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Old 22nd May 2007, 14:21   #1
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Default Budget install with a expensive HU

After going through the recommendation threads, the HU in a 25-30K install is usually a 10K unit.
I will be going for a new ICE in a couple of months(Before July).
This is the config I have thought
1. HU for about 15K (If I can get integrated screen one for <20K its okay)
Please suggest a HU which does
  • DIVx
  • Giga mp3
  • USB is a bonus, do not need even disk playing capability if it can read through usb.
  • If I buy 10K HU, how much will a screen cost <4K possible for 7" LCD?
2. 4 speakers in front, 2 in door and 2 in dash = 5K(possible?)
  • JBL CS2165, does it have 4 speakers?
3. 2 channel amp (3K), for subwoofer
  • If I don't listen music loud, I don't need amp for first 4 speakers? HU is good enough, right.
  • JBL CS60.2 okay here? Or is there a pioneer amp available for lower price?
  • Can I get a 4 channel amp for 5-6K? That will be great.
4. 10 inch sub (5K)
  • CS1004T the tube?
  • GT4-10 with box(10")
5. Some kind of HPF so that my front 4 speakers do not get anything lower than 75Hz. How much does this cost. I think its called a Crossover?
Note that
I have left out Coaxials in the rear.
Is it necessary to have coaxials? The Subwoofer will give me bass, and I have read that a rear soundstage does not do much for SQ. If I get Coaxials, then I cannot afford an amp with subwoofer.

The music I listen to is
1. Rock (80s mostly with floyd and some metal thrown in) : guitar should sound clean and crystal clear. There is lot of bass guitar too, with the kind of low repetitive note.
2. Punjabi music, with lots of BASS from the Dhol(drum). This is a kind of rumbling bass, unlike the short note that is there in modern music, this reveberates, and I have seen some supposedly good installs going weird on reveberating bass.

I don't listen to music very loud, sometimes slightly loud, but much below equipment tolerance levels.
So I am willing to compromise "Power" vs "sound quality".

Also I am confused between that kind of bass a tube will give as compared to box. I have never listened to a tube, just sub. And that to atleast 12" sub. But if you are not pumping volume up, will it be necessary to go 12". I also don't want lights to DIM every time there is a BASS note. The car will be unmodded electrically. So no very fancy stuff either.
The car will have a boot. What kind of boot it will have is still not decided, so space is not really an issue.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 14:59   #2
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1. From your reqs, I think a JVC HU would fit your bill. At about 12K you get a JVC HU with all these, except USB. I think you get a USB enabled HU for about 16K from JVC with all the rest. Better go for a separate screen (Necvox) for about 6-7K.

I think a Sony MEX1-GP also has all these facilities at about 13K? esteem_lover, you have one in your car, right?

If you don't plan for the more expensive speakers, better not spend too much on a HU. Get one that satisfies your requirements under 15K or so (USB & MP3-DVD makes for a 12-15K budget).

2. The CS2165C is a component system (midbass + tweeters) and is a pretty good set of comps for the price (5K). They play classic rock and rock very well.

3. You can get a good 4-ch amp for about 7K (Pio 6200), so don't settle for a 2-ch amp for 5-6K. A JBL CS60.4 (4-ch amp) will be about 8K. The 60.2 is about 6K.

4. I'd vote for a GT4-10 in a ported box. 4K + 1.5K max. The 10" tube (CS1204T) is also 5K. But again, I'd root for the sub over the tube for better SQ. The Pio6200 and the 60.4 will not drive a sub in a sealed box as well as it should be driven, so you'll need to go for a ported box.

5. For HPF/LPF, your amp will have these filters. No need for an extra crossover or anything.

Don't worry about the lights dimming here. Get good power wiring (8AWG will do here) and you'll be safe.

Baaki Tube vs. Box. Very personal preference. You'll start a fight here soon with that

Booted car? Then a 12" sub will be better than a 10". a 10" will do reasonable duty in a hatch, but in a booted car, it may not be enough.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:14   #3
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Oh my god! What is TSK sir upto? LBM effect?

On a serious note, I think you should get in touch with Sam, Gunman, JB, B&T or Navin and discuss this in detail for the best.

Regarding the HU, do you require one with B&W? Or grey is fine?

By 4 speakers, I think you mean a component kit. Right? Yes, the one which comes with 2 uffers and 2 tutors.

You can power your sub using a 2channel amp. Yes, a 60.2 will do the job. But if You're getting a powerful sub later, then this won't suffice.
And if You're getting a component kit which comes with seperate crossovers (every component kit comes with some kind of these, so you don't have to buy another one of these for now), then it is possible to power the tweeters from the front channel of the HU and woofers from the rear channels. This will make them play good. If they don't have seperate crossovers for tweeters and woofers, then you will have to either play from just the rear or front channels of the HU.
Best bet is to get a 4 channel amp like the 60.4 or so and Power the fronts and sub from it.
There are some nice deals in the market area. Keep an eye on those.

You don't need to buy HPF. It comes in the HU and Amp.

You can avoid the rear speakers if You're not very keen on it.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:16   #4
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btw, these requirements which hydra mentions may need to be changed depending on car, for e.g. if the booted variety is something you want to reclaim with.

As per point number 3 it's not necessary that the amp is required only for high volumes. Even at low volumes it will sound much better as the amp will be able to provide more current to properly drive the speakers. The volume can be low but the clarity across all the frequencies will be better. Especially since in your case you dont plan for a rear fill. The small price difference of a 4channel amp over 2 channel is worth it. I'm repenting with a 2 channel one now. Also components like the CS2165C are 4 speakers 2 woofs and 2 tweets with a cossover.

I kind of like the bass tube when there's fast bass like what you mention i.e. reverberating. like in trance/techno.

A ported box spreads the bass out i feel in my opinion.

Sealed is the best but then you will need more power like from a separate monoblock amp to drive that.

Do give both these setups tube/ported box a good listen with the type of music you listen to.

You can setup the filters in the amp to get low sub freq to the sub and the higher frequencies to the components. The crossover will then split up the frequencies further to the components.

Last edited by Vid6639 : 22nd May 2007 at 15:21.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:25   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedzak View Post
By 4 speakers, I think you mean a component kit. Right? Yes, the one which comes with 2 uffers and 2 tutors.
No baba, he is not uffer tutor kind. God (or rather, Tata) has bestowed two pairs of front speakers locations upon him in the Indica/ Indigo he drives and trust me, he totally enjoys the big bang he can get in the front from this endowment.

tsk: I think the JVC GIGA MP3 cum DVD cum USB head unit fits your profile perfectly. I think you could get one for as low as 8-9k since pre-outs etc dont mean much to you.

You can get a chaalu 7" roof mount screen for about 4.5k - better than the 2.5" LCD crap in the head unit unless you feel very generous towards your opthalmist or whatever.

You need 5.25" speakers for the doors, and 4" speakers for the dash. You'll easily get good coaxials at that price. Or do you want to get comps for both locations, that way you can position the tweeters seperately and all in all have 4 sources of sound per side in the front of your car.

You can get a Blau GT4 special for about 6k. Its a 4-ch amp. You can use that in stereo mode to drive all 4 speakers in 2 ohms on two channels and the other two in bridged mode to drive a SVC 4 ohm sub.

HPF should ideally be a part of the HU. If not, you could set it on the amp if you use the Blau as per my suggestion.

Dont buy any tube etc, just get a good sub and put it in a box. Cheaper than the prefab solutions.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:30   #6
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B&T, the car is not his indica but indigo maybe. I'm thinking he may go for reclaiming so no 4 locations in the front.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:43   #7
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is there any IN-dash DVD Available in India
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:43   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post

I kind of like the bass tube when there's fast bass like what you mention i.e. reverberating. like in trance/techno.

A ported box spreads the bass out i feel in my opinion.

Sealed is the best but then you will need more power like from a separate monoblock amp to drive that.

Do give both these setups tube/ported box a good listen with the type of music you listen to.

You can setup the filters in the amp to get low sub freq to the sub and the higher frequencies to the components. The crossover will then split up the frequencies further to the components.
Hmmm, I will listen to some installs. But all I see is box(sealed unsealed ported whatever). Very few people have tubes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble View Post
No baba, he is not uffer tutor kind. God (or rather, Tata) has bestowed two pairs of front speakers locations upon him in the Indica/ Indigo he drives and trust me, he totally enjoys the big bang he can get in the front from this endowment.

tsk: I think the JVC GIGA MP3 cum DVD cum USB head unit fits your profile perfectly. I think you could get one for as low as 8-9k since pre-outs etc dont mean much to you.

You can get a chaalu 7" roof mount screen for about 4.5k - better than the 2.5" LCD crap in the head unit unless you feel very generous towards your opthalmist or whatever.

You need 5.25" speakers for the doors, and 4" speakers for the dash. You'll easily get good coaxials at that price. Or do you want to get comps for both locations, that way you can position the tweeters seperately and all in all have 4 sources of sound per side in the front of your car.

You can get a Blau GT4 special for about 6k. Its a 4-ch amp. You can use that in stereo mode to drive all 4 speakers in 2 ohms on two channels and the other two in bridged mode to drive a SVC 4 ohm sub.

HPF should ideally be a part of the HU. If not, you could set it on the amp if you use the Blau as per my suggestion.

Dont buy any tube etc, just get a good sub and put it in a box. Cheaper than the prefab solutions.
Ahh thats great. you have listened to my install, so you know . I want 4 speakers up front. No tweeter shweeter nonsense for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
B&T, the car is not his indica but indigo maybe. I'm thinking he may go for reclaiming so no 4 locations in the front.
If I don't get 4 speaker locations, I will make them. 4 speakers in front, thats absolutely necessary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hydrashok View Post
1. From your reqs, I think a JVC HU would fit your bill. At about 12K you get a JVC HU with all these, except USB. I think you get a USB enabled HU for about 16K from JVC with all the rest. Better go for a separate screen (Necvox) for about 6-7K..
I don't mind jugaad screens and such. Will try to save money there and get a Blau 4ch amp for 6K. That should be nice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedzak View Post

Regarding the HU, do you require one with B&W? Or grey is fine?

By 4 speakers, I think you mean a component kit. Right? Yes, the one which comes with 2 uffers and 2 tutors.

You can avoid the rear speakers if You're not very keen on it.
Grey is fine by me. I have seen that HUs seldom fail within warranty period. They fail 1 day after the warranty expires. If you go to service center they start working fine, and then when you come home they fail again.

So I guess this is what I do.
1. Get the HU for 9K and fix a 4K Jugaad screen: 13K
2. Get a 4ch Blau amp for 6K = 19K
3. Get the component set for around 6K (Does it have 4 speakers?) = 25K
4. Get a sub for around 5K(including box) = 30K
5. Threaten the dealer for a discount = -5K = 25K, maybe kidnap his family
6. Wiring shiring and stuff = 5K = 30K

So my budget of 30K stays.

Actually a lot depends on what is bought. If I reclaim then I may be so poor that I buy a 9K JVC without screen + 4 speakers and total cost is 15K. Then save up and spend 15K later.
But whatever I buy 30K will be the max budget, and I want to to have 4GB music on one disc. DivX is good, because I can encode 4 ch sound into DIVx besides one disc can have 10 movies. If I get bored while driving I can watch movies too.
Can I mount screen on steering wheel? Just kidding

Last edited by tsk1979 : 22nd May 2007 at 15:50.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 15:57   #9
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One confusion about B&T advice.
My HU will give me 4 channels + 1 sub out.
The Amp will lave 2 channels for the sub, and 2 channels to drive 4 speakers.
Now what will happen to the other two channels on the HU. Will they drive just the tweeters? Or will 2 speakers(5.25inch) will go by the amp and the smaller two speakers will be driven by the HU itself, since 4 inch speakers don't need much power, right?
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Old 22nd May 2007, 16:10   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
One confusion about B&T advice.
My HU will give me 4 channels + 1 sub out.
The Amp will lave 2 channels for the sub, and 2 channels to drive 4 speakers.
Now what will happen to the other two channels on the HU. Will they drive just the tweeters? Or will 2 speakers(5.25inch) will go by the amp and the smaller two speakers will be driven by the HU itself, since 4 inch speakers don't need much power, right?
Ideally, you should run the fronts [the components (midbass & tweeter) in your case, since all are fronts ] and the sub from the 4-ch amp. That will leave 2+2 channels free in your HU. You can use the 2 front channels to drive the unamplified front speakers (the 4"ers).

You will still have 2 channels free in the HU. Leave them be

EDIT: Why don't you stick to 2 speakers in front and 2 speakers + a sub in the back? Or skip the rear speakers and have just the sub in the back? You don't need components (midbass & tweeter) and another set of speakers in front.

Last edited by hydrashok : 22nd May 2007 at 16:14.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 16:18   #11
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2 Speakers in the rear what for. I don't sit in rear. I am always in front. So no worry if the rear passengers(if there are any) cannot enjoy music.
I thought 4 speakers in front because then I have surround sound in front. Its really nice to listen to music from 4 speakers(4 proper speakers) Ask B&T he has done so in a 8K install

Ideally I think the sub should be in front. I guess lack of space is the problem. That way I can enjoy music in front.

EDIT: How about a JBL 4 inch 2 way thingy for Dash(2500 approx) and JBL 6 inch loudspeaker for around 2700 in the doors. Or 5inch 2 way for the doors.
I can also go for 6 inch 3-way or 4 way speaker instead of 4 speakers in front.

The criteria is front soundstage.

Last edited by tsk1979 : 22nd May 2007 at 16:21.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 16:37   #12
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Well between all these, I'd prefer the 6.5" coaxials [JBL CS2165 (2-way coaxials) or GTO637s (3-way coaxials) in front. Save on 4 speakers in front and get the GTO637s. They sound better than the CS2165s.

If you use JBL 4" coaxials in the dash and 6.5" coaxials in the doors. You'll find the setup pretty bright with 4 tweeters in front (tweeters of the 4 coaxials) -- can be fixed a bit by cutting down treble in the HU.

If front soundstage is the criteria I really think you should get 2-way components (CS2165c or GTO607c) in front and nothing else for the front = 6.5" midbasses in the doors and tweeters in the dash.

Good that you can skip the rear speakers Apply the budget to a 4-ch amp for the fronts and the sub.
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Old 22nd May 2007, 16:44   #13
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OK, so instead of 2 6" and 2 4" speakers up front you suggest I go for a component set. How much is the approx price of the GTO607C? I think the CS2165c is around 4K?
There is a 507C but I guess it will be 5 inch.

So budget is no 13K(HU), 5K(Front), 6K(Amp), (5K) sub + wiring - discount and cheapness = 30K
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Old 22nd May 2007, 17:28   #14
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The GTO 607c is 6500/- (MRP) with B&W. The CS2165c is 5K (with B&W). Better get the 6.5" (607c/CS2165c) and not the 507c (5.25"). The 607c gives much better bass response (more cone area).
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Old 22nd May 2007, 17:30   #15
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[quote=tsk1979;
There is a 507C but I guess it will be 5 inch.

Yes it is 5"ers and costs Rs.6000/-.
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