Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q! - Page 7 - Team-BHP

aseem · 14th July 2005, 00:28

Just checked Sony website to see if the 7700 has 3 pre outs. Now it says that it has two pre outs and a sub out... is this the same as 3 pre outs?
[font=Arial]AMPLIFIER
• S-MOSFET Output Power: 52W x 4
• Pre Out x 2
• 4V High Voltage Pre Out
• Sub Out
• Aux-In Lite
• DSO2 (Dynamic Soundstage Organizer 2)
• EQ7 (7-Band Equalizer/7 Modes)
• Bass/Treble
• Loudness
• High Pass Filter
• Low Pass Filter
• BBE[/font]

EVO6 · 14th July 2005, 00:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by aseem

Just checked Sony website to see if the 7700 has 3 pre outs. Now it says that it has two pre outs and a sub out... is this the same as 3 pre outs?

YES ... That means 3 Pre outs ...

navin · 14th July 2005, 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by aseem

I am trying to buy a system for my Swift. As far as my understanding is now, that in order to run the front and rear speakers through an amplifier (4ch) we need a head unit with 3 pre outs (3 pairs). Now I have a choice between Sony HU CDX-F7700 for 10.5k without bill and Pioneer 6700M for 7.8 k. Now I really like the Sony HU but it has only 2 pre outs of 4 v each as opposed to pioneer which has 3 pre outs with 2.2v each. Since I am going in for an amplifier should I go for a Pioneer with 3 preouts?Lastly, if using a 4 channel amplifier for my 4 speakers, where will I plug my subwoofer? Will it be parallely connected to the rear speakers like we do in 2 channel amps to drive the rear speakers and the woofer? Please help clear my doubts

I am leanving the speaker answers to Sam. I am sure he can convince the JBL dealer to give you a bill.

You need 2 pairs of fullrange pre outs from the front and rear (1 pair each). Each pair consists of a Left and Right Channel RCA connector.

The 3rd pair need not be full range (just like the .1 channel on your HT/AV home audio reciever is) as it will only feed your subwoofer (signals below 60/80/100/120hz).

4V pre outs are better than 2V as they offer better S/N ratios. Think this way if youhave 0.1V of noise (alternator whine etc...) with 2V pre outs the ration is 0.1V/2V = 0.05. with 4V out the ratio is 0.025. S/N ratio is usually represented in db which is 10logbase10(0.05) or 10log base10 (0.025). 4V means your amps sensitivity need not be turned up all the way and hence less noise will get amplified by the amp.

Say you got a 40W rms amp. Max output is 40W (12V). if the input signal is 1V it will amplify the signal by 11db to get 40W. noise will also be amplified by 11db. now you give the amp a 4V signal that signal will need to be amplifed by only 5db to get to 12V (40W) hence noise will also be amplified only by 5db.

This can be a huge difference as noise can then fall below a certain threshold and not be audible at all.

Sam Kapasi · 14th July 2005, 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by aseem

I have decided to go for 6" components at the front, and 6" JBL triaxials at the back. Now for the component system I have a choice between Sony XS-GS160 4.5k with bill or JBL that Sam recommended from Elegant Car Accesories in Lajpat Nagar for 5-6k. However I dont get a bill for the JBL. On the other hand the Sony components dont even have a crossover, and the high end ones are expensive, more than 10k. So which Component should I go for?

Hi Aseem,

The owner of Elegant is Sachin, I just called him and he says it is a simple misunderstanding, that ofcourse you are entitled to a bill... he never said otherwise....
*rolling my eyes* I'll never understand retail in India.
You can't have a component without a crossover network, a product like that is just a gimmick. The JBL component set at 5-6k is far far superior. And I dont say that just because it's JBL

You'll get a bill. If they make any funny noises tell them your a friend of Sam from JBL and he said I'm ENTITLED to a bill at no extra charge.

aseem · 14th July 2005, 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi

Hi Aseem,

The owner of Elegant is Sachin, I just called him and he says it is a simple misunderstanding, that ofcourse you are entitled to a bill... he never said otherwise....
*rolling my eyes* I'll never understand retail in India.
You can't have a component without a crossover network, a product like that is just a gimmick. The JBL component set at 5-6k is far far superior. And I dont say that just because it's JBL

You'll get a bill. If they make any funny noises tell them your a friend of Sam from JBL and he said I'm ENTITLED to a bill at no extra charge.

Sam, sorry to ask this question again, but can u confirm that the sony 7700 shown below has 3 RCA outs... My plan is to go for a 4 channel amp (plug rear and woofer to two channels) and use the other two channels for the components in the front. I will contact Sachin again in regards to the bill.... but he had said it might be more expensive with bill, like VAT etc.

Sam Kapasi · 14th July 2005, 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by aseem

Sam, sorry to ask this question again, but can u confirm that the sony 7700 shown below has 3 RCA outs... My plan is to go for a 4 channel amp (plug rear and woofer to two channels) and use the other two channels for the components in the front. I will contact Sachin again in regards to the bill.... but he had said it might be more expensive with bill, like VAT etc.

Yes it says that it has 2 pre-outs and a sub out, so that seems to be alrite. However, a few decks convert one pre-out to a sub-out so when you go there, ask for the deck to see, physically and check. If there are 3 pairs of rca outs, Bob's your uncle.

navin · 14th July 2005, 16:47

How did you know Sam. My uncle's name is actually Bob! :-)

Vivekphadnis · 15th July 2005, 00:54

Speaking of bills, I collected my bill today. All thanks to you Sam.
I thought one has to give a bill for everything sold under the VAT system. Funny how dealers try to play the fool.

Sam Kapasi · 15th July 2005, 13:16

Off topic, but the VAT system was devised so people would be unable to cheat the govt out of sales taxes. The dealers have such a hangover from the previous "local sales tax" method that they avoid giving a bill. It's just plain silly. Nobody benefits and the customer loses. Buying with a bill is a consumer right and we, as consumers just tend to let it slide when we dont get one.

I'm glad you got your bill.

Anytime.

Sam Kapasi · 15th July 2005, 13:42

Chal let me know what you think of the Graphics Job on this humble Esteem.

Vivekphadnis · 15th July 2005, 14:01

Phew! Takes my breath away. I wish I could listen to one of those systems somewhere. I plan to get down to adding subs and extra amps after I collect some money. I do not want to spend too much on my 8-month old Alto. The car is cramped for me and I might go in for a bigger car in the next few months.
By the way, what interconnects are they using for the amps?

Sam Kapasi · 15th July 2005, 14:16

They look like 3 different kinds of RCAs. I think the blue one is Streetwires and the Dark blue looks like Boss Audio (*Cringe*)
I didnt install this one. I'll check, this is Firoz's car by the way, lol. Firoz is our ASM for JBL car audio in Mumbai. Part of the perks are that we let anyone take whatever we want and put in their cars

I'm serious by the way. We all change our systems like mad, Ghar ki Kheti hai.

Firoz uses his esteem as a demo vehicle so we got this mad graphics job done on it

navin · 15th July 2005, 15:12

i'm not graphics guy. but i am a bit disappointed that the subs did not have a custom fiberglass box.

Sam Kapasi · 15th July 2005, 15:38

Nahi yaar Navin,

It's a readymade sub box. We sell it as it is. Just throw it in a car. I wasn't showing off the sound job, just the graphics.

aseem · 15th July 2005, 18:56

Just to get back to the topic. Everyone has been very helpful but I guess one reading this thread will find it very vague... some questions that still linger on my mind....

1) Get a good HU with 3 RCA outs 4V each... VFM system Pioneer 6650 for 7.6k and good high end Sony 7700 for 10.5k

2) Good Components for the front... possibly not Sony for 4.5 k as they dont have a crossover... Sam mentioned Components from JBL... Please specify the MODEL number and the price range...

3) Good triaxials at the rear... GTO series for 3.5 k thats fine

4) Good 4 channel amp... try Sony for 5k... else if money go for alpine... Which model of Alpine??? cost???

5) Go for a base tube... Whats the price and make???

15th July 2005, 13:16	#99 (permalink)
Sam Kapasi Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai (but watch this space) Posts: 6,218 View My Garage	Off topic, but the VAT system was devised so people would be unable to cheat the govt out of sales taxes. The dealers have such a hangover from the previous "local sales tax" method that they avoid giving a bill. It's just plain silly. Nobody benefits and the customer loses. Buying with a bill is a consumer right and we, as consumers just tend to let it slide when we dont get one. I'm glad you got your bill. Anytime. __________________ *“I am matter and you are matter, but it doesn’t matter.” – Captain Beefheart* Last edited by Sam Kapasi : 15th July 2005 at 13:17.

15th July 2005, 13:42	#100 (permalink)
Sam Kapasi Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai (but watch this space) Posts: 6,218 View My Garage	Chal let me know what you think of the Graphics Job on this humble Esteem. __________________ *“I am matter and you are matter, but it doesn’t matter.” – Captain Beefheart* Last edited by Sam Kapasi : 15th July 2005 at 13:44.

15th July 2005, 14:16	#102 (permalink)
Sam Kapasi Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai (but watch this space) Posts: 6,218 View My Garage	They look like 3 different kinds of RCAs. I think the blue one is Streetwires and the Dark blue looks like Boss Audio (Cringe) I didnt install this one. I'll check, this is Firoz's car by the way, lol. Firoz is our ASM for JBL car audio in Mumbai. Part of the perks are that we let anyone take whatever we want and put in their cars I'm serious by the way. We all change our systems like mad, Ghar ki Kheti hai. Firoz uses his esteem as a demo vehicle so we got this mad graphics job done on it __________________ *“I am matter and you are matter, but it doesn’t matter.” – Captain Beefheart*

15th July 2005, 15:38	#104 (permalink)
Sam Kapasi Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai (but watch this space) Posts: 6,218 View My Garage	Nahi yaar Navin, It's a readymade sub box. We sell it as it is. Just throw it in a car. I wasn't showing off the sound job, just the graphics. __________________ *“I am matter and you are matter, but it doesn’t matter.” – Captain Beefheart*

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14th July 2005, 00:28	#91 (permalink)
aseem Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Delhi Posts: 1,226	Just checked Sony website to see if the 7700 has 3 pre outs. Now it says that it has two pre outs and a sub out... is this the same as 3 pre outs? [font=Arial]AMPLIFIER • S-MOSFET Output Power: 52W x 4 • Pre Out x 2 • 4V High Voltage Pre Out • Sub Out • Aux-In Lite • DSO2 (Dynamic Soundstage Organizer 2) • EQ7 (7-Band Equalizer/7 Modes) • Bass/Treble • Loudness • High Pass Filter • Low Pass Filter • BBE[/font]

14th July 2005, 16:47	#97 (permalink)
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: mumbai Posts: 13,262	How did you know Sam. My uncle's name is actually Bob! :-)

15th July 2005, 00:54	#98 (permalink)
Vivekphadnis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 672	Speaking of bills, I collected my bill today. All thanks to you Sam. I thought one has to give a bill for everything sold under the VAT system. Funny how dealers try to play the fool.

15th July 2005, 14:01	#101 (permalink)
Vivekphadnis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 672	Phew! Takes my breath away. I wish I could listen to one of those systems somewhere. I plan to get down to adding subs and extra amps after I collect some money. I do not want to spend too much on my 8-month old Alto. The car is cramped for me and I might go in for a bigger car in the next few months. By the way, what interconnects are they using for the amps?

15th July 2005, 15:12	#103 (permalink)
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: mumbai Posts: 13,262	i'm not graphics guy. but i am a bit disappointed that the subs did not have a custom fiberglass box.

15th July 2005, 18:56	#105 (permalink)
aseem Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Delhi Posts: 1,226	Just to get back to the topic. Everyone has been very helpful but I guess one reading this thread will find it very vague... some questions that still linger on my mind.... 1) Get a good HU with 3 RCA outs 4V each... VFM system Pioneer 6650 for 7.6k and good high end Sony 7700 for 10.5k 2) Good Components for the front... possibly not Sony for 4.5 k as they dont have a crossover... Sam mentioned Components from JBL... Please specify the MODEL number and the price range... 3) Good triaxials at the rear... GTO series for 3.5 k thats fine 4) Good 4 channel amp... try Sony for 5k... else if money go for alpine... Which model of Alpine??? cost??? 5) Go for a base tube... Whats the price and make???