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Old 19th October 2011, 15:08   #91
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Default Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
A lot of us do terrains which require 4WD, but angle of approach, departure etc., need not be very good.
Do you have some example pics to support your case here?

Moreover, what about GC. 185 odd MMs in a Scorp can hardly be called SUV class GC. What is the risk to the vehicle, if you actually take it into such rocky terrain?
Safari's have much better GC, no doubt, but very bad Overhangs and GVW.
But, again we are digressing. All I was trying to say is that the Manufacturers Marketing Strategists may actually have had a very good reason NOT TO offer 4x4 on all variants. Now, with sales hit across the board, they would be forced to offer more options to entice consumers to the same products.
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Old 19th October 2011, 15:35   #92
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Default Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs

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Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Do you have some example pics to support your case here?

Moreover, what about GC. 185 odd MMs in a Scorp can hardly be called SUV class GC. What is the risk to the vehicle, if you actually take it into such rocky terrain?
Safari's have much better GC, no doubt, but very bad Overhangs and GVW.
But, again we are digressing. All I was trying to say is that the Manufacturers Marketing Strategists may actually have had a very good reason NOT TO offer 4x4 on all variants. Now, with sales hit across the board, they would be forced to offer more options to entice consumers to the same products.
First of all, when I say trails, I do not say classic offroading(find a ditch and dive in).
I mean proper trails, which require 4x4 due to their sandy nature, or very steep inclines.

I actually have a lot of pics, and videos. At first I thought, if I share them here, it will take the discussion OT, but then this thread is about why should entry level SUVs also offer 4x4, so here goes

This is a tire shredder. 2WD? A Swift tried, and could not make it even 1 meter into the landslide. You can see it parked in the background. The wheels kept on spinning. A 2WD SUV may have done it if you had charged at with speed to reach the crest, but you would have shredded the tires, and broken a lot of things underneath.




If you want to see swift


Then there are icy trails, where without 4WD you will just spin your wheels on the hairpins without going anywhere.

You can check out
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-ex...-journeys.html (Tata Safari 4x4 The Off Road, and No road journeys)

Then of course, there are river crossings on some of my routes. 2WDs do it, with passengers getting down and giving a push in the tricky sections. I do not like to get wet in water touching 2 degree C.

And some sandy tracks



Then there are places where bridges break,


Try doing it on a 2WD without the control of a 4WD low. As soon as the wheel hits the girder, the other wheel on loose sand will start spinning. And remember, you are on a girder narrower than the tire, you cannot use momentum!

I have got millions of other examples here in the TLOG section
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Old 19th October 2011, 16:09   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979
First of all, when I say trails, I do not say classic offroading(find a ditch and dive in).
I mean proper trails, which require 4x4 due to their sandy nature, or very steep inclines.

I actually have a lot of pics, and videos. At first I thought, if I share them here, it will take the discussion OT, but then this thread is about why should entry level SUVs also offer 4x4, so here goes

This is a tire shredder. 2WD? A Swift tried, and could not make it even 1 meter into the landslide. You can see it parked in the background. The wheels kept on spinning. A 2WD SUV may have done it if you had charged at with speed to reach the crest, but you would have shredded the tires, and broken a lot of things underneath.



If you want to see swift


Then there are icy trails, where without 4WD you will just spin your wheels on the hairpins without going anywhere.

You can check out
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-ex...-journeys.html (Tata Safari 4x4 The Off Road, and No road journeys)

Then of course, there are river crossings on some of my routes. 2WDs do it, with passengers getting down and giving a push in the tricky sections. I do not like to get wet in water touching 2 degree C.

And some sandy tracks


Then there are places where bridges break,

Try doing it on a 2WD without the control of a 4WD low. As soon as the wheel hits the girder, the other wheel on loose sand will start spinning. And remember, you are on a girder narrower than the tire, you cannot use momentum!

I have got millions of other examples here in the TLOG section
Tanveer Sir, in my very first post I had put desert and snow./ice out of scope of my comments. And neither did I intend to bring into this discussion deep ditches, ruts or gorges. Let me look at the pics and videos and I'll get back to you with my comments on the same. Just one more thing, I'd also kept 2wd fwd vehicles out of scope so Swifts's attempts don't count.
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Old 19th October 2011, 17:36   #94
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Default Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs

More importantly buying an SUV is about unleashing possibilities...being able to dream about going places where one normally would not with a regular car. The planning in ones living room should begin with the knowledge that one has a vehicle that is capable,without which it will only be wishful thinking.

Personally I always thought an SUV is not a real SUV without 4x4 at minimum. A 2WD SUV can only be a pretender. A lot depends on driving skills I agree ( without which both the both the 2WD SUV and owner are pretenders ). But driving skills can be acquired more readily - without the same cost as an SUV.

LSD can be added aftermarket. In my case, it was based on this conviction that the gypsy became my first car, the only affordable product with 4x4 below 7 lacs.

Just my 2P

--Ragul
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Old 19th October 2011, 18:07   #95
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Default Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs

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Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Tanveer Sir, in my very first post I had put desert and snow./ice out of scope of my comments. And neither did I intend to bring into this discussion deep ditches, ruts or gorges. Let me look at the pics and videos and I'll get back to you with my comments on the same. Just one more thing, I'd also kept 2wd fwd vehicles out of scope so Swifts's attempts don't count.
Roy the point is, that in our country, in all the corners, you will find tough trails. Trails which are slippery, slushy, snowy, or plain old landslides.... and for us who like to go ahead and explore the unknown, 4x4 is a must.
As for FWD or RWD, it does not matter, a two wheel drive is a two wheel drive. Infact, in snow, a FWD car has better chance of making it than a RWD, esp when executing hairpin turns while climbing up a high mountain pass.
So 4WD in a SUV not as capable as jeeps (articulation, departure and approach), 4x4 is not just for show, it can actually get you to many places.
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Old 19th October 2011, 22:43   #96
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Default Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
.. and for us who like to go ahead and explore the unknown, 4x4 is a must.
.......a two wheel drive is a two wheel drive.....
.....4x4 is not just for show, it can actually get you to many places....
+1 to each of these. And for inexperienced drivers like me.....a 4wd (even basic & simple with just high and low ratio, no LSD, no lockers...) makes the job much easier in many situations with minimum/no damage to the vehicle.

Even for experienced drivers also, to traverse that 'extra miles' a 4wd is a must. Reminds me of the travelogues of ADC, where he keeps on mentioning the importance of 4wd or the lack of it in his Safari in so many occasions.

Now, how many of the 4x4 equipped SUVs are actually used in situations demanding 4wd is a valid question. But for people who are aware of its function/utility, this is an essential thing to be equipped with.
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Old 20th October 2011, 14:54   #97
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Default Re: Mahindra Scorpio 4WD

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Originally Posted by karizma9292 View Post
Good news for future scorpio 4WD buyers , according to a sales executive in SKS automobiles Bannerghatta road Bangalore , 4Wd is now available in the LX version also. On-road price for LX 2WD is 9.70lakhs so LX 4Wd is 80k (approx) over the 2WD price.

(Mods please delete this post if already discussed)
The Safari is also now available in 4x4 across all versions (even on the base EX). Pricing for EX 4x4 is 9.7 lacs, same as the Scorpio LX 4x2. Wonder why both the companies decided to offer 4x4 on base models too.
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Old 20th October 2011, 20:59   #98
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Default Re: Mahindra Scorpio 4WD

@vivek: Base Safari is LX and not EX. LX Safari is not available with 4WD.

Pricing according to Tata website on EX is 10 Lakhs for your hometown according to Tata Safari website.
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