Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > In-Car Entertainment


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 1st September 2006, 15:02   #301
Senior - BHPian
 
Bass&Trouble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Bombay
Posts: 2,744
Thanked: 71 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
B&T what say you. you know nore about current drivers than I do. Will 15gms damage the woofer in this case.
Sir, drive-unit technology hasn't come an exceptionally long way since the times you usually refer to you. There have been improvements and adaptations, but none that have changed the face of audio on the planet. I am sure you are as aware of drivers as I am if not more. I read a recent Voice Coil which had like a triple concentric driver, ring-radiator based. Made in China. Very creative I thought. But Vance wasn't in total agreement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by santosh.s
I feel this should be strictly no-no then. Since it will not only spoil sound quality but also the driver itself in long run. In fact that was my 2nd doubt, but to begin with, navin had already mentioned that 15gm for this particular sub shouldn't do any harm... so I didn't ask further.
I did not earlier imply in any way that mass addition is a bad thing. I've just seen people go haywire with it sometimes and that I reckon is bad. In car audio there is an advantage in doing that, and sometimes it gets exploited beyond reason. In regular home hi-fi no one does this. You would rather use a more compliant spider to lower Fs. Sure Vas increases, but no one complains about space there (except the wifeys).

In your case, 100 to 115 grams should be ok since it's for a sub. If a PA woofer (not subwoofer) had a 100 grams cone, adding 15 grams could have disastrous consequences. But the question is, why would anyone want to do that to a PA woofer anyway?

Disadvantages of increase in moving mass can be nullified by making changes to the motor system. This will make the driver more expensive though.

Personally, I prefer subwoofer drivers that have adequate magnet structures and use relatively low moving mass.

Last edited by Bass&Trouble : 1st September 2006 at 15:06.
Bass&Trouble is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2006, 15:44   #302
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 978
Thanked: 5 Times
Default

B&T your posts were informative (as always!)

let me clarify one thing, my "strictly no-no" was strictly meant for exploited cases where the voice coil can potentially rub against other parts. Rest of the statements in that post might have been confusing though!
santosh.s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2006, 16:06   #303
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 389
Thanked: 128 Times
Default

Navin, Santosh and B&T.. thanks for all the inputs, so finally what i think all of you are saying is that to remove the extra boom effect I should apply blue Tack to the dust cover cone of the Sub in increaments of 10 gms and not exceeding a total of 100 gms till I hear the correct sound.. ?? Is my understanding correct.
jinu_joseph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2006, 16:31   #304
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 978
Thanked: 5 Times
Default

jinu, 100gm seems TOO MUCH to me!

It depends on correct interpretation of following sentence (by B&T)


Quote:
In your case, 100 to 115 grams should be ok since it's for a sub
B&T, I thought you meant changing from 100gm original moving mass to 115gm by adding 15gm extra, right? not 100-115gm of additional weight
santosh.s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2006, 16:35   #305
Senior - BHPian
 
Bass&Trouble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Bombay
Posts: 2,744
Thanked: 71 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by santosh.s
B&T your posts were informative (as always!)

let me clarify one thing, my "strictly no-no" was strictly meant for exploited cases where the voice coil can potentially rub against other parts. Rest of the statements in that post might have been confusing though!
Thank you sir. The intentions were noble, not to confuse. Some 'confusing' aspects were meant for Navin, who I think wil readily understand it. Please seek explanations for any part you desire. Glad to help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jinu_joseph
Navin, Santosh and B&T.. thanks for all the inputs, so finally what i think all of you are saying is that to remove the extra boom effect I should apply blue Tack to the dust cover cone of the Sub in increaments of 10 gms and not exceeding a total of 100 gms till I hear the correct sound.. ?? Is my understanding correct.
It is usually not desirable to tamper with productionised drive-units this way. Your warranty could become void, and there's no way to tell whether it will really improve the sound. And if it didn't work out, it isn't reversible either. I wouldn't mind personally checking out the setup for correction possibilities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by santosh.s
B&T, I thought you meant changing from 100gm original moving mass to 115gm by adding 15gm extra, right? not 100-115gm of additional weight
Oh yes! I didn't mean adding another 100grams. Wow, sorry my statement sure was confusing!

Last edited by Bass&Trouble : 1st September 2006 at 16:37.
Bass&Trouble is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2006, 17:33   #306
Team-BHP Support
 
navin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: mumbai
Posts: 22,502
Thanked: 3,880 Times
Default

add a TOTAL of 15gms! 5gms at a time! All I am doing is "tricking" your woofer's tuning. Everything done in moderation (even drinking) is ok. Anything taken in excess (even water) is bad.
navin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd September 2006, 09:09   #307
BHPian
 
Autophile's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 930
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

For good quality fast bass reproduction the moving mass should be less. Increase in moving mass will lead to expensive heavy motors, fat surrounds, kW amplification all this inclines towards SPL.

Last edited by Autophile : 2nd September 2006 at 09:18.
Autophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd September 2006, 11:48   #308
Team-BHP Support
 
navin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: mumbai
Posts: 22,502
Thanked: 3,880 Times
Default

JB, I agree but we are only trying to reduce the resonace. How do you propose to reduce the Mms of the woofer now that it is already built?
navin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th September 2006, 09:32   #309
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 389
Thanked: 128 Times
Default

I finally got rid of the booming effect that i was facing on some sound tracks.. I first tuned the amps based on Kureti's amp tuning post. That when i realised that the gain was set very high.

Then when fiddling with the crossover frequency i realised that by reducing the crossover frequency the boom effect reduced.. so now that crossover freq knob for the rear channels on the amp is kept very low. I did not know how to "tune" the crossover frequency.. so set it to whatever sounds best to my ear.
jinu_joseph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th September 2006, 10:29   #310
Team-BHP Support
 
navin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: mumbai
Posts: 22,502
Thanked: 3,880 Times
Default

Your ear is the best judge. That's how most of us do it.

Sam however does it differently (the method is too graphic for this forum). He and B&T are thinking of starting another forum on how to do it! :-)
navin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th September 2006, 10:30   #311
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Faridabad
Posts: 6,814
Thanked: 294 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jinu_joseph
I did not know how to "tune" the crossover frequency.. so set it to whatever sounds best to my ear.
this is the best way to do it man........

listen to ur ears........
low_bass_makker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th September 2006, 12:38   #312
Team-BHP Support
 
navin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: mumbai
Posts: 22,502
Thanked: 3,880 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
this is the best way to do it man........

listen to ur ears........
See Sam, LBM uses his ears to do "it" no wonder he has trouble. Wonder if you can help? Is your new Froum "up" yet? :-)
navin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th September 2006, 12:59   #313
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Faridabad
Posts: 6,814
Thanked: 294 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
See Sam, LBM uses his ears to do "it" no wonder he has trouble. Wonder if you can help? Is your new Froum "up" yet? :-)
sometimes music can do wonder thats why we need ears to do it.......

also whats up with this new forum other than tbhp?????????
low_bass_makker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th September 2006, 08:37   #314
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 389
Thanked: 128 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
See Sam, LBM uses his ears to do "it" no wonder he has trouble. Wonder if you can help? Is your new Froum "up" yet? :-)
Ahh.. Navin.. you forget .. your ears are very useful when it comes to doing it.. how do you think Op amps with +ve and -ve feedback signals came into exisitance...You keep fine tuning it till your hear the right kind of sound
jinu_joseph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th September 2006, 09:57   #315
Senior - BHPian
 
maxbhp's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: C C K
Posts: 1,372
Thanked: 65 Times
Default

Just a deviation from the main topic ,
  • What do you think of this HU ?
  • Whats the ideal set up , right now I have A pair of Alpine 6 *9 co-axials (50 rms), a pair of Alpine tweeter , and am planning ot buy Sub/amp and budget is a bit constrained . Should I power coaxilas too or is it that powering only sub is recomended ? Or should I go for a powered sub like Soomuku ?
maxbhp is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q! Sam Kapasi In-Car Entertainment 13577 11th December 2017 18:05
Suggestion with my Old Audio System into new car mezereo In-Car Entertainment 4 29th March 2008 01:49
BlueTooth Car Audio System + Security System venky6009 In-Car Entertainment 1 2nd November 2007 04:45
suggestion for octi - car audio ibe In-Car Entertainment 6 18th July 2005 10:22


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 23:09.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks