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Old 12th January 2013, 21:59   #31
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

I just replaced my stock speakers yesterday. I fitted the JBL GTO509C component system in the front with the tweeters just above the seat belts on the B-Pillar. For the rear I got a pair of JBL CS-5 speakers.

The whole thing set me back by Rs.7800?- which seemed reasonable. The speakers are 5.25 inch affairs and no alteration needs to be made.

As for the stock speaker, the less said the better......I'll post the pics tomorrow though
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Old 13th January 2013, 10:13   #32
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by woodcrawler View Post
... in the front with the tweeters just above the seat belts on the B-Pillar. ... no alteration needs to be made. ...
What made you put the tweeters on the B-pillar? And this is the tweeters of the front components??? What happened to the stock location in the sail panel (inside the ORVM)?

Though I have not experienced the sound in your car, I would expect the image somewhere between the left shoulder of the driver and right shoulder of front passenger with this mounting arrangement. One expect the sound image near the windshield, as if the music is playing on stage in front of you.
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Old 13th January 2013, 11:33   #33
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Originally Posted by woodcrawler View Post
I just replaced my stock speakers yesterday. I fitted the JBL GTO509C component system in the front with the tweeters just above the seat belts on the B-Pillar. For the rear I got a pair of JBL CS-5 speakers.

The whole thing set me back by Rs.7800?- which seemed reasonable. The speakers are 5.25 inch affairs and no alteration needs to be made.

As for the stock speaker, the less said the better......I'll post the pics tomorrow though
Hey that sounds pretty neat job for sub 8k budget. You did not install any amp though?
Gurus: Is that a good idea? Because I am also looking for upgrade with similar budget. Thanks.
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Old 13th January 2013, 13:24   #34
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
What made you put the tweeters on the B-pillar? And this is the tweeters of the front components??? What happened to the stock location in the sail panel (inside the ORVM)?

......... One expect the sound image near the windshield, as if the music is playing on stage in front of you.
DerAlte, perhaps I should say I took inspiration from your signature line; "Never believe it cannot be done.....". It was my understanding that the tweeter should be around ear level. Looking around the Duster and considering what I have experienced in other cars I thought it was worth a try. It's mounted in such a way that I can move it if I wanted but I like the sound effect now and people in the back seat benefit too

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Originally Posted by engrohit View Post
Hey that sounds pretty neat job for sub 8k budget. You did not install any amp though?
Gurus: Is that a good idea? Because I am also looking for upgrade with similar budget. Thanks.
engrohit, I did consider the amp but put it off for the moment. My listening tastes find this combination more than adequate. If budget were a constraint you might find adding the amp doubling your cost. Let the Gurus have their say.

Here are some pics of how it is mounted.
Attached Thumbnails
ICE upgrade : Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano-p1130061.jpg  

ICE upgrade : Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano-p1130056.jpg  

ICE upgrade : Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano-p1130057.jpg  

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Old 13th January 2013, 17:06   #35
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by woodcrawler View Post
... I took inspiration from your signature line; ...
I am embarrassed that my signature line inspired someone to do THIS!!!

Sorry, but this is worse than taxi drivers getting the Pioneer TS20 tweeters mounted near the windshield-roof joint line, firing directly into their faces. Please, please do the following:
* Attend a live concert preferably in an enclosed room, and sit in front of the musicians (doesn't matter whether near or far)
* Take a ride in a friend's / TeamBHP member's car in your region with a conventional tweeter mounting.
Close your eyes and try to find out where the individual instruments are. Unless you do this, you will not understand what I am trying to tell you.

You will (should) be able to understand what a proper sound stage is to be expected in a car. We expect the sound stage in the car as close to a realistic live performance as possible, i.e. musicians in front, not behind, nor in the center of the car, nor not identifiable where.

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Originally Posted by woodcrawler View Post
... like the sound effect now and people in the back seat benefit too ...
There is nothing wrong in doing what one imagines, but it would be a travesty of the word 'benefit'.

Last edited by DerAlte : 13th January 2013 at 17:12.
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Old 13th January 2013, 17:37   #36
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
I am embarrassed that my signature line inspired someone to do THIS!!!

.........
* Take a ride in a friend's / TeamBHP member's car in your region with a conventional tweeter mounting.
Close your eyes and try to find out where the individual instruments are. Unless you do this, you will not understand what I am trying to tell you.
........

There is nothing wrong in doing what one imagines, but it would be a travesty of the word 'benefit'.
Hey bro, just in jest. It is perfectly relocatable, the tweeters. I'll take your suggestion and do some serious listening. Maybe ......but eccentrics always do differently
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Old 14th January 2013, 10:59   #37
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Hey bro, just in jest. It is perfectly relocatable, the tweeters. I'll take your suggestion and do some serious listening. Maybe ......but eccentrics always do differently
LOL. Woodcrawler, while it is nice to have the tweeter at ear height, it also needs to be in the same plane as the woofer. Currently your woofer is in front of you firing at your knees and your tweeter is behind you firing at your ears.

Beside the left passenger will be hearing only the left tweeter and the driver will be hearing only the right tweeter. There will no semblance of a STEREO soundstage.

read this guide
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-gR8eXrd...oundstage.html

this is not recommended in smaller indian cars becuase our kick panels dont have adequate space but the therory is right.
http://www.caraudiohelp.com/car_spea..._placement.htm
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Old 14th January 2013, 16:05   #38
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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LOL. Woodcrawler, while it is nice to have the tweeter at ear height, it also needs to be in the same plane as the woofer. Currently your woofer is in front of you firing at your knees and your tweeter is behind you firing at your ears.

Beside the left passenger will be hearing only the left tweeter and the driver will be hearing only the right tweeter. There will no semblance of a STEREO soundstage.
Thanks Navin, but I've seen it placed in the 'regular' position so I just thought I'd try something different. The links you posted are awesome; I'm only wondering why I did not find them while I was Googling for 'tweeter positions' . You are right (and so is DerAlte), with my current location of tweeters the stage is somewhere floating around the cabin .

I did this on a whim and I have to go back to my accessory wallah today. It seems his ears are like mine, because he was telling me he found this 'sound effect' quite nice. I dunno if he was pulling my leg (most likely so, considering the opinions of the Gurus) or if the Duster's cabin has unique acoustics. In any case, I'll go back and reposition the 'offending' bits in more conventional locations sometime later this week.

The kick panel area in the Duster is too cramped already; I'm sure you know that. Maybe the on-dash or A-pillar option will be the best. I'll update as soon as I get that done. Wherever I place it finally, it will sound better the abominations Renault provides as OE speakers
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Old 14th January 2013, 16:15   #39
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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I'm only wondering why I did not find them while I was Googling for 'tweeter positions' .
I rarely use Google. I find a lot of stuff Google and Wiki throws up to not be entirely in line with my observations.

However I have used Crutchfield for over 25 years ('86 to today). In the old days they used to mail me a hand book every other year or so so I knew they would have this covered on their website.
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Old 14th January 2013, 17:55   #40
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by navin View Post
I rarely use Google. I find a lot of stuff Google and Wiki throws up to not be entirely in line with my observations.

However I have used Crutchfield for over 25 years ('86 to today). In the old days they used to mail me a hand book every other year or so so I knew they would have this covered on their website.
Thanks again. A very enlightening post for a novice, from a serious music buff.
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Old 15th January 2013, 12:22   #41
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
What made you put the tweeters on the B-pillar? And this is the tweeters of the front components??? What happened to the stock location in the sail panel (inside the ORVM)?

.
Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
LOL. Woodcrawler, while it is nice to have the tweeter at ear height, it also needs to be in the same plane as the woofer. Currently your woofer is in front of you firing at your knees and your tweeter is behind you firing at your ears.
Gurujis, I just got my tweeters shifted to the top of the A-pillars. I'm in office so I've not heard the sounds emanating but I'm pretty sure you guys will be right and I'll be wrong and looking.

Thank you once again. I'll post the pics here later
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Old 15th January 2013, 13:20   #42
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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... I just got my tweeters shifted to the top of the A-pillars. ...
Sheesh! Your accessory fella is a screwdriver and insulation tape guy - he has NO clue of speaker mounting. He wasn't pulling your leg, he is ignorant - simple.

Please look at where people have mounted tweeters in the Sound Off & Show Off thread, no matter which car small or big. The most common positions are:
* Inside the ORVM panel (this is the DEFAULT mounting location in Duster; it has a grill for it)
* 3-4" above the dash at the bottom of A-pillar

Please call that gentleman and ask him to use one of these, preferably the OE mount. The advantage of the OE mount is that when cleaning the car, the service guys cannot dislodge the tweeter.
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Old 15th January 2013, 13:31   #43
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
The most common positions are:
* Inside the ORVM panel (this is the DEFAULT mounting location in Duster; it has a grill for it)
* 3-4" above the dash at the bottom of A-pillar.
Exactly. Why not use the default location?

The other location i find that works well (but involves a little cutting) is in the front door as high as one can go. Remember an important part of soundstage is to try and have all the drivers involved reasonably close together.

I do admit that in a car this is not easy but with a little thought it is not impossible to get decent imaging and sound stage.

Here is another article from Crutchfield. These dont know everything about car audio but they know a lot and their website alone carries more than enough information for all but the most advanced car audio installs.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-NuqakN4...on-part-3.aspx
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Old 15th January 2013, 15:56   #44
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... The other location i find that works well (but involves a little cutting) is in the front door as high as one can go ...
Personally I never recommend that since
a. leaves an unsightly hole when the tweeter is taken out before selling the car, and
b. Almost none of the components have a tilt arrangement suitable for that (neutral or laid-back tweeters which don't need to be mounted off-axis)
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Old 28th February 2013, 15:43   #45
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Default re: ICE for the Renault Duster & Nissan Terrano

Trying to revive a dead thread here! Are their any final verdicts on the placement of the tweeters on the Duster I am going in head on for the install Monday ( 04 Mar'13). All your advise and pearls of wisdom will be much appreciated.

I have the new Media Nav with my 85 RXL.

Also which component Speakers would be advisable, I plan to put my old Kenwood KAC 8401 with the install.
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