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Old 3rd May 2006, 18:04   #16
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Kb in my last posts I have not written a single word "audision" And I am not blaming audision till I come to know where the problem is . I just talking about the amperage of the amp thats all, I have not compliant any thing about the kit , In the pics also I have removed the company name, I just wanna reach to the root cause of the problem thats all nothing else. As a customer If I am wrong I will keep quite BUT if I am right I will surely get a new kit replaced . These are small things to me I will not fight for some small amount of money. I just pointed out this which were wrong. Gunbir is the best installer that I have seen no doubt on that, but when it comes to power rating he calculates it in a different way. I was just suggesting him how to caluculate the amperage thats all nothing else.
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Old 3rd May 2006, 18:51   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
but when it comes to power rating he calculates it in a different way. I was just suggesting him how to caluculate the amperage thats all nothing else.
LBM before even going down on calculations of amperage, wattage, ratings blah blah blah...Get your fundamentals on dealing with DC Voltage, working of amplifiers and their thermal & electrical efficiency clear.

There is nothing wrong with any calculations those cables were not be used with your system. When dealing with DC voltage the current carrying capacity depends on the size of the cable.

Eg. If you have to carry 100 Amp across 3m and 100 Amp across 5m you need thicker cable in the latter case as you are dealing with DC voltage here.

Your amps can take upto 4 guage cables that does not imply you take the power to the amplifiers on a 4 guage cable from the battery and use mutiple 4 guage wires for multiple amplifiers. With your kind of load, the power should be brought closer to amps in a thicker wire (0 guage or 2guage) then distribute to the amps over 4 guage cable using appropriate distribution block for both power (fused) and ground (non fused). This is the correct way not the one you have done.

Also definitely your amplifiers draw more current than 80 Amps. The fuses on the amplifiers are of the less value to keep the amplifier safe. You cannot put fuses based on the transient power ratings, but your amplifier does consume more power on those transient passage and needs more amperage.

If you still can't understand where problem lies then I suggest you use DC-AC convertor in your engine bay carry AC voltage using a 8 guage cable (Kalinga Cable or Finolex will do) to AC-DC Convertor in your boot near amplifiers then you will have no problems with fuse holder melting, lights dimming, bass cutting. Just make sure your convertors are 100% efficient.

Don't ask me how it will help just do it.

Last edited by Autophile : 3rd May 2006 at 18:52.
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Old 3rd May 2006, 19:40   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Autophile
Also definitely your amplifiers draw more current than 80 Amps. The fuses on the amplifiers are of the less value to keep the amplifier safe. You cannot put fuses based on the transient power ratings, but your amplifier does consume more power on those transient passage and needs more amperage.
yo yo yo man just riddle me this as u say my amp draws more powa than 80 amps y hvnt my 20a x 4 fuses have never ever messed up, thou thats a seprate issue that yo 80a cable got busted?????

Note from Moderator - Please do not use foul language on TBHP. Post edited.

Last edited by Rehaan : 4th May 2006 at 05:56.
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Old 3rd May 2006, 20:05   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
yo yo yo man just riddle me this as u say my amp draws more powa than 80 amps y hvnt my 20a x 4 fuses have never ever fu**d up, thou thats a seprate issue that yo 80a cable got busted?????
Thats whyI am saying get your fundas clear. You saying this adds another assignment in your home work. Fuse and their ratings and also under what circumstances does the fuse blow???

No amplifier is 100 % efficient Class T or D, don't even thing about Class AB or A's. The amplifier efficiency is lost in heat thats why they have big heat sinks. If this would not have been the case, the amplifiers would have been the size of a cigarette case.

The fuses does take time to blow and need double amperage of its specified rating to blow, in that case also a fuse will take 4-5mins.

On the other hand the thin cables in heavy current draw application will get heated up and their resistance increases which further hindres the current flow and the cable temperature rises because of load, which leads to thermal damage of cable. Its the simple rule of physics which you are not understanding.

Had this not been case their would have been no 0, 2 guage cables in the car audio cable manufacturer catalog.

On the very first day I told you to use minimum 2 guage cable from battery to a distribution block in the boot and then distribute the power to your amplifiers by using 4 guage cables but you never listened.

You think you are right and knows everything and others are bunch of fools, you pass statements without understanding the subject. I will suggest that you clear your fundas before writing on the forums.

Can you tell me that why you don't need 0-2-4 guage cables or even 8 guage in your home / office for running heavy loads like AC's / machines etc. And even not that thick cables are used to didtribute electricity from a grid to a town/city.

Last edited by Autophile : 3rd May 2006 at 20:09.
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Old 4th May 2006, 01:03   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Autophile
Thats whyI am saying get your fundas clear. You saying this adds another assignment in your home work. Fuse and their ratings and also under what circumstances does the fuse blow???

No amplifier is 100 % efficient Class T or D, don't even thing about Class AB or A's. The amplifier efficiency is lost in heat thats why they have big heat sinks. If this would not have been the case, the amplifiers would have been the size of a cigarette case.

The fuses does take time to blow and need double amperage of its specified rating to blow, in that case also a fuse will take 4-5mins.

On the other hand the thin cables in heavy current draw application will get heated up and their resistance increases which further hindres the current flow and the cable temperature rises because of load, which leads to thermal damage of cable. Its the simple rule of physics which you are not understanding.

Had this not been case their would have been no 0, 2 guage cables in the car audio cable manufacturer catalog.

On the very first day I told you to use minimum 2 guage cable from battery to a distribution block in the boot and then distribute the power to your amplifiers by using 4 guage cables but you never listened.

You think you are right and knows everything and others are bunch of fools, you pass statements without understanding the subject. I will suggest that you clear your fundas before writing on the forums.

Can you tell me that why you don't need 0-2-4 guage cables or even 8 guage in your home / office for running heavy loads like AC's / machines etc. And even not that thick cables are used to didtribute electricity from a grid to a town/city.


First I am saying fool to nobody in this forum. And thanks for ur good Physics Lecture. Thanks again. It is not me to learn, But it can be u also in the que after Gunbir.

Secondly what could u tell me about the follow

a 4 gauge wire is having a area of 21.2 mm2
and a 2 gauge has a area of 33.6 mm2
as I am using two cables the the net area of counducter from battery and the amp is 21.2 + 21.2 = 42.4 mm2 which is siginicantly more than the 2 gauge wire . Also as I am running the wire parallel the resistance would be

1/R= 1/r1 + 1/r2

It would be half in that case. So that dont tell me It is simple logic (not Physics) to have to
two wire of 4 gauge > single wire of 2 gauge

Also as suggested by u I am taking both wires to the boot from where i am distrubuting the wires to each of theses three amps. Will upload the pics if u wanna see the distribution block which I DIY.


And people on this forum are viewing this thread (135 views) but not commenting on the same , Navin ji , B&T ,Sam, and the other experts if there are any where are U?
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Old 4th May 2006, 03:38   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
First I am saying fool to nobody in this forum. And thanks for ur good Physics Lecture. Thanks again. It is not me to learn, But it can be u also in the que after Gunbir.
LBM... I've been avoiding this for a long time now. I have spent hundreds of hours on this forum with the sole purpose of helping people with their problems. And though I love everybody here and love being here. But when you tell JB he needs to que up and learn anything about audio from YOU (when you're so clearly wrong), I have no choice but to do this. Mods If you need to ban me, please do so.

LBM your misusing, damaging and calling a perfectly good product "bad quality" is fine with me. You have that right as a consumer. But I will not allow anyone to disrespect JB. He is a close friend (family to me really) but beyond that I consider him my Guru. And I come from an upbringing where I was tought to respect my teacher and the process of knowledge.

I pity you. I truly feel sorry for the people who have to put up with you on a daily basis. You are an ignorant fool. Part of being a DIY'er is learning from your (and others) mistakes. Unfortunately for you, you think you know it all. I have heard you car. I never wanted to say this. But heres the truth. It sounds like crap. It is by far the WORST system I've heard in a long time. All I could hear was port noise and one-note-boom. I have heard budget systems that were a hundred times more musical and enjoyable than your system. Throwing money at equipment does NOT get you great sound. You think you know it all but you cant even get your own system sounding right. Dude you wouldnt know SQ if it came up and bit you in the ***.

If mods ban me I have no issues. Hell If I was a mod, I would ban myself for this outburst, but there are limits to my patience. People on this forum know I have plenty of patience for people who are here to learn. But none for a dumb stubborn ignorant fool like you.

Adios.

Last edited by gunbir : 4th May 2006 at 03:46.
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Old 4th May 2006, 05:02   #22
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RELAX gyz.... we are all friends here, learning from each other, REALLY.
dont take anything to a personal level yaar. its all about being friends and learning from each other experiences. sorry if i sounded like a moderator. cheers!
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Old 4th May 2006, 09:49   #23
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Hey LBM,

Get a life and stop insulting people who are one of the best in the business. I have been reading your posts on this topic and cannot help but agree with the rest.

If you have issues with their knowledge I'll give you a very simple answer. Why come here for advice since you feel these guys know nothing. There are tons of international forums like sound domain for e.g. Why dont you go there and chew their brains. These guys are here to help and offer free advice to wha they feel is 100% correct. They are not forcing anyone to follow it, they are just guiding you if you dont want to follow it your choice.

I suggest you apologise to them and then either follow their advice or shut up.

Mods I feel this topic has gone on long enough and time to close it.

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Old 4th May 2006, 10:23   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
First I am saying fool to nobody in this forum. And thanks for ur good Physics Lecture. Thanks again. It is not me to learn, But it can be u also in the que after Gunbir.

a 4 gauge wire is having a area of 21.2 mm2
and a 2 gauge has a area of 33.6 mm2

And people on this forum are viewing this thread (135 views) but not commenting on the same , Navin ji , B&T ,Sam, and the other experts if there are any where are U?
I dont the above words (in bold) were nesscary. Please keep all discussions polite. I may look soft but I am not some old man who will tolerate this!

0/1 GA is 53.5mm > 42.4mm. Does that help?
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Old 4th May 2006, 10:25   #25
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LBM...

I cant help but agree.,...

I tried to tell you indirectly - that if this was to prove Audison's are bad then all you needed to do do was to get yourself any other 4Ga wire and hook it up.. if that worked you would have had your whipping post.

First thing one needs to understand about science is that Logic and Science dont always go hand in hand - if it did nothing would have ever been discovered/invented!!... Guess I leant this way back in 2nd standard!! For eg... Hydrogen is a highly inflamable gas.... Oxygen is again known to aid combustion... Bloody hell - they put satellites into space!! but together - H2O - puts Flames out!! ... No "LOGICAL" Mushroom Cloud there!!

Like Viper said - you asked for advice - you were given some - ... You are free to accept or reject - but DO NOT insult the Giver... Have you wondered why no one else has bothered answering despite all those views.......???

Lastly ... Saw your car snaps... HORRIBLE WHEELS ... you have managed to make the car of the year look like some gargoyle!! Again - this is IMHO!!

CHILL!!
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Old 4th May 2006, 10:39   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kb100
Lastly ... Saw your car snaps... HORRIBLE WHEELS ... you have managed to make the car of the year look like some gargoyle!!
KB100, that hurts! Please keep ALL discussions polite.
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Old 4th May 2006, 10:48   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
KB100, that hurts! Please keep ALL discussions polite.
That was IMHO....

@ LBM - anyways its obvious you liked it ... finally thats what matters!!.. My apologies... that was just my worthless .02 - not a dig..

Last edited by kb100 : 4th May 2006 at 10:50.
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Old 4th May 2006, 11:19   #28
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Ok I step down what I said but I will make u people realize that what I was saying is right. I will not say a word till I have solid proof for it. About my car sounding at the ncr meet there where nearly 20 people there , They must be reading this thread , and I serouisly need r advice people that how my ICE sounded, was it a crap or a ok.

One more thing Gunbir Sir U quoted that my each amp takes nearly 120 amps
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunbir
your amps should consume over 120A each.

So... yet again... and once and for all... YOU NEED 2ga Cable. I dont know what its gonna take to get this though to you...
and I have a third amp which according to the manual it consumes 43.7 amps continous ,then my current demand of the system comes to

120+120+43=283 amps.

which by means from ur wire gauge chart by no means comes close to 2 gauge wire so why r u every time recommending a 2 gauge wire as it is requiring 0/1 gauge wire. One more thing my ICE load will be nearly 290 amps in which the hu and eq and the other suff involved . And for the rest of the electrical system included, take approx 30 amps.then the total load on the system is near 320 amps. which I think my car cannot handle , correct me if I am wrong. I am having a 41ah battery and a 75 amps alternater. Please clear my doubts.As I am a fool with a bad sounding car.
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Old 4th May 2006, 11:34   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
.
then my current demand of the system comes to

120+120+43=283 amps.

which by means from ur wire gauge chart by no means comes close to 2 gauge wire so why r u every time recommending a 2 gauge wire as it is requiring 0/1 gauge wire.

As I am a fool with a bad sounding car.
LBM

Gunbir in his post 5 of this thread clarifed that you need 0/1 GA cable from the battery to the dist. block. then you can use either 2 or 4 ga cable from the dist block to the amp (depending on the length of run and amps drawn).
Gunbir's wordsI "I would really recommend you a 1/0ga cable from your battery down to a multi-way distribution block somewhere in the boot, after which you could have short lengths of 4ga cable to your amps with separate fuses for each ourput"

And nobody is calling you a fool. with a bad sounding car.
a) no one is a fool. atleast no one who loves audio like you do.
b) we have not heard you car so we are not in a position to pass judgement and finally it is your car, your money, your ears. You are obligated to please no one but yourself (and family).

I've been told a few times that my car system does not play loud enough, lacks oopmh and sizzle and the last octave of bass. I agree on all counts but I love my car system and know the limitation I placed on myself (making room for my son's bike was more important to me than the last octave for example). When such comments are passed I simply smile.
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Old 4th May 2006, 12:49   #30
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what about my 320 amps demand ? and 75 amps alter and 41 ah battery supply?

Because of this large load will there be voltage drop I think so ?

Last edited by low_bass_makker : 4th May 2006 at 12:50.
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