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Old 19th April 2012, 12:41   #151
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

I have seen couple of Mahindra pickups, marshalls and Maxx's (Wide bodied) with 4wd on the hills of North Bengal.

I am sure they are available as a much cheaper alternative and also available from the factory.

One such example

Note that it has a front differential, hence a 4WD

Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.-img_1650.jpg

Last edited by 1100D : 19th April 2012 at 12:44.
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Old 19th April 2012, 12:45   #152
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

Well Gurkhas are not very hard to maintain. We see many Force Toofans used as people movers in the rural areas. So parts should not be very difficult to source except for the 4WD components. But the 4WD components on Gurkha are built tough (unless you get a lemon). Otherwise Bolero is next best option 180mm GC is not much of a bother unless you want to do extreme off-roading. Bolero comes out neat from most the toughest of surfaces.
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Old 19th April 2012, 12:50   #153
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

rightly pointed out by 2500cc and 1100d , the ground clearance may not be the best but the bolero should be good enough for mild otrs as pointed by you. you could maybe change the stock tyres to one with a higher profile for increased gc . the bolero is also pretty decently comfortable for longer drives and the ac and ps would only add to it. another thing, 2wd should be good enough for moderate off roading.
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Old 19th April 2012, 13:36   #154
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

Thanks for all your suggestions. Will check out the Bolero later today at the dealership. The other point that i did mention is the utility space, with the side facing foldable seats in most vehicles i mentioned it is convenient to dump farm produce, equipment/tools, canisters etc . Bolero and Gurkha with 2nd row seats and 3 row jumper seats does not offer the same utility. I will check this out first hand when at the dealer's and compare with Thar and see how significant this is. Also at least on paper, the Thar seems to be more drivable, have to check this out.
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Old 19th April 2012, 13:56   #155
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

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Originally Posted by lediablo View Post
The other point that i did mention is the utility space, with the side facing foldable seats in most vehicles i mentioned it is convenient to dump farm produce, equipment/tools, canisters etc . .
Thats why, I mentioned, check for 4WD versions of Marshall and Maxx. They have the side facing bench option. However the 4WD versions are not readily available on the plains, but a little pushing can soon make you an owner of one such piece. At a much lower price.
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Old 19th April 2012, 14:08   #156
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

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Originally Posted by lediablo View Post
Thanks for all your suggestions. Will check out the Bolero later today at the dealership. The other point that i did mention is the utility space, with the side facing foldable seats in most vehicles i mentioned it is convenient to dump farm produce, equipment/tools, canisters etc . Bolero and Gurkha with 2nd row seats and 3 row jumper seats does not offer the same utility. I will check this out first hand when at the dealer's and compare with Thar and see how significant this is. Also at least on paper, the Thar seems to be more drivable, have to check this out.
Thar is SWB, you may get very limited space to dump the farm equipment. IMHO, Thar is more a lifestyle vehicle and not a utilitarian.
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Old 19th April 2012, 15:27   #157
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Default Re: Gypsy vs MM550 vs Thar vs Gurkha

I will only talk about mine - Gurkha.

I bought mine pre-owned 7 months back, and it had done 33K kms when I bought it.
Since then, I drive it to office everyday, go on long drives with family and go to occassional OTR's on weekends (8-9 so far).
My family has lately begun preferring the Gurkha nowadays, over our family sedan, because they now understand that it is very comfortable, capable and reliable. Maybe not as comfortable as a sedan, but liveable enough, and certainly a lot lot more capable.

Between all this, I have spent around 11000 rupees till date for service and maintenance, and the vehicle has not yet been lying around waiting for any parts.

Here is the Good, Bad, Ugly that I posted on a different thread recently:
Good
  • Ground Clearance, Approach and Ramp Break Over angles
  • Power Steering, Small Turning Radius and Excellent In City Driveability & Parkability
  • Low End Torque
  • Diff. Locks are magic
  • Very reliable and robust mechanical build
  • Ride and Handling (As decent as a Jeep type vehicle can hope to be)
  • Braking
  • AC (Still using it on Setting - 1 in Delhi)
  • Cabin Noise (Liveable)
  • FE (12-13 kmpl) with AC
Bad
  • Stock Rim Size (160 pcd, 16 inch, 6.5J, Zero Offset). It is Very difficult to find suitable tyres at reasonable prices.
  • High End Power Delivery (Tops out at 120 kmph)
  • Articulation (But, this is more than made up for by the Diff Locks)
  • Lack of Accessory Options
  • 2650FTI is not a free revving engine. Very good for City and Off-Roading though.
  • Power to weight ratio.
Ugly
  • Vehicle Seat configuration
  • Rear Window Size and Location
  • Some Ergonomics (Window Levers, Rear Foot Step)
  • OEM Rubber Quality
  • Refinement inside the vehicle
Mods Planned
  • Rock Sliders
  • Branch Deflectors
  • Sway Bar Disconnects (Still researching G-Wagon designs)
  • Interiors Upgrade
  • NVH Insulation (3M and carpeting options)
  • 2nd row AC Blowers
  • Seating Configuration and Comfort

By the way, if you do have the budget, please do look at the Xenon and Getaway too. The loading bay would be very handy! The Xenon performes decently enough in OTR's except for it's rear overhang.

Last edited by roy_libran : 19th April 2012 at 15:31.
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Old 19th April 2012, 19:50   #158
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

@Roy Thanks. Most of the negatives seems to be from a pure offroading perspective. Don't fancy intense offroading soon, might just get into it gradually . However the ease of driving in city and not so great in the highway is a extremely useful feedback for me.

Had a visit to the Mahindra dealership. Didn't have a test drive of either the Thar or Bolero.

Thar
The present model is not available anymore. New version to be launched early next month. Addition of A/C, PS and a better quality Canopy, without change in rice. The 4X4 CRDI costs 8.19 on Road in Bangalore.

Bolero
Surprisingly the interiors of the top end ZLX were much better than expected Costs 8.9Lakhs on Road bangalore
The SLX slotted below costs 8.7. None of them are 4X4, both have the m2dicr engine

Doing a test drive on Sunday.
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Old 30th April 2012, 12:09   #159
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

Hi,

I'am pursuing a few second hand cars at the moment a Trax 4x4 1999 model(belonging to Jeepcaptain) and a Marshal DI 2WD, 2000 model. The restoration and mods on the Trax 4x4 is well documented in Team BHP.
Your opinions will help

Thanks
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Old 30th April 2012, 21:50   #160
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

^^: The Marshal is more utilitarian than the Trax 4x4. Pick up the marshal unless you wanna do off road and in slush!!
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Old 7th January 2013, 22:20   #161
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

Posting for a good friend who is in the market for a new 4x4 on a budget (If you can call it that).

I have no time for the workshop, if I buy this 4x4, it should be niggle free and has to have reliability straight out of the dealer. I want to off road too which is whole point of buying a 4x4. The Suzuki Gypsy HT is available for 7.61 on road, White and Silver as color options, No AC (Not even available from Maruti Suzuki as a accessory), I need to wait two months max to get one, I can wait, I need to start paying my loan towards the Gypsy even before I get it as Bimal (Mahadevpura) won't accept a Gypsy order unless it is a outright purchase which I can't afford so I need to get the loan processing done well before I get the car. I can afford to run a Gypsy on petrol, I am new to off roading. I like the Gypsy. On the money front, its very accessible and comes as a very reliable product.

As for the Mahindra Thar DI or Crde. Based on the many folk who own them right here, there is a lot of work to be done as soon as you buy one. I have yet to read or even see a single Thar that is standing stock or straight out of the dealer. The DI 4WD nails it in terms of budget. I just don't have the time, nor am I interested to go fix what Mahindra left behind.

Some questions are, how easy can I get a Air Conditioner setup in a Gypsy and the cost involved? Apart from just fixing the AC, is there other stuff to do to make the car AC ready like sealing doors and panel gaps. What immediate post purchase work will a Gypsy require if I buy one in terms of preparing it to go off road? A engine sump guard is probably the first thing, what else?

From what I have read about the Thar right here, the list is endless in terms of things you need to sort out before it can be niggle free.

What can the Gypsy do better or not than the Thar and vice versa?

Off Roading will be 20% and the rest will be on road. Hassle free ownership is another priority.
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Old 7th January 2013, 22:37   #162
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
Some questions are, how easy can I get a Air Conditioner setup in a Gypsy and the cost involved? Apart from just fixing the AC, is there other stuff to do to make the car AC ready like sealing doors and panel gaps. What immediate post purchase work will a Gypsy require if I buy one in terms of preparing it to go off road? A engine sump guard is probably the first thing, what else?
====
What can the Gypsy do better or not than the Thar and vice versa?
In BLR you can goto wecool, cost will be 23-25k depending on configuration. Ideally keep the blower unit separate and dont try integrating with the stock blower. Bit of an eyesore, but will be reliable and efficient. For HT if you are going for smaller compressor (which you should ideally due to power of the engine), then partitioning the rear would be a good idea using a plastic sheet thingie. ie if you dont carry too many passengers.

For regular mild offroad, just a dog bone type shackle and good set of tires is what you should spend.

Thar is also an ok vehicle as long as its regular trails and mild stuff. FE runs of diesel and much better cruiser on a highway.

Gypsy in comparison takes more abuse and better quality (overall).

If its just 20% offroad its a tough call
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Old 8th January 2013, 06:41   #163
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
What can the Gypsy do better or not than the Thar and vice versa?

Off Roading will be 20% and the rest will be on road. Hassle free ownership is another priority.
The above has been fought tooth and nail over this forum

The THAR is the only 4wd vehicle that comes "off" a showroom to do mild off road without much work.

The Gypsy can take far more abuse than the THAR CRDE, because of the way it is engineered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
For regular mild offroad, just a dog bone type shackle and good set of tires is what you should spend.
Only decent tyres IMO..nothing else..

If Petrol is not an issue stick to MG413W and plonk an AC aftermarket.

Reliability is on par for both engines, but generally offroad vehicles need to be looked after, depending on how moderate the driver does the off road

Suspension on road is far more forgiving [read less sporty] on a THAR than a gypsy.
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Old 8th January 2013, 07:28   #164
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

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In BLR you can goto wecool, cost will be 23-25k depending on configuration.
What are these configurations? Are you talking about one those units found in the older generation Ambassadors and Fiats? They used to chill to the bone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
For HT if you are going for smaller compressor (which you should ideally due to power of the engine)
Why have you specified smaller compressor based on HT? Is it because the cooling will be better due to better sealing when compared to a ST and area to cool being lesser if I do run a plastic sheet partition? How effective will a smaller compressor be in case I have passengers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
just a dog bone type shackle and good set of tires is what you should spend.
After googling, this looks more like a tow hook in case I get stuck so I can be latched on to another vehicle and get pulled out. Is this the function of a dog bone type shackle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
If its just 20% offroad its a tough call
I rephrase, the remaining 80% may not see any on road use or it would be minimal. I have a diesel sedan too which is what I would prefer using for city run abouts.
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Old 8th January 2013, 10:42   #165
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Default Re: Unreasonable dilemma! Thar Vs Gypsy! Mostly resolved Page 9.

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What are these configurations? Are you talking about one those units found in the older generation Ambassadors and Fiats? They used to chill to the bone.
1) Size of the compressor and type, i have used 505 which is more than adequate and zaps less power. Actually with the cabin i have never gone beyond 1/4 temp setting mode. People prefer 507 which is larger, so faster cooling for a larger cabin. Zaps more power.

If budget is not an issue, there are new gen compressor (that comes with swift etc), but they are about 10-15 k more iirc. But far more efficient.

2) Blower make. I have used a cheap local one, works well though a lil noisy at higher speeds.


Quote:
Why have you specified smaller compressor based on HT? Is it because the cooling will be better due to better sealing when compared to a ST and area to cool being lesser if I do run a plastic sheet partition? How effective will a smaller compressor be in case I have passengers?
Yes HT has much better sealing. With 505 it will take longer to cool the whole cabin area, thats all. Once its cooled to a certain degrees not much difference by using a larger compressor.

Quote:
After googling, this looks more like a tow hook in case I get stuck so I can be latched on to another vehicle and get pulled out. Is this the function of a dog bone type shackle?
No these are longer shackles to get more clearance for the vehicle. Tow hook are present in stock form. Unless its old and broken no need for any aftermarket stuff. Unless you intend to tow around a cart, for which Gypsy is definitely not a good option. Thanks to its lower low end torque and delicate clutch.


Quote:
I rephrase, the remaining 80% may not see any on road use or it would be minimal. I have a diesel sedan too which is what I would prefer using for city run abouts.
If its kutcha road driving, Thar would be less bouncy. Yes rattles will come and small things might fall off, but thats what service appointments are anyway for.
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