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Old 24th May 2007, 15:28   #46
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Originally Posted by navin View Post
The 444 will do for now. You can always upgrade that later if you feel. The monoblock will go your sub a world of good. if you get the 75.4 you might have more power than you need going to your front components (not a bad thing but considering your budget...) and your sub would be bit underpowered. the 300.1 will go a better job with the sub but your components will get less power. So unless you feel your components need more power why get the 75.4?
Thanks. I appreciate - it's good and practical advice.

Could you please provide more Info on the 300.1? What Brand is it and at what price-point is it available? Any alternatives to it?

Also, logically it doesn't seem possible, but since the above mentioned question of mine has already established that i'm duh wrt ICE .. so no harm asking .. is it possible to send 3/4th of the 444's power to the Components and 1/4 to the Rear? I mean does the Gain knob help in this regards?
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Old 24th May 2007, 15:40   #47
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Originally Posted by manveet View Post
Thanks. I appreciate - it's good and practical advice.

Could you please provide more Info on the 300.1? What Brand is it and at what price-point is it available? Any alternatives to it?

Also, logically it doesn't seem possible, but since the above mentioned question of mine has already established that i'm duh wrt ICE .. so no harm asking .. is it possible to send 3/4th of the 444's power to the Components and 1/4 to the Rear? I mean does the Gain knob help in this regards?
I am sorry but I have to disagree with Navin a little bit here.

The monoblock is good if you are posing a 2 ohm load to it. Otherwise it wont put out as much power as the 75.4 in bridged mode. Since you have the 304, one of it, you cant hook up a 2 ohm subwoofer load to the 301. Whereas the 75.4 is some 250-275 watts at 4 ohms bridged. Plus in stereo, the nearly 100 watts output will do the front comps a lot of good. Dont worry about the rear speakers and amping them (for more on this topic, please contact Tanveer ). If anything I said didnt make sense, dont worry, thats perfectly normal.

Plus, all said and done, a 4 channel amplifier is far more versatile than a monoblock, and can be used for different roles as and when your system faces the next upgrade.
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Old 24th May 2007, 17:45   #48
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The monoblock is good if you are posing a 2 ohm load to it. Otherwise it wont put out as much power as the 75.4 in bridged mode. Since you have the 304, one of it, you cant hook up a 2 ohm subwoofer load to the 301. Whereas the 75.4 is some 250-275 watts at 4 ohms bridged. Plus in stereo, the nearly 100 watts output will do the front comps a lot of good ... If anything I said didnt make sense, dont worry, thats perfectly normal.
Last time we met, you spoke to me in English regarding my ICE. Please be nice to me and translate the above.

Logically speaking, shouldn't Mono-blocks be better for Woofers since they are dedicated?

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Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble
Plus, all said and done, a 4 channel amplifier is far more versatile than a monoblock, and can be used for different roles as and when your system faces the next upgrade.
So should i get rid of the 444 or is there any other permutation combination possible?

For e.g., how about sending all 4 channels of the 444 to the Sub and buying a good 2 channel for the Components? I mean I am just coming up with these ideas arbitrarily - I want to make a choice with is technically correct - at the same time being good VFM - which is where I need advice from aap-log.

If you had a Budget of 10k, what would you do?

FYI, I listen to Dire Straits, Aerosmith, Bruce Springsteen, Journey, Eagles etc. Maybe sometimes a song by Akon or stuff like that. So just a good tight punch is what I'm looking at. And SQ. And what's with the hiss I get even on new Audio CD's when no track is playing?

Last edited by manveet : 24th May 2007 at 17:49.
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:06   #49
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Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble View Post
If anything I said didnt make sense, dont worry, thats perfectly normal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet View Post
Last time we met, you spoke to me in English regarding my ICE. Please be nice to me and translate the above.

Logically speaking, shouldn't Mono-blocks be better for Woofers since they are dedicated?

So should i get rid of the 444 or is there any other permutation combination possible?

For e.g., how about sending all 4 channels of the 444 to the Sub and buying a good 2 channel for the Components? I mean I am just coming up with these ideas arbitrarily - I want to make a choice with is technically correct - at the same time being good VFM - which is where I need advice from aap-log.

If you had a Budget of 10k, what would you do?

FYI, I listen to Dire Straits, Aerosmith, Bruce Springsteen, Journey, Eagles etc. Maybe sometimes a song by Akon or stuff like that. So just a good tight punch is what I'm looking at. And SQ. And what's with the hiss I get even on new Audio CD's when no track is playing?

Firstly Ajay Bhai has clearly mentioned that if you did not understand it ....then it is a normal thing...also he only wrote it in English....how can he speak on the forum...he can only write here.....

when you are comparing mono block with a good 4-ch there are certain conditions on which one would compare the both....

I agree that monoblock is good for sub...and will take less power when compared to the 4ch ....but in your case the budget will increase and the power gain will not much....

like the 301.1 is a JBL mono and will cost you approx 9k....and a JBL 75.4 which is a 4 ch amp will cost you 12-13k.....here you can run one sub and a component with a single amp would you buy a mono here.....

there is no way to send all the 4 ch to the a single sub....but you can bridge the 4 ch to make it a 2 ch and then power the sub....but since yours is a SVC then it is all most impossible to wire a 4 ch amp to a svc sub and use the whole amp output.....

Now listen to what I said on the phone to you on the Sunday morning....Get a 75.4 and wire the front components and the sub to it...the rear speakers through the HU and Like Sam Bhai saya.....bolo tarararara......hope you get it right this time....

Last edited by low_bass_makker : 24th May 2007 at 18:09.
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:09   #50
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Originally Posted by manveet View Post
Could you please provide more Info on the 300.1? What Brand is it and at what price-point is it available? Any alternatives to it?
You'll find world of difference if you discard your 444 and upgrade.

301.1 is a JBL monobloc amp available around 10K with B&W (I'm not sure though!) I use a JBL 301.1 II (US version of 301.1).

As regards your listening preferences, all what you listen is greek and latin to me....cauz I listen to Chamkila;Arshi;Bindarakhia;Dhillon etc.
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:12   #51
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Chamkila;Arshi;Bindarakhia;Dhillon etc
I would really love some music like this. Some new bhangra, cool happy funky bhangra. Not traditional. Somebody please help. LBM??
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:17   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet View Post
Logically speaking, shouldn't Mono-blocks be better for Woofers since they are dedicated?

...

So should i get rid of the 444 or is there any other permutation combination possible?

For e.g., how about sending all 4 channels of the 444 to the Sub and buying a good 2 channel for the Components? I mean I am just coming up with these ideas arbitrarily - I want to make a choice with is technically correct - at the same time being good VFM - which is where I need advice from aap-log.

If you had a Budget of 10k, what would you do?

FYI, I listen to Dire Straits, Aerosmith, Bruce Springsteen, Journey, Eagles etc. Maybe sometimes a song by Akon or stuff like that. So just a good tight punch is what I'm looking at. And SQ. And what's with the hiss I get even on new Audio CD's when no track is playing?
@manveet Monos are better for subs, but they tend to be more expensive. You can get a good mono for 10K. Like the 300.1 and the Pioneer D510.

If you want to keep your 444, you can use it the way you described -- use all of it on a sub. Not a totally optimum solution, but you can use the 4-ch amp to drive a DVC (Dual Voice Coil) Sub. BUT your sub is and SVC one, so that won't be possible in your case, unless you change the sub, which you don't need to do.

Like B&T said, getting a 75.4 will be the best solution for your Comps and your sub. Both will get good power. And you pay just 3K more than the 10K budget

EDIT: Whoa! So many replies as I was typing!!!

Last edited by hydrashok : 24th May 2007 at 18:20.
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:17   #53
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Originally Posted by manveet
Last time we met, you spoke to me in English regarding my ICE. Please be nice to me and translate the above.
You have one sub. It is a single voice coil sub. The impedance of the voice coil is 4 ohms. With one coil of a fixed impedance, there is no question of permutations/ combinations coming into the picture. So 4 ohms is the load you can connect to any amplifier, whether mono, 4-channel whatever.

So you have to buy an amp which is optimized for maximum output at 4 ohms. The 300.1 is 300 watts at 2 ohms. At 4 ohms, it must be 200 or something. The 75.4 on the other hand is about 275 watts at 4 ohms. What makes more sense?

Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet
Logically speaking, shouldn't Mono-blocks be better for Woofers since they are dedicated?
Logically speaking, when a channel or channels of an amplifier are driving one subwoofer only, it is still dedication. For peace of mind, maybe you could inscribe on the 4-ch amp : "This channel is dedicated to my loving subwoofer, 304", so that way they probably wont stray and remain dedicated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet
So should i get rid of the 444 or is there any other permutation combination possible?
You can use two channels to power the rear speakers. And maybe the other two, since they will be idling, to power an array of bulbs that will glow and dim with the music.

Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet
For e.g., how about sending all 4 channels of the 444 to the Sub and buying a good 2 channel for the Components? I mean I am just coming up with these ideas arbitrarily.
Its clear that these are arbitrary ideas since they cannot be implemented in any case. You cant send all 4 channels of an amp to all 1 coils of a sub.

Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet
If you had a Budget of 10k, what would you do?
I'd start off by feeling very ashamed of myself for the pittance I set aside for my ICE. Then, I would probably follow the same advice I just gave you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by manveet
FYI, I listen to Dire Straits, Aerosmith, Bruce Springsteen, Journey, Eagles etc. Maybe sometimes a song by Akon or stuff like that. So just a good tight punch is what I'm looking at. And SQ. And what's with the hiss I get even on new Audio CD's when no track is playing?
Nice music. I like.

But we are not discussing the tonality or sound quality of gear in concern here. I am suggesting purely from a power point of view. Also, in the future, if you get a serious sub or two, you could buy a monoblock to drive the newly acquired 2 ohm load and use the 75.4 to 'dedicatedly' drive all 4 speakers.

Hiss could be due to a lot of reasons, not easy to diagnose like this. Most likely, your signal is picking noise along the way.

Last edited by Bass&Trouble : 24th May 2007 at 18:19.
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:31   #54
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Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble View Post
Logically speaking, when a channel or channels of an amplifier are driving one subwoofer only, it is still dedication. For peace of mind, maybe you could inscribe on the 4-ch amp : "This channel is dedicated to my loving subwoofer, 304", so that way they probably wont stray and remain dedicated.


Dam the two smile rule........
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:33   #55
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I would really love some music like this. Some new bhangra, cool happy funky bhangra. Not traditional. Somebody please help. LBM??
We catch hold of the CD ASAP......but Sam Bhai what panky mentioned is all Daru related music......loved my truck drivers when they are full tun.........and this stuff is typical thete punjabi.....You would never understand a word.....it will be like Russian rap music....

Last edited by low_bass_makker : 24th May 2007 at 18:37.
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Old 24th May 2007, 18:56   #56
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We catch hold of the CD ASAP......but Sam Bhai what panky mentioned is all Daru related music......loved my truck drivers when they are full tun.........and this stuff is typical thete punjabi.....You would never understand a word.....it will be like Russian rap music....
Hang on LBM!! The music is NOT daru related, though a very few # are.... true these are all thet punjabi.... sometimes while listening even i refer to a punjabi to english dictionary!

bhai apni apni pasand, kisi to cheels (eagles) pasand hain aur kisi to chamkila.... am glad SAM would love to hear this music.

I can forsee a thread soon: NCR Meet....STRICTLY FOR NON ALCOHOLICS (SAM being cheap guest)

and on the D-day SAM sitting in a truck (read desi TATA wala) listening to chamkila without alcohol!!

.... and Still enjoying it!
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Old 24th May 2007, 19:28   #57
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Russian rap music??? lol

Please panky, LBM, I want thait punjabi chamkila music.

It should be funky and dance-able. And good recordings. Thank you. Sorry for the OT:. Bolo tarararara
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Old 24th May 2007, 19:31   #58
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
Russian rap music??? lol

Please panky, LBM, I want thait punjabi chamkila music.

It should be funky and dance-able. And good recordings. Thank you. Sorry for the OT:. Bolo tarararara
I'll trust you to make copies of the cds and keep for my person to collect from your office. And good recordings. Thank you. Sorry for the OT: Tararara!
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Old 24th May 2007, 19:38   #59
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
Russian rap music??? lol

Please panky, LBM, I want thait punjabi chamkila music.

It should be funky and dance-able. And good recordings. Thank you. Sorry for the OT:. Bolo tarararara
SAM, it would be a pleasure to send you one! PM me your postal address and I'll send one in! BESTEST quality Audio CD.

BTW, I forsee JBL venturing into Tier-2 & Tier-3 cities.

Edit: HAHA Good one B&T, u want one? I can send one to you as well, in exchange of a STEG mono and GZero sub.

Last edited by panky12345 : 24th May 2007 at 19:42.
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Old 24th May 2007, 19:45   #60
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I am sorry but I have to disagree with Navin a little bit here..
Thank god!

Ok B&T this is my logic.

1. the 300.1 is a sub amp. It was built to drive subs and has a higher damping factor and should do a better job of controlling a sub. The CS 300.1 is a good value as it is last years GTO model. So it was built to GTO standards.

The 75.4 bridged will put out more power say 3db more at best. How much of a difference will that make? The 75.4 puised into 4 ohms will be pushed into high current mode and which like to pushed there all the time. In a pinch it will do but continously?

2. Now assume he has a 75.4 and no 444. his next amp upgrade would have to be a mono and what would not 100W driving the rears be a sheer waste? If he has the 300.1 and the 444 his next upgrade could be either a good powerful 2 ch. amp or 4ch. amp. He could then use the 444 bridged for the rears.


Now Manveet, you must be one confused bloke. We are ICE are Sorry for this predicament.

Sam AND B&T both are Gurus and I respect their opinion as much as I do my own (I march to the beat of my own drummer). They have offered you advice that is correct but I think my advise is NOT wrong either. Which is more correct would be best only decided if you hear both options? Does your dealer have a 300.1 and 75.4? Remember there is a 3K difference between the 300.1 and 75.4.
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