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Old 26th July 2010, 19:10   #211
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Default Questions about PDI

Hello All,

I have booked a Maruti SX4-ZXi, and went to the stockyard today for a PDI.

I was not allowed to drive the vehicle, so I could not check anything related to driving and sounds during motion etc. But I did a visual inspection and everything looked fine. Based on the chassis number, the car is manufactured in July 2010 and I am pretty happy about that.

Now some specific questions. It will be great if the experts could please help me out:

1. The engine had a sticker with the date of 14-July-2010. The person at the stockyard said this is the date of the engine assembly. There was transit receipt (a small piece of paper) in the car with the name of the driver and the date of 16-July-2010. So the person said that the engine was installed on July 14 and the car was sent out in truck on July 16th and it reached Bangalore today. Does this all make sense or something is missing?

2. Three out of four tyres (JK Vectra) had a code of *2610*, which I guess means manufactured in 26th week of 2010. But one (front right) had a code of 2110, which means manufactured in 21st week of 2010. The person there again said this is normal and in some cars all 5 tyres come with different dates. Is this normal?

3. The car had only 6 km on the ODO (6.2 km on both the tripmeters. The ODO does not show decimals, so it just had 6 on the ODO). I am again happy about it, but my question is that is it too less than normal? I had heard numbers like 50km to be normal. So it this too good to be true? Anything fishy?

4. All I could check was starting the engine, and it sounded much louder than any SX4 engines in my several test drives. It was idling at 1200 RPM. I could not wait too long to check if it settles down, which I guess it should. Is this normal again? I now realized that in all my test drives, the engine was already hot and I never did a true cold start. This one was a real cold start, and the person there again claimed this is just normal for a cold start.

5. Now if I say OK, I need to sign form 20 and then I can't change anything. So the next PDI during deliver day (as mentioned in this article) will be when the vehicle is already registered and won't it be too late to do anything anyway? So what is my normal course of action now? Should I go ahead and make the payment and show up in 2 days for delivery and take whatever is there?

Thanks in advance for your answers and help on this!

Thanks,
-AD
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Old 26th July 2010, 19:42   #212
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First of all, congratulations! The SX4 is one great VFM car and I'm sure you'll enjoy owning/driving it and mainly Maruti's outstanding service especially to their top-end vehicles. Good choice with the ZXi variant as well.

I'm no expert, but I'll use common sense and some experience to answer *some* of your questions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
Now some specific questions. It will be great if the experts could please help me out:

1. ... So the person said that the engine was installed on July 14 and the car was sent out in truck on July 16th and it reached Bangalore today. Does this all make sense or something is missing?
In my case, my new Civic was despatched from the factory on 19th July and will reach the stockyard day after tomorrow, apparently. Considering that Marutis also come from the NCR, I think the timing is OK.

Also, it doesn't take long at all to put together a car in a mechanized factory. MUL produces many hundreds of cars a day of the particular model that their lines are set up to produce on that day. So I wouldn't worry if I were you.

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Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
3. The car had only 6 km on the ODO (6.2 km on both the tripmeters. The ODO does not show decimals, so it just had 6 on the ODO). I am again happy about it, but my question is that is it too less than normal? I had heard numbers like 50km to be normal. So it this too good to be true? Anything fishy?
The car is driven from the stockyard to the showroom before it's handed over to you. Find out how far away your dealer's stockyard is from the showroom. That should put this doubt to rest.

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4. ... I now realized that in all my test drives, the engine was already hot and I never did a true cold start. This one was a real cold start, and the person there again claimed this is just normal for a cold start.
The one time I noticed this phenomenon was in really cold weather, obviously. The ECU in this Ford Focus I rented for a month in Boston in March 2007 (meaning really cold weather at least for the first half of the month) used to rev up the engine for the first couple of minutes after a cold start.

Considering Bengaluru in the monsoons (pretty cold, although not sub-freezing - which was the case in my example) I wouldn't be too surprised. But please cross-check with other SX4 owners.

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5. Now if I say OK, I need to sign form 20 and then I can't change anything. So the next PDI during deliver day (as mentioned in this article) will be when the vehicle is already registered and won't it be too late to do anything anyway? So what is my normal course of action now? Should I go ahead and make the payment and show up in 2 days for delivery and take whatever is there?
This is the question even I have. I guess one good reason to do a PDI here is to get the dealer to acknowledge that something happened to the car *while it was still in his hands*. Once you drive the car out, any damage you notice later on will be attributed to you only. This is especially true if you go for after-market accessory fitments.

So take a good hard look before you are formally handed the keys over, and take pictures (in their presence) of anything you find for good measure, if they aren't willing to accept responsibility for it on the spot.

By the way, even Honda refuses to let the unloaded car be taken out for a spin. So that's one part of the personal PDI that I won't be able to do.

I guess they are much more worried about liability to consumers than we are about being given a lemon. Shouldn't it be the other way around?

Regards,
spadix
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Old 26th July 2010, 20:18   #213
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Originally Posted by spadix View Post
First of all, congratulations! The SX4 is one great VFM car and I'm sure you'll enjoy owning/driving it and mainly Maruti's outstanding service especially to their top-end vehicles. Good choice with the ZXi variant as well.
Thanks a lot. I did a lot of research and test driving before finalized SX4. Once I am done with the formalities of completing my purchase (which turns out to be trickier that I thought), I will write the TD experiences.

And Congratulations on your Civic! Great car!!

Quote:
I'm no expert, but I'll use common sense and some experience to answer *some* of your questions.
Thanks for your responses.

Quote:
The car is driven from the stockyard to the showroom before it's handed over to you. Find out how far away your dealer's stockyard is from the showroom. That should put this doubt to rest.
Well, the car is still in the stockyard. I think the 6km is what the car was driven inside the factory for test drive and then to the truck. The car was just downloaded from the truck here in Bangalore. The dealer's showroom is about 15km away, and they do some more test driving during their own PDI, so I guess when I get the car at the showroom it will have around 50km.


Quote:
Considering Bengaluru in the monsoons (pretty cold, although not sub-freezing - which was the case in my example) I wouldn't be too surprised. But please cross-check with other SX4 owners.
Yup, I will check with someone. Actually, since I am getting a bit paranoid about these things, I could not be sure to myself if the engine noise was indeed more or if I was just paranoid. Given that the car was hardly driven at all and there was no sign whatsoever of any foul play, I am tending towards attributing this to me being paranoid and ignoring this.

Quote:
This is the question even I have. I guess one good reason to do a PDI here is to get the dealer to acknowledge that something happened to the car *while it was still in his hands*. Once you drive the car out, any damage you notice later on will be attributed to you only. This is especially true if you go for after-market accessory fitments.
I agree. Even if we can't change the car, at least we can make dealer fix it well if we find some problem during next PDI.

Quote:
I guess they are much more worried about liability to consumers than we are about being given a lemon. Shouldn't it be the other way around?
True. I guess they are also worried about the car itself. What if someone does some damage to the car during such "unofficial test drive" in the stockyard? Unlike the designated demo cars, these cars are not insured. The test driver can then walk away from the car (because he/she has not yet signed form 20), but the dealer will be stuck with a damaged, uninsured car. So I guess it makes sense that they won't let us drive cars in the stockyard. I wonder how US system worked. In US, they let you drive the exact car you want to buy.

Thanks,
-AD
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Old 27th July 2010, 09:14   #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
And Congratulations on your Civic! Great car!!

Thanks for your responses.
Thanks to you too! And you're most welcome.

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Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
Well, the car is still in the stockyard.
Ah, I missed this aspect in your earlier post. I went back and re-read it and yes, you're right. Expect to find around 25 kms on it. 50 km is something I would be worried about given the distance you mentioned. That would raise the "demo car" alarm bell to me. I know Hyundai uses even PDI'ed cars as demo cars! I took a Verna diesel TD a couple of years back in Bengaluru and the salesperson casually mentioned *during* the TD that the car is due for delivery in a couple of hours!

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Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
I am tending towards attributing this to me being paranoid and ignoring this.
Get hold of someone you know who owns an SX4 and is knowledgeable about these things. Don't ignore it if you can. Peace of mind will prevail later.

Regards,
spadix
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Old 30th July 2010, 17:50   #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spadix View Post
Get hold of someone you know who owns an SX4 and is knowledgeable about these things. Don't ignore it if you can. Peace of mind will prevail later.
Update on engine noise: I checked another car and it had the same noise, and that was also idling at 1200 RMP after a cold start. Also, PM'ed a few SX4 owners and they confirmed that the car does idle at higher RPM on old start. So overall, I feel better now and do not think there is any issue with my car's idling. Many thanks to the SX4 owners to replied to my PM!

Thanks,
-AD
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Old 4th August 2010, 18:46   #216
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Thanks for the info, am taking a print of this as I am planning to buy a hatch.
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Old 12th August 2010, 11:08   #217
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Hello friends


Im planning a Safari GX 4x2 and got the VIN #
I also saw the vehicle at their service centre (the sales guy said they already brought it to service centre, i havent signed the Form20 and handed over).


Following are the things I noticed.

1.The roof ski rack’s paint has already chipped off
2.There is a visible scratch just above the back number plate area (no plates installed ).
3.The odometer reads 120KMS ( I understand their stock yard is in Peenya, it cant be 120KMS from there to whitefield), is 120KMS an acceptable limit?

4.The VIN number indicates the month & year of manufacturing as 1st May 2010. while couple of members here i know who took delivery around the last week of July have got July 2010 dated vehicles (from a different dealer)


Please help me with your inputs/sugggestions
thanks
Keyan
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Old 12th August 2010, 12:16   #218
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Hello

I am highly grateful for all this tips. I have booked a safari GX . I am a bit confused of how the car buying works as this is my first showroom buy.

I have paid the initial 51k booking amount. Now the prices of safari have reduced, so the dealer told me to pay my loan cheque and they would adjust the remaining amount of discounts and all in the down payment. However for loan he gave me the pre decrease price so that i can get more loan. Now all done, my loan cheque would arrive next week. I have few queries

What happens when you give initial booking amount??

When is the car alloted to you??

The dealer told me as soon as the car is alloted and ready he would sms me the VIN number ??

When should i ask the dealer that i want to go for PDI at the stockyard??

Should i Pay all the amount in advance??

I have a house in Thane where I am doing my registration. However I would be getting the posession in 3 months so no light bill. The guy told me that with some adjustment at RTO this would be done and he told me it makes sense to go for thane as I might save around 60k. Plus I am not doing anything illegal as in 3 months my light bill would arrive. This registration settlement [the extra money needs to be paid in cash]. So I was asking specifically when i should go for a PDI??

Some questions a re novice and I have read the thread completely but would be grateful if someone can re explain things in a easy term

I have opted for mineral red color [as thats one in current batch] and the delivery is promised by this month end.

I am getting reverse camera fit instead of reverse sensors in G, plus getting mud flaps, mats and anti rust free. He was also throwing in teflon coating but after reading i have decided against it and would tell him to adjust that inthe extra money he may charge for reverse camera.

He is also giving me free extended warranty, plus some disc on insurance would be worked out and some cash disc on safari
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Old 12th August 2010, 12:31   #219
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Excellent article. This is the article that brought me to Team-BHP. I was researching on google and came across this article. Really helpful while buying my Corolla Altis.
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Old 12th August 2010, 13:50   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
I am highly grateful for all this tips. I have booked a safari GX . I am a bit confused of how the car buying works as this is my first showroom buy.

I have opted for mineral red color [as thats one in current batch] and the delivery is promised by this month end.
Congratulations, Lodhra! That's a great vehicle for our roads and a very stress-free drive in our highways. The Safari was one of the vehicles in my consideration set and to date I still haven't found a solid explanation as to why I didn't go for it over the Civic .

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Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
I have paid the initial 51k booking amount. Now the prices of safari have reduced, so the dealer told me to pay my loan cheque and they would adjust the remaining amount of discounts and all in the down payment.
Get this in writing if you can. Usually dealers won't give you cash back, but you can get accessories for the balance amount. So at least get an SMS or email if not a written, stamped record on their letterhead.

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Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
However for loan he gave me the pre decrease price so that i can get more loan. Now all done, my loan cheque would arrive next week.
That shouldn't be too much of a problem. The bank will look at the final invoice and they may raise a couple of questions but you could say that there was a retrospective price decrease and the benefit was passed on to you.

The bigger thing to keep in mind is to see how this affects the lifetime tax. In my case, I paid the full LTT and later realized that the ex-showroom price itself was reduced by the quantum of discounts (standard practice) which means the LTT is correspodingly reduced. I'm now getting accessories worth the difference amount.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
What happens when you give initial booking amount??

When is the car alloted to you??

The dealer told me as soon as the car is alloted and ready he would sms me the VIN number ??
A notice is sent to the factory to tag a vehicle with your name and that vehicle is allotted to your dealer. Nothing is set in stone yet. If you decide to cancel your order you could still do it, and depending on the dealer and manufacturer they could retain a small percentage of the booking amount as a "restocking" fee at the dealer's yard.

The factory sends a daily list of allotted vehicles to the dealer and this list contains the VIN, manufacturing date/booking date, date on which the vehicle was dispatched to the dealer, engine number and customer's name (if applicable i.e. if it was tagged at the factory itself).

In some cases, cars are untagged. This is the "regular" monthly inventory that a dealer maintains for walk-in buys. If this list has a car with your choice of colour and variant and manufacturing date it could be assigned to you.

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Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
When should i ask the dealer that i want to go for PDI at the stockyard??
Best time to do it would be as soon as the container truck unloads the vehicle at the stockyard. Beware though that the car would be covered with dust and you might not like its looks at this stage . But it *is* tremendous fun and gives you great satisfaction even in this state. Don't miss this opportunity.

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Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
Should i Pay all the amount in advance??
If you're sure of buying the car, then why not? However, it's a good idea not to because if you uncover something during your personal PDI it's easier to not get bullied by the dealer into accepting that vehicle.

Your call.

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Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
However I would be getting the posession in 3 months so no light bill.
.
.
.
So I was asking specifically when i should go for a PDI??
This should have no bearing on the PDI itself, but you could try this for address proof - request the local post office to send a letter to your address. Once that letter arrives, take it to the post office along with your photograph and ask them to endorse it. This endorsed letter is a valid address proof for one year. Not many people know of this because this is a new initiative by the Indian government for address proof verification. Talk to the RTO and figure out if this works. Even landline/mobile bills and bank statements on that address are accepted these days by RTO.

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Originally Posted by lodhra View Post
I am getting reverse camera fit instead of reverse sensors in G, plus getting mud flaps, mats and anti rust free. He was also throwing in teflon coating but after reading i have decided against it and would tell him to adjust that inthe extra money he may charge for reverse camera.

He is also giving me free extended warranty, plus some disc on insurance would be worked out and some cash disc on safari
That's a neat bunch of FOC accessories. Get a body cover also if you can. Explore corporate discounts also if it's applicable to you.

Regards,
spadix
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Old 12th August 2010, 16:35   #221
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Originally Posted by keyank View Post
...

Following are the things I noticed.

1.The roof ski rack’s paint has already chipped off
2.There is a visible scratch just above the back number plate area (no plates installed ).
3.The odometer reads 120KMS ( I understand their stock yard is in Peenya, it cant be 120KMS from there to whitefield), is 120KMS an acceptable limit?

4.The VIN number indicates the month & year of manufacturing as 1st May 2010. while couple of members here i know who took delivery around the last week of July have got July 2010 dated vehicles (from a different dealer)
...
1. This can be replaced under warranty; not sure if they will do it without persuasion.

2. If not a major issue, ignore it. Else you can always check for another unit.

3. Are you taking it from Prerana? 120kms is on the higher side, but then, not something to be concerned about.

4. GX 4x2 is a variant only people with focus on safety will buy, so this piece might be something that the dealer had to hold on due to lack of demand. Again, not an issue.

Hand over the signed form only if you are able to sort out all the concerns to your satifaction.
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Old 12th August 2010, 17:42   #222
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@spadix

Thank you so much, you just made my day easy. Yes i have receipt for 51k so no issues.

Now that you have mentioned about acc and disci will speak with him and ask him about the VIN and all stuff and yes would not miss the opp to go to the stockyard and see the dust filled car

Thank you once again and wil keep posted

also thank you for the post office info, would see if that can be done , however the RTO guys would take money anyways so would try and see if all goes smoothly

The dealer is not sending me new quoation as per reduced prices, maybe they are not in hurry of taking money or just being very casual. I wish these tata guys could eb a bit more professional.

I am calling them everyday to ask if they can settle the remaining payment amount so that i can pay them and surprisingly these guys are not even bothered to call me and take my payment

I sometimes do not know if they are buying a car from me or vice versa

But hopefully they need time to work out all and tell me something before they commit anything

So waiting for my buy

and spadix thanks also for that Safari confidence, my mom wanted volkswagen, bro wanted civic, dad [he just wants me out of the house] but i decide on safari so that words are comforting

regards
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Old 12th August 2010, 18:14   #223
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Lodhra,

Do check the latest price and the relevant reduction in road tax before making the final payment. Involve the TATA customer representative if the the sales guy is acting funny (raise an issue thru TATA website).



Quote:
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...my mom wanted volkswagen, bro wanted civic, dad [he just wants me out of the house] but i decide on safari so that words are comforting...
Good one!
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Old 13th August 2010, 13:43   #224
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Regarding the form 22 and the road worthiness certificate, I got a copy of the form 22 for my grande punto from the dealer but it doesnt specifically mention the year or month of manufacture. Can someone elaborate as to where to look?
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Old 13th August 2010, 14:21   #225
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and spadix thanks also for that Safari confidence, my mom wanted volkswagen, bro wanted civic, dad [he just wants me out of the house] but i decide on safari so that words are comforting
Hahahaha! Good one, lodhra! But I think the vehicle will win your father over.

Regarding RTA, just go and enquire casually at the help desk. I don't know about Mumbai but in Hyderabad, no one takes you for a ride or takes you to task for asking basic questions, but you need to be persistent because those guys are just so busy these days (understaffed offices; ever-exploding consumerism and thereby new vehicles on the roads every day).

Regards,
spadix
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