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Old 25th July 2006, 10:14   #1
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Default why sound is harsh at high volume

hi guys

yesterday i went to sony world to check out sony amp
and found that quality was nice but
sound started to break away at very high volume( this thing is common to all system i guess). sound distorted at only upper level of volume range at rest sound was quite nice. amp used was rated 800w

and can anybody give some tips to reduce distortion at high volumes.
like using quality cable and better amps etc
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Old 25th July 2006, 10:37   #2
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1) badly tuning can be a reason
2) wires too can be a reason
3) sony speakers is the reason
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Old 25th July 2006, 10:43   #3
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ki haal aya overdose!!!

Distortion could be for various reasons.
1. The amp is underpowered for the speakers. Simple rule is, more the powerful amp, more clearner is the sound at high volumes. Dont bother much about the RMS rating of the amp vs sub. The only thing to look is that, the frequency of the two should match.

2. Ofcourse, cables play a very vital role. Its like the back- bone of your ICE. Mods please help him with the link of thread, that explained about the wirings.

3. Battery , caps are optional things that count. Obviously, you would not required to change these unless you have a very high powered system.

4. Problems in woofers may occur if the box built is not according to the specifications (amp/wiring etc. all be perfect with the woofer)

Hor dasso, punjab da ki haal aya???
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Old 25th July 2006, 11:11   #4
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It could also be due to wrong equalizer settings (which isn't very evident at low volume).

I was trying to tune the ICS on our Innova yesterday and realised that while all songs sound good at half volume, it doesn't remain the smae when you pump it up.

Every songs requires a diff setting for it to play perfectly, bcoz it also depends on the way the song was recorded.

Shan2nu

Last edited by Shan2nu : 25th July 2006 at 11:13.
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Old 25th July 2006, 11:18   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan2nu
It could also be due to wrong equalizer settings (which isn't very evident at low volume).

I was trying to tune the ICS on our Innova yesterday and realised that while all songs sound good at half volume, it doesn't remain the smae when you pump it up.

Every songs requires a diff setting for it to play perfectly, bcoz it also depends on the way the song was recorded.

Shan2nu
it could be cause your HU cant feed the speakers efficiently aftr a certain range. ANd hence why people get amps. Most HU are rated at 14V or so and hence they say 50W x4. In real scenario, you get anywher frm 16W to 25W (?) or sort

Last edited by jkdas : 25th July 2006 at 11:20.
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Old 25th July 2006, 12:21   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overdose14
sound started to break away at very high volume( this thing is common to all system i guess).
Not all systems :-)

distortion of the sort you heard can easily be eliminated by choosing the RIGHT components.

You might also have noticed that the distorted sound felt louder than similar SPLs of undistorted sound. The reason being that the brain recognises distortion but since it cant tell why it assumes the sound to louder.

Most common distorions you are hearing at the shop are due to the physical limits of the loudspeaker or a poor install.

Bass reproduction is a significant factor. Bass consumes a lot of energy and one needs to move a lot of air to produce bass. If you want to reproduce music at loud levels without distortion you would need to invest in subwoofers and amplifiers.
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Old 25th July 2006, 12:31   #7
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Instead of getting too much into amperes, volts & the works, the basic thing u have to look out for is whether the speakers in ur car are capable of taking the load from your amp & whether the software in ur cd is recorded at right levels. check these things out with a pre-recorded audio cd not MP3.

cheers
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Old 25th July 2006, 12:31   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkdas
it could be cause your HU cant feed the speakers efficiently aftr a certain range. ANd hence why people get amps. Most HU are rated at 14V or so and hence they say 50W x4. In real scenario, you get anywher frm 16W to 25W (?) or sort
The average HU produces about 8-10W rms, <0.1% distortion, 20-20kHz per channel. The wattage advertised are not incorrect but most probably do not confirm to the conditions mentioned above in bold.
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Old 25th July 2006, 13:20   #9
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Like Navin has already mentioned most reasons for sound to 'break', there are a few points to note.

The primary reason, especially in the case of Sony speakers, for the sound to distort could be the speakers themselves. I find them very incorrect and fatiguing even at low volumes.

Secondly, I consider it a correct approach for car audio systems with a power amplifier to exhibit some amount of distortion when you approach the last 10% of the volume steps. Although this seems absurd, I'll explain why.

By matching the gain at a lower level to an amplifier, it is possible to eliminate clipping distortion totally, and ensure that at even full volume, there is no clipped/ distorted output. Here, of course, we are assuming that the speaker is not creating any nonsense of it's own.

However, I would ideally leave some room at the top to allow low recording level program material to be adequately amplified. So when the input signal for the amplfier is lower than the standard recording level, the slightly higher gain allows for the head unit to be able to supply a larger pre-amp out to the power amp, and achieve desired spl even with a low level recording.
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Old 25th July 2006, 15:33   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_sound
ki haal aya overdose!!!

Distortion could be for various reasons.
1. The amp is underpowered for the speakers. Simple rule is, more the powerful amp, more clearner is the sound at high volumes. Dont bother much about the RMS rating of the amp vs sub. The only thing to look is that, the frequency of the two should match.

2. Ofcourse, cables play a very vital role. Its like the back- bone of your ICE. Mods please help him with the link of thread, that explained about the wirings.

3. Battery , caps are optional things that count. Obviously, you would not required to change these unless you have a very high powered system.

4. Problems in woofers may occur if the box built is not according to the specifications (amp/wiring etc. all be perfect with the woofer)

Hor dasso, punjab da ki haal aya???

vadia bahi

and punjab tarakki te hai

hey i am an electronic engg (though undergraduate) and i am not a "lallu" for god sake please. i know a lot but juruji's and experience matter a lot.
i know the basics all about class a b ab and d amps mosfets why they are now a day more used but i wanted to know that even after getting right components sometimes sound is not good as it should be. i've heard many systems which sound great on one music type but fail to impress on others.
why so much problem and why all identical componets are supposed to be used?????? why.

Last edited by overdose14 : 25th July 2006 at 15:36.
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Old 25th July 2006, 15:38   #11
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B&T most HUs have an nominal ouput exceeding 2V. Most power amps have sensitivity in the order of 100mV-2V (depending on gain levels). I would set my amps to clip at about a 1.2-1.6V signal (70% of the gain).

This allows for maximum control inside the cabin while ensuring that the HU does not have to deliver it's maximum output to clip the power amps. I hope what you said above means the same thing. :-)

BTW my test signal for clipping is not 1kHz but 400hz. It is just hangover from my tape days (where MOL was often tested at 400Hz).
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Old 25th July 2006, 15:45   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overdose14
...i wanted to know that even after getting right components sometimes sound is not good as it should be. i've heard many systems which sound great on one music type but fail to impress on others.
why so much problem and why all identical componets are supposed to be used?????? why.
welcome to the search for the holy grail! :-)

1. identical components do not guarantee distortion free sound
2. Good components set up or installed poorly can also casue distortions
3. Many if not all systems tend to favour one genre of music over another. Some reproduce all music poorly but very very few reproduce all music well.
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Old 25th July 2006, 16:11   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
welcome to the search for the holy grail! :-)

1. identical components do not guarantee distortion free sound
2. Good components set up or installed poorly can also casue distortions
3. Many if not all systems tend to favour one genre of music over another. Some reproduce all music poorly but very very few reproduce all music well.
most systems however will play the boom boom kinda mindless music pretty well, which satisfies the average joe on the car.
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Old 25th July 2006, 18:10   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
B&T most HUs have an nominal ouput exceeding 2V. Most power amps have sensitivity in the order of 100mV-2V (depending on gain levels). I would set my amps to clip at about a 1.2-1.6V signal (70% of the gain).

This allows for maximum control inside the cabin while ensuring that the HU does not have to deliver it's maximum output to clip the power amps. I hope what you said above means the same thing. :-)

BTW my test signal for clipping is not 1kHz but 400hz. It is just hangover from my tape days (where MOL was often tested at 400Hz).
voila

thats what i was looking for.
thanks a lot
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Old 25th July 2006, 18:31   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
B&T most HUs have an nominal ouput exceeding 2V. Most power amps have sensitivity in the order of 100mV-2V (depending on gain levels). I would set my amps to clip at about a 1.2-1.6V signal (70% of the gain).

This allows for maximum control inside the cabin while ensuring that the HU does not have to deliver it's maximum output to clip the power amps. I hope what you said above means the same thing. :-)
Exactly what I meant sir! Sorry if my explanation led you to believe otherwise.
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