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Old 6th September 2010, 07:40   #31
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Originally Posted by khan_sultan View Post
For me, it serves the purpose of a Cold Air Intake -- AT BEST. (it also looks good :-))
Sir, IMO generally cold air is available at a lower level than a higher level. So installing a snorkel and suggesting it as a CAI baffles me

@ Cougar: Interesting install, pl update on the progress. A few suggestions:

1. For regular water fording [until A,B,C under water] not much waterproofing required.

2. A good gas dampers work well in smoothing the ride.

3. 215/75 R15 tires are good enough!

4. A super king blower with a Sanden 507 will chill to the bones.

5. The rear seats can be removed and a mattress installed to accomodate 2 people

6. The OE HT is great and one just needs to slide the rear glass a little bit instead of an exhaust fan

7. The Axillary fan fitted in front of the Radiator should be a reputed one rather than a Chinese one!
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Old 6th September 2010, 09:26   #32
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1. For regular water fording [until A,B,C under water] not much waterproofing required.
Not doing anything specific to help in improving water fording characteristics. I figure i can do half-wheel level water crossings even without anything specific and for now that is enough for my needs.

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2. A good gas dampers work well in smoothing the ride.
3. 215/75 R15 tires are good enough!
Will change tyres and switch to gas dampers immediately after the AC fitting this week. Still waiting to hear from the installer! :(

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4. A super king blower with a Sanden 507 will chill to the bones.
Going for a Sanden 6V10 + SuperKing blower combo. I am considering paying a visit to the Sanden company to check for direct purchase options.

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5. The rear seats can be removed and a mattress installed to accomodate 2 people
Thats what i have now. The rear side facing seats have been removed and we currently curl up in our sleeping bags: much more comfortable than mattresses.

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6. The OE HT is great and one just needs to slide the rear glass a little bit instead of an exhaust fan
Not safe: either in a jungle or outside a dhaba. but any venting solution for this small a vehicle is going to be a compromise unless we do some serious cutting of the hard top.


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7. The Axillary fan fitted in front of the Radiator should be a reputed one rather than a Chinese one!
Check!
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Old 6th September 2010, 09:48   #33
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Default Latest update: Carputer

Was hoping to do the electrical cleanup on Sat/Sun. But couldn't source the required wires so that has been held up.

So i decided to spend the weekend building the carputer and while searching for a mini-ITX mobo and a suitable cabinet, quite by accident stumbled upon a great alternative that not only costs 1/4th of the alternative but also looks killer with circular blue led lights on the cabinet! Infact I was thinking of mounting it in a visible place like the rear of the seat or something! Will look real jhatang! :P

But seriously, finally mounting it UNDER the parcel tray on the right side and saving power by disconnecting the cabinet LED's. Now i have just have to figure out a suitable 19v PSU to power the box and the LCD.

Will be mounting the carputer immediately after the AC install so all pics then. Till then have to figure out how to create a suitable 2DIN outlet on the dashboard. Visiting a fibreglass specialist tomorrow to work out something.

Carputer Details: ZOTAC MAG, 160GB HDD (replacing this with a 64GB Flash purchased earlier for something else, for the OS and basic apps). It has Dual core Atom 330, HDMI + SVGA out, 2GB RAM, inbuilt video card, SPDIF out etc etc all in a very attractive and compact cabinet (180mm x 180mm x 38mm).

Hunting for a suitable 9V DC-DC automotive PSU to power the box.
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Old 6th September 2010, 10:16   #34
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Default Audio questions

Current setup:
In the front speaker sockets, i have 2 6" JBL component speakers. In addition, i have two rear-firing 4" JBL speakers mounted on an MDF board above the B-pillar: not the most optimum I know, but saving cabin space was more important (earlier i had two sony xplod 3 way speakers 6"x9" mounted in humongous wooden boxes, these sounded awesome but occupied too much space). Finally I have 2 tweeters donated to me by a generous T-bhpian which are mounted on the dashboard: i am not geeky enough yet to understand what these things do exactly, except look cool!

these speakers are all driven by a basic JVC HU which has USB input and a steering remote: pretty useful and has provided great service so far.

Now with the carputer coming in, the HU has to go because there simply isn't any space to keep both the carputer and the HU. So the carputer audio-out will need to be connected to a 2/4 channel amp.

Options being considered:
1. JBL 2channel GTS-S422. Rs.4200/-.
2. Sony 2 channel GTX6022 - Rs.3990/-.
3. JBL 4 channel GTS-S644 - Rs. 6995/-.
4. Sony 4 Channel GTX 6042 - Rs. 5990/-.

Does it make sense to go for a 4 channel amp now to leave space for expansion later - say a sub-woofer or something?

With a 2-channel amp, how would the output from the carputer be routed to 4 speakers? Will we need a Y-cable to split the signal coming out of the amp? How would it work with the 4-channel? where do the tweeters go? And in future, to mount the sub-woofer we will require 2 channels is it?

Any decent amps available which take SPDIF input since my PC supports that? Cost and pros/cons of that option?

with a 4-channel amp, routing to 4 speakers, but if we are providing stereo (2 channel) input, how does it transform it to 4 channel? Do car-amps work like the Onkyo type Home Theater systems and support Pro-Logic type processing? The car-amp will do that or do we need some computer hardware/software for that?

appreciate all help. Thanks in advance.

Last edited by COUGAR : 6th September 2010 at 10:26.
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Old 6th September 2010, 10:57   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
Sir, IMO generally cold air is available at a lower level than a higher level. So installing a snorkel and suggesting it as a CAI baffles me
Sure. This is not the first time you are baffled by what I have said/done, only to do the exact same thing some time later

PS: On a serious note, do read the post again and see that I have clearly mentioned that "for me, it is...". So, what the issue?? My vehicle and it's my way of describing what it is to me.

Last edited by khan_sultan : 6th September 2010 at 11:00.
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Old 6th September 2010, 11:18   #36
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Originally Posted by khan_sultan View Post
Sure. This is not the first time you are baffled by what I have said/done, only to do the exact same thing some time later
And every time you have returned the compliment i.e by chopping the rear over hang and fitting a snorkel
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Old 6th September 2010, 11:38   #37
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Interesting project i must say, and the carputer thing is the best idea.
Can you post specs of zotac mag? and which lcd you are planing to use?
Just a suggestion, try lookinn for onboard multichannel audio or usb based multichannel soundcard. It will give much better result then y cables (true 5.1/7.1 vs stereo).

Last edited by Jaggu : 6th September 2010 at 12:24. Reason: Please take time to type using proper punctuations. Thanks
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Old 6th September 2010, 11:56   #38
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Originally Posted by headers View Post
Sir, IMO generally cold air is available at a lower level than a higher level. So installing a snorkel and suggesting it as a CAI baffles me
Dear Vikram,
Just to understand this further.
Agreed that cold air would be available at a lower level.
But keeping the intake within the engine compartment, the chances of it sucking up hot air is higher since it is so close to the engine and the radiator, isn't it?
So, won't a snorkel outside the engine compartment help better than having a CAI inside the engine compartment?
Cheers,
Deepak
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Old 6th September 2010, 12:22   #39
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Default Snorkel

Quote:
Originally Posted by starter View Post
Dear Vikram,
Just to understand this further.
Agreed that cold air would be available at a lower level.
But keeping the intake within the engine compartment, the chances of it sucking up hot air is higher since it is so close to the engine and the radiator, isn't it?
So, won't a snorkel outside the engine compartment help better than having a CAI inside the engine compartment?
Cheers,
Deepak
Hi Deepak,

You have very effectively pointed out one of the Main Reason for a Snorkel.

i) The Temperature is significantly higher in the engine bay, an intake outside the engine bay will act like a CAI.

ii) There is more dust in the engine bay/fender level, a Raised Air-Intake aka Snorkel, increases the filter life.

iii) The vehicle is better prepared for fording obstacles.

Regards,

Arka
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Old 6th September 2010, 12:58   #40
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Originally Posted by insane_x97 View Post
Can you post specs of zotac mag? and which lcd you are planing to use?
Chipset NVIDIA®
GPU ION™
CPU Intel® Atom™ 330 (dual-core) (1.6 GHz) Intel® HyperThreading™ technology
Front-side bus 533 MHz
Memory DDR2-800
Storage Hard Drive 160GB 5400RPM
Expansion eSATA 3.0Gbps
Memory Card Reader 6-in-1 (MMC/SD/SDHC/MS/MS Pro/xD)
Networking
Ethernet 10/100/1000Mbps
WiFi 802.11n/g/b
3D API
DirectX DirectX 10
OpenGL OpenGL 3.1
Ports
HDMI 1 (HDCP w/8-channel digital audio)
VGA 1
e. SATA
1 (SATA 3.0 Gbps)
USB 2.0
6 (4 back panel, 1 front panel, 1 top panel)
Ethernet 10/100/1000Mbps (RJ45)
Audio Headphone jack, Microphone jack
Operating system
User installed (Windows XP, Vista, 7 and Linux ready)

Accessories
1 x Stand
1 x VESA mount
4 x Mounting screws
1 x AC adapter
1 x Power cord
1 x Warranty card
1 x User manual
1 x Driver CD

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Originally Posted by insane_x97 View Post
Just a suggestion, try lookinn for onboard multichannel audio or usb based multichannel soundcard. It will give much better result then y cables (true 5.1/7.1 vs stereo).
That was the original plan: getting a P410 based Mobo and a true multichannel audio based card or built-in, and then build from the ground up.

BUt the ZOTAC has its advantages! The ZOTAC does have a SPDIF output with true multichannel capabilities: I just dont know how to exploit it yet.


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Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
iii) The vehicle is better prepared for fording obstacles.
From a purely Cold-air intake effeciency perspective, wouldnt a direct pipe routed direct from the bonnet (say ahead or above the radiator: see earlier post on this) be more effective than a snorkel with all the twisting pipes? A snorkel has multiple advantages though.

From a water fording perspective, what are the changes to be done? Your inputs would be much appreciated.
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Old 6th September 2010, 13:18   #41
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Default Water

Quote:
Originally Posted by COUGAR View Post
From a purely Cold-air intake efficiency perspective, wouldnt a direct pipe routed direct from the bonnet (say ahead or above the radiator: see earlier post on this) be more effective than a snorkel with all the twisting pipes? A snorkel has multiple advantages though.

From a water fording perspective, what are the changes to be done? Your inputs would be much appreciated.
Hi Roy,

The Dust Fouling will also reduce the effect of the CAI. For Cars there is the additional Ram effect, but not desired in Off-Road vehicles.

From Fording Perspective.
1) Snorkel and Air-Filter and associated plumbing fully sealed.

2) Check the Electrical System (ECM, Ignition Coil, HEI or Distributor, DIS, Fuse Box and Alternator)

3) Raised Breathers for Front Diff/Back Diff, Gear Box, T-Case & Engine Breather and Check the Engine PCV. Also inspect the Bell Housing and Clutch Actuation Fork, for apertures.

4) Viscous Coupling Radiator Fan, reduces the Splash inside the bonnet, as the water flow disengages the fan.

5) Add a few Screw on Drain Holes is you foot well and Load Bay/Bed Area.

Most of the water gets in, if your vehicle is hot (run a distance) or if you stop inside the water.

Regards,

Arka

Last edited by ex670c : 6th September 2010 at 13:19.
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Old 6th September 2010, 13:21   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starter View Post
Dear Vikram,
Just to understand this further.
Agreed that cold air would be available at a lower level.
But keeping the intake within the engine compartment, the chances of it sucking up hot air is higher since it is so close to the engine and the radiator, isn't it?
So, won't a snorkel outside the engine compartment help better than having a CAI inside the engine compartment?
Cheers,
Deepak
Dear Deepak,

You are right if the air intake is not designed correctly!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
Hi Deepak,

You have very effectively pointed out one of the Main Reason for a Snorkel.

i) The Temperature is significantly higher in the engine bay, an intake outside the engine bay will act like a CAI.

ii) There is more dust in the engine bay/fender level, a Raised Air-Intake aka Snorkel, increases the filter life.

iii) The vehicle is better prepared for fording obstacles.

Regards,

Arka

To address all the above points, please look into the engine bay of a modern car. The Air intake tubing is routed right from the front grill [even in front of the radiator in some cars].

This is the correct way of getting air into the vehicle. This also reduces the noise of the engine. [Infact the stock gypsy has the intake front the front right side above the HL]

Unfortunately, this is completely forgotten when "we" build vehicles. Hence a snorkel apparently works better.

But, please dont call Snorkel a CAI,

Last edited by headers : 6th September 2010 at 13:24.
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Old 6th September 2010, 13:30   #43
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Default Snorkel/Dust/CAI/RAM

Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
You are right if the air intake is not designed correctly!!

To address all the above points, please look into the engine bay of a modern car. The Air intake tubing is routed right from the front grill in front of the radiator [in some cars].

This is the correct way of getting air into the vehicle as also, reduce the noise of the engine. [Infact the stock gypsy has the intake front the front right side above the HL]

Unfortunately, this is completely forgotten when "we" build vehicles. Hence a snorkel apparently works better.

But, please dont call Snorkel a CAI,
Hi Vikram,

Even the MM540 & Modern M&M MUVs have the Air-Filter inlet just below the RH Headlight.

Similarly the 70Series TLC's and the La-Ro Defender and Military G-Wagen have a Snorkel above the Bonnet up to the Roof-Level.

There is a purpose for each design, and since we are discussing 4x4's, I think the Snorkel and Dust makes better sense than CAI & RAM Effect.

A Snorkel is a CAI, but a CAI is not a snorkel.

Regards,

Arka

Last edited by ex670c : 6th September 2010 at 13:34. Reason: typo
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Old 6th September 2010, 13:43   #44
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Default CAI and Snorkel

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A Snorkel is a CAI, but a CAI is not a snorkel.
Well thanks for your information. We will discuss this offline!!
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Old 6th September 2010, 22:15   #45
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Go for a good 4 channel amplifier. when you intend to add a subwoofer change the front speakers also to a pair of components. remove all other existing speakers.
Other option is to go for a 2 channel amplifier and get under seat mountable powered subwoofer.
Get stereo to 2 RC cable to connect the carputer audio to amplifier. two y splitter for 4 channels of amplifier.
I would suggest keep the headunit and try to fix the lcd permanently on dash. a radio on long outings is good to keep. in that case amplifier is not immediately needed.

Practically 5.1 or digital outs are not of use in vehicle unless speakers are placed in such a way to view movies for rear seat occupants. creative used to come with a external digital to analog processor long time ago but it needs 16v input supply. i think this is the cheapest one to procure, an amplifier with digital in is rare
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