The Palio ICE Thread - Team-BHP

windsurfer · 11th October 2006, 16:52

Hi,

I have gone through a good number of threads before posting this. I have booked a Palio 1.6 Sports and would need to setup ice this weekend. I had a Indica earlier which had a sony MP3 player. two Oval Pioneer speakers mounted on the read parcel tray. And 2 small speakers in front and none on the doors. i was pretty happy with this system. The only problem was mounting the those huge speakers on rear - it rattled a lot. I don't want this problem in my palio.

Now my budget is around 25-30K. How good are component speakers? And here are my requirements -
1. Need components speakers for stock sockets/slots provided. Don't want to put heavy speakers on rear tray.
2. No Amp, Sub now. I will upgrade later.
3. Regarding the quality - Well, I like Sound quality and loudness. Depends on my mood.

Please suggest a setup for this. Also, I am based in Hyderabad. I need a good installer to setup this system.

mobike008 · 11th October 2006, 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsurfer

Hi,

I have gone through a good number of threads before posting this. I have booked a Palio 1.6 Sports and would need to setup ice this weekend. I had a Indica earlier which had a sony MP3 player. two Oval Pioneer speakers mounted on the read parcel tray. And 2 small speakers in front and none on the doors. i was pretty happy with this system. The only problem was mounting the those huge speakers on rear - it rattled a lot. I don't want this problem in my palio.

Now my budget is around 25-30K. How good are component speakers? And here are my requirements -
1. Need components speakers for stock sockets/slots provided. Don't want to put heavy speakers on rear tray.
2. No Amp, Sub now. I will upgrade later.
3. Regarding the quality - Well, I like Sound quality and loudness. Depends on my mood.

Please suggest a setup for this. Also, I am based in Hyderabad. I need a good installer to setup this system.

Firstly, your budget of 30K is a bit on the higher side for an ICE without an amp and woofer ( infact you can get a decent amp and woofer within this budget)

Component speakers are really good and an amp is needed to drive the front comps. I have recently fitted an ICE into my new car and the SQ is quite nice, I went for a Pio 6850 ( best that is available in this price segment), Blaupaunkt front comps, JBL GTO 937 for rear and Pio Sub woofer and a sony 554 4 channel amp. you can get all this within your budget.

I got my ICE fitted from Max Motors in Minister road, good service and recommended to me by a fellow tbhpian.

esteem_lover · 11th October 2006, 18:00

the last line in your post should be given the first priority. learnt that from experience.

you could also take a look into this to arrive at what kind of a system you will require regarding budgets for each item.

cheers

rsjaurr · 11th October 2006, 18:16

If u got 30k for HU and speakers [if not using ur old sony HU] go for pio HU with atleast 3pre-outs fro abt 9k.
For speakers i would advise u to go for infinty kappa if u can buy within 20k.Other alternatives r focal,boston,hertz,polk momo and JBL.

iraghava · 11th October 2006, 19:03

I would say get a good HU at about 9K and get components for the front at about 6-10k and co-axials for the rear at about 4-6k. Remaining money buy a good 4-ch amp like the Pioneer 6200 for about 7.5 or JBL 75.4 for about 13k to power the speakers. You should plonk an amp now since components tend to work really well with external amplification as the HU's internal amp cannot give them enough juice!

windsurfer · 11th October 2006, 19:58

Thanks Guys. Here are some basic questions. I am not a Pro at this, so please excuse if they are real silly -

1. Front speakers are compo. Rear would be co-axials. Why not compo at rear as well. Can the rear speakers be fitted in the slot provided and not on the tray. This is my prime concern.

2. Regarding, the AMP and sub - I don;t want to loose any boot space. So is it advisable to go for it? Can I only buy the AMP and not sub?

Mugen_Power · 11th October 2006, 20:01

Hey windsurfer,

Get A Good Pioneer Head Unit With 3 Pre-Outs.
Comps For Front - 7 to 10 K.
Coaxials For Rear - 3 to 6 K.
Amp - Pioneer GM6200F 4 Channel Amp. 7.5 K

Quote:

Originally Posted by rsjaurr

Other alternatives r focal,boston,hertz,polk momo and JBL.

You Have Illusion Option As Well.

Cheers,
Mugen_Power.

Mugen_Power · 11th October 2006, 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsurfer

2. Regarding, the AMP and sub - I don;t want to loose any boot space. So is it advisable to go for it? Can I only buy the AMP and not sub?

If you are going for Comps and Coaxials then you should have to install 4 Ch Amp.

Cheers,
Mugen_Power.

airfoil · 11th October 2006, 20:28

I'm going to try my hand at suggesting an ICE setup for the first time. I guess I qualify since have a similar setup in my GTX

:

HU: Pio 6850> Rs. 8800 w/o B&W
Front Comps: JBL GTO 607> Rs. 5500
Rear Comps: GTO 507> Rs. 4500
Amp: JBL CS 60.4> Rs. 8500
Cables + install: Rs. 3000

Comes to Rs. 30,300 in all (I hope I have the prices right). You could add a subwoofer later, along with its dedicated amp. I'd want to say a component speaker based setup may not make sense without a subwoofer though.

You may want to get suitable coaxials for the rear (they should be adequate) and drive a sub (added later) in bridged mode off the 60.4.

rsjaurr · 11th October 2006, 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsurfer

Thanks Guys. Here are some basic questions. I am not a Pro at this, so please excuse if they are real silly -

1. Front speakers are compo. Rear would be co-axials. Why not compo at rear as well. Can the rear speakers be fitted in the slot provided and not on the tray. This is my prime concern.

2. Regarding, the AMP and sub - I don;t want to loose any boot space. So is it advisable to go for it? Can I only buy the AMP and not sub?

1.You can also fit compo at back as well and that will even be better,but coax r usually recommended not to overshoot the budget [compo r costlier than coax] ,especially if u drive the car urself so keeping better spk at front is better option ["front sound stage"]than having 'em at back.
If u like to have comp at back as well,go for it but some expert would even advise to do away with rear spk as these r mainly used as fillers along with front which r more imp for front soundstage.

2.Yes u can.and i again say that would even be better.Amplifier not only helps in achieving more SPL [loudness] but also it provides cleaner signal to ahcieve SQ even at higher volumes.

Right now go with HU with 3 preouts,front compo,rear coax and a 4-ch amplifier.Go for 6.5" size spk even if u have modify ur stock location little bit as these r the biggest door size spk and will be able to produce more bass than any other door spk.You will be looking for bass from door spk as u r not interested in sub.
Infcat i would also advise u to invest some amount in damping material as well so that u can set HPF at lower possible level [~80Hz] and subsquently u will get more bass.

Other option [if u need boot space]for u is to install sub in spare wheel well in the same way as Gunbir have shown us in his thread about ICE install in Getz,especially if u have tubeless tyres.

Still wondering what is HPF,damping material,go through some of the sticky threads.
Have a nice evening...

@Mugen-i have never heard or heard about illusiobn audio before B&T told about these.Infact i have never or may be once or twice the other brands but i have heard about 'em when i was looking for my set-up.
I hope u must be enjoying ur system very much,it was very neatly installed.

airfoil · 11th October 2006, 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by rsjaurr

Other option [if u need boot space]for u is to install sub in spare wheel well in the same way as Gunbir have shown us in his thread about ICE install in Getz,especially if u have tubeless tyres.

RSJ, I'm wondering why tubeless tyres are preferred for a spare wheel well sub?

hydrashok · 11th October 2006, 21:08

I think airfoil's setup is good!

I would also suggest you give a listen to Hertz comps (for the front). I'd listened to the ESK165 and the DSK165. Both sounded really good to me. But Hertz will cost you quite a bit more than JBLs (I think 8500/- for the ESK165. The DSKs maybe the same as the JBLs, but I'm not sure. Gunbir should be able to help you with the prices). Hertz also have co-axials, if you want to consider them for the rear fill.

You will need an amp (to get best results) if you're going in for comps.

If you don't want to spring for an amp now, I would suggest you use the saved amount (using airfoil's setup as a base) to get a really good HU. Don't be afraid to spend in the 15k to 20k range, if you plan to set up a proper SQ system over time by adding an amp later, and then next an amp + sub combination after that.
For a 15k to 20k budget, you will get good Alpine/Blau/Kenwood/Pio HUs with 2+1 pre-outs (4V pre-outs I think) and enough additional features. You'll get better quality output from HUs in this range. Remember, the HU is something you're not likely to be able to upgrade later (without spending some serious money), so make sure you get a good one.

And, since you plan to go in for a sub+amp later, you will need to use only the stock speaker location in the rear. You won't really need 6x9s. A MDF plank (required for 6x9s) will give you trouble sooner or later. And, stock install = stealth install, which is a big plus. You can fit upto 6.5" speakers in the rear, with some mild adjustments. Same for the front. Make sure you get 6" or 6.5" woofers in front. Depending on the speaker, you can fit them (6 or 6.5") with just a little adjustment in the front (or without any at all).

You can actually save some money if you install co-axials in the rear. If you will be driving/sitting in the front seat most of the time, you really don't need comps in the rear.

And don't be afraid to spend some money on good cables if you're getting an amp installed (power & RCA). You'll keep enjoying the benefits for your future upgrades also.

I drive a Palio 1.2, BTW. <shameless self-promotion> Check out my ICE in my BHP garage. Just put it up today :-) </shameless self-promotion>

hydrashok · 11th October 2006, 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by airfoil

RSJ, I'm wondering why tubeless tyres are preferred for a spare wheel well sub?

Well, tubeless tyres a way more puncture resistant thatn tubed tyres. And even if you do get a puncture, you can generally keep driving for quite a while if you top-up the tyre pressure. So, a spare tyre may not be needed. And when you have extra space, you have to ICE it, right? :-)

Mugen_Power · 12th October 2006, 00:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by rsjaurr

@Mugen-i have never heard or heard about illusiobn audio before B&T told about these.Infact i have never or may be once or twice the other brands but i have heard about 'em when i was looking for my set-up.
I hope u must be enjoying ur system very much,it was very neatly installed.

Thanks Sir.. And enjoying the system very very much.
I had not heard before few days but i think you should have to listen Illusion.

BTW Illusion lm6.1 Comps are for approx 11K.

Cheers,
Mugen_Power.

airfoil · 12th October 2006, 09:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrashok

So, a spare tyre may not be needed. And when you have extra space, you have to ICE it, right? :-)

Aah, that makes sense. I was thrown because I thought a tubeless spare wheel itself was recommended for a spare wheel well sub install.

11th October 2006, 16:52	#1 (permalink)
windsurfer BHPian Join Date: May 2006 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 305	The Palio ICE Thread Hi, I have gone through a good number of threads before posting this. I have booked a Palio 1.6 Sports and would need to setup ice this weekend. I had a Indica earlier which had a sony MP3 player. two Oval Pioneer speakers mounted on the read parcel tray. And 2 small speakers in front and none on the doors. i was pretty happy with this system. The only problem was mounting the those huge speakers on rear - it rattled a lot. I don't want this problem in my palio. Now my budget is around 25-30K. How good are component speakers? And here are my requirements - 1. Need components speakers for stock sockets/slots provided. Don't want to put heavy speakers on rear tray. 2. No Amp, Sub now. I will upgrade later. 3. Regarding the quality - Well, I like Sound quality and loudness. Depends on my mood. Please suggest a setup for this. Also, I am based in Hyderabad. I need a good installer to setup this system. Last edited by windsurfer : 11th October 2006 at 16:55.

11th October 2006, 18:00	#3 (permalink)
esteem_lover Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Madras Posts: 5,278 View My Garage Infractions: 0/1 (5)	the last line in your post should be given the first priority. learnt that from experience. you could also take a look into this to arrive at what kind of a system you will require regarding budgets for each item. cheers __________________ Goodbye Dada, you made us proud.

11th October 2006, 19:03	#5 (permalink)
iraghava Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bhaiyyaland Posts: 8,003 View My Garage	I would say get a good HU at about 9K and get components for the front at about 6-10k and co-axials for the rear at about 4-6k. Remaining money buy a good 4-ch amp like the Pioneer 6200 for about 7.5 or JBL 75.4 for about 13k to power the speakers. You should plonk an amp now since components tend to work really well with external amplification as the HU's internal amp cannot give them enough juice! __________________ Power corrupts. Absolute power is kind of neat.

11th October 2006, 20:28	#9 (permalink)
airfoil BHPian Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 215	I'm going to try my hand at suggesting an ICE setup for the first time. I guess I qualify since have a similar setup in my GTX: HU: Pio 6850> Rs. 8800 w/o B&W Front Comps: JBL GTO 607> Rs. 5500 Rear Comps: GTO 507> Rs. 4500 Amp: JBL CS 60.4> Rs. 8500 Cables + install: Rs. 3000 Comes to Rs. 30,300 in all (I hope I have the prices right). You could add a subwoofer later, along with its dedicated amp. I'd want to say a component speaker based setup may not make sense without a subwoofer though. You may want to get suitable coaxials for the rear (they should be adequate) and drive a sub (added later) in bridged mode off the 60.4.

11th October 2006, 21:08	#12 (permalink)
hydrashok Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In my Office Posts: 2,177 View My Garage	I think airfoil's setup is good! I would also suggest you give a listen to Hertz comps (for the front). I'd listened to the ESK165 and the DSK165. Both sounded really good to me. But Hertz will cost you quite a bit more than JBLs (I think 8500/- for the ESK165. The DSKs maybe the same as the JBLs, but I'm not sure. Gunbir should be able to help you with the prices). Hertz also have co-axials, if you want to consider them for the rear fill. You will need an amp (to get best results) if you're going in for comps. If you don't want to spring for an amp now, I would suggest you use the saved amount (using airfoil's setup as a base) to get a really good HU. Don't be afraid to spend in the 15k to 20k range, if you plan to set up a proper SQ system over time by adding an amp later, and then next an amp + sub combination after that. For a 15k to 20k budget, you will get good Alpine/Blau/Kenwood/Pio HUs with 2+1 pre-outs (4V pre-outs I think) and enough additional features. You'll get better quality output from HUs in this range. Remember, the HU is something you're not likely to be able to upgrade later (without spending some serious money), so make sure you get a good one. And, since you plan to go in for a sub+amp later, you will need to use only the stock speaker location in the rear. You won't really need 6x9s. A MDF plank (required for 6x9s) will give you trouble sooner or later. And, stock install = stealth install, which is a big plus. You can fit upto 6.5" speakers in the rear, with some mild adjustments. Same for the front. Make sure you get 6" or 6.5" woofers in front. Depending on the speaker, you can fit them (6 or 6.5") with just a little adjustment in the front (or without any at all). You can actually save some money if you install co-axials in the rear. If you will be driving/sitting in the front seat most of the time, you really don't need comps in the rear. And don't be afraid to spend some money on good cables if you're getting an amp installed (power & RCA). You'll keep enjoying the benefits for your future upgrades also. I drive a Palio 1.2, BTW. <shameless self-promotion> Check out my ICE in my BHP garage. Just put it up today :-) </shameless self-promotion> __________________ Alpine 9887 \| TRU Tech S44 \| Image Dynamics XS65 \| Image Dynamics IDQ12 D2V2 \| Connection Audison

11th October 2006, 18:16	#4 (permalink)
rsjaurr BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Batala Posts: 685	If u got 30k for HU and speakers [if not using ur old sony HU] go for pio HU with atleast 3pre-outs fro abt 9k. For speakers i would advise u to go for infinty kappa if u can buy within 20k.Other alternatives r focal,boston,hertz,polk momo and JBL.

11th October 2006, 19:58	#6 (permalink)
windsurfer BHPian Join Date: May 2006 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 305	Thanks Guys. Here are some basic questions. I am not a Pro at this, so please excuse if they are real silly - 1. Front speakers are compo. Rear would be co-axials. Why not compo at rear as well. Can the rear speakers be fitted in the slot provided and not on the tray. This is my prime concern. 2. Regarding, the AMP and sub - I don;t want to loose any boot space. So is it advisable to go for it? Can I only buy the AMP and not sub?

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