540 type of vehicle M&M has made a big leap forward with the Thar. Drive it to know the difference in all these vehicles
looks like somebody stepped on 'Tiger's tail' and attracted his angry response!

take it easy Deepak, here everyone to his own knowledge and mind, that how comments and views are posted here!

i always wondered why people make a huge cry about skoda in india, when its not even looked at outside india!

even indian OEMs provide better products outside india compared to sold in india!

Qualis (Quality+ Service) was and outdated product launched in india when it was discountinued in other countries!

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Old 23rd May 2010, 12:43   #74
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Since the Thar will have a CRDe engine, I guess tampering with the electrical fittings will void the warranty.

Therefore M&M should provide a wiring harness with ready connectors for some additional fittings like lamps (roof mounted/front grill mounted/rear bumper mounted etc.) and other accesories etc. which an offroader enthusiast will install. There should be a 12 volt outlet (for GPS and other things) inside the cabin as well. There should be at least one lamp provided at the back of the cabin as well.

-Biju
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Old 23rd May 2010, 15:18   #75
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take it easy Deepak, here everyone to his own knowledge and mind, that how comments and views are posted here!
Very true but at the same time none of us should marginalise the efforts that have gone into creating the Thar. In many discussions with BD I have realised how much time, effort and care he has put into engineering solutions. To address him and his team as "some enthusiasts" and that the Thar was not a mainstream development is outright unfair and disrespectful.

Its perfectly alright if some people here have driven the Thar offroad and vocally trash it. I would not waste a moment to persuade them otherwise, as I do realise that people's choices and tastes differ.

But to have never driven a product and then most categorically denounce it, in my view it doesn't say much about how objective the person is

Ultimately people who like it will buy it and those who don't won't. No point in us wasting any time on debating about something most people here have never experienced.

Not too long ago BD was not sure the car will ever see the light of day here in India. Today I join BD and Fazal in atleast being happy that a wonderful option finally exists for the Indian buyer
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