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Old 13th August 2012, 10:40   #211
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Default Re: Santro ICE - Installation & Tuning Queries

6.3ohms? That is strange - it should be 3.x ohms or so.

The JBL pre-finished box is good, but won't compare with a sub in a sealed box. A better bet would a good sub - Infinity Kappa 120.9 or such - in a sealed box. Since everything else is already wired, perhaps the dealer can give you a demo in the car of the pre-finished box as well as the Infinity sub. I am sure you will figure out the difference in bass signature.
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Old 13th August 2012, 11:24   #212
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Default Re: Santro ICE - Installation & Tuning Queries

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Originally Posted by nura View Post
Stuffed about half of it into the sub box but it's sounding the same.

An audio dealer showed me a brochure for the JBL GTO 14001 amp. 1 x 1200W @ 4 Ohms. List price 35K. Asked him if he could arrange a demo. He called up someone & then started talking about a Cadence Dakota.
Stuff would not increase the speaker's sensitivity so it will not get louder but the stuffing should damp midbass (damping low bass requires different technique) resonances.

The 14001 must be available. i have seen a few in Mumabi too.

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Originally Posted by nura View Post
Checked the resistance of the sub with a DIMM across the binding posts & it showed 6.3 Ohms. Shouldn't it have been 4 Ohms?
Are you refering to the IDQ12D2V2 sub? That sub has 2 2ohm voice coils so at best your DC resistance (as measured by a DMM should be 3.1-3.3 ohms) if both voice coils are in series. 6.3 ohms is usually the DC resistnace of a nominal 8 ohm subwoofer.
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Old 13th August 2012, 16:05   #213
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Thanks for your replies. I will certainly check out both subs before buying.
Would you recommend some more tests on the IDQ12D2V2? How can we explain this 3 Ohm increase in resistance?
TIA.
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Old 13th August 2012, 18:57   #214
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Default Re: Santro ICE - Installation & Tuning Queries

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... How can we explain this 3 Ohm increase in resistance? ...
The only other possibility is that you got a wrongly labelled piece! If the sub is *actually* a dual VC 4+4ohm, wired in series you will get 8 ohms - ergo 6.3ohms resistance. Disconnect everything, and check the resistance of each voice coil - you should get 3.1-3.3ohms.

If so, now wire them in parallel (2ohms nominal load, DC resistance 1.6-1.7ohms) and connect them to your mono. Even at low volumes you should see an improvement in bass output. Before playing, do check if the mono supports 2 ohms loads.
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Old 14th August 2012, 15:50   #215
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Thank you, Sirs, for your continuous help.
Pulled the wires out of the connectors on the sub box & measured the resistance again. This time it read 7.9 Ohm. Took the sub out of its box, removed the wires & measured across each voice coil. 2.9 Ohm across one, 3 Ohm across the other. Connected in series, this should give 5.9 Ohm (2.9 + 3), not 7.9! Are the wires adding to the resistance?
Connected the voice coils in parallel, forgot to take reading across voice coils & fixed sub back in its box. Resistance across terminals outside the box 3.1 Ohm (not 1.5 as one would have expected).
Wired sub back to amp & it's playing a lot louder than it ever played before. Sounding a bit boomy though (one is never satisfied). Should I take out the polyfill?
The amp is capable of accepting upto 1 Ohm loads.
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Old 15th August 2012, 18:11   #216
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Default Re: Santro ICE - Installation & Tuning Queries

The wires will add to the resistance - about 0.2ohms at most, not the 2 ohms you are getting. Do you have anything soldered at the connector (sub or box)? Sounds like a bad solder joint.

For reducing the boominess, try reducing the internal volume of the box by adding some bricks. At one point boominess vanishes and then volume of really low bass will start decreasing. That is approximately the ideal volume of box (current volume - volume of bricks). Leave the Dacron in.
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Old 19th August 2012, 13:13   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nura
This time it read 7.9 Ohm.
Resistance across terminals outside the box 3.1 Ohm (not 1.5 as one would have expected)..
I assume you have wired as shown in the link below.
http://a248.e.akamai.net/pix.crutchf...4-ohm_mono.jpg

If I understand correctly you have a dual 4 ohm woofer that is showing 8 ohms in series and 3 ohms DC in parallel.

Is there some large inductor in series with the woofer coils?
Is the battery of your multimeter ok?
Try again using a different multimeter and multimeter leads.

Last edited by navin : 19th August 2012 at 13:14.
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Old 21st October 2012, 19:49   #218
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Default Sony Xplod system upgrade for Santro Xing

Hi Gurus,

I am a newbie as far as ICE is concerned. I am looking for an upgrade to the ICE in my Santro Xing for better bass and if possible better sound quality within a budget of 10k.


My current setup is as follows:

HU: Sony XplodCDX-GT292 52Wx4

Front: Sony Xplod XS-GTF10252 30W 10cm 2-way coaxials

Rear: Sony Xplod XS-GTF13262 35W 13cm 2-way coaxials

Both front and rear speakers are in the standard locations.


The car is self driven and most of the time there are no passengers in the rear. I usually listen to rock music, along with some Bollywood (both old and new) and occasionally ghazals.

I have ruled out a sub woofer because I don't want to lose too much boot space.

I visited an ICE dealer who suggested removing the rear speakers and installing 6X9 oval speakers on an MDF parcel tray. His recommendation was Sony Xplod XS-GTF69372 60W 6x9 3-way coaxials. Cost 3,000 for speakers and 600 for MDF parcel tray. He also said that JBL would be another good option at the same price.


I have the following questions:

1. Since the music system will primarily be used for the driver (me) and front passenger, is the suggested upgrade for the rear speakers a good idea?

2. If the above is OK, which speakers are recommended?

3. Is there anything else I can do within my budget of 10k?


I am not an audiophile. Just looking for a basic upgrade which will give me a noticeable improvement in quality.

Thanks
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Old 21st October 2012, 20:42   #219
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Default Re: Sony Xplod system upgrade for Santro Xing

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Originally Posted by highway_star View Post
...I have the following questions:

1. Since the music system will primarily be used for the driver (me) and front passenger, is the suggested upgrade for the rear speakers a good idea?

2. If the above is OK, which speakers are recommended?

3. Is there anything else I can do within my budget of 10k?


I am not an audiophile. Just looking for a basic upgrade which will give me a noticeable improvement in quality.

Thanks
Before anything else, I will put my honest opinion forward. In car audio, Sony is not recommended. Yes, if you have a very small budget, you can go for it, but outside that, it is just not upto any sort of decent quality. In video equipment, yes, but in audio, you are better off looking elsewhere.

Now, coming to your questions.

Since it is only for the front passengers, an upgrade for the front speakers might be a better idea than upgrading rears. I don't exactly know how the speaker orientation in a Xing is, but sitting in front, you are going to be hearing more of the front speakers than the rear. If you upgrade the rear speakers, you are still going to hear the crap quality of the sony in front (sorry, but thats truly my honest opinion. I drove with sony 4" in front for years, and when I upgraded, I realised exactly how crap they were), so overall SQ for front passengers will not really improve that much.

What I would definitely suggest is a set of components in front. You can find quite a few entry level ones, with pretty good SQ. Trust me, they will make a world of differences to your hearing experience. For a lower budget, a good set of coaxials in front, maybe JBL, would be good too, but nowhere close to components. For your budget of 10k, you should have some good choices.

I could have also told you to get a 2 channel amp to power the components (they sound better that way), but with the wiring and everything else, it is probably going to go over the budget. Therefore, you can upgrade the rear ones to a set of better coaxials, maybe JBL or Pioneer. It will make a lot of difference too. Only thing, it might sound a little rear heavy, but you can adjust the fader in your HU and take care of that.

Hope this is of some help to you. Visit your installer, see what he can do.

Do update here with what you get done finally. Cheers.
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Old 22nd October 2012, 08:54   #220
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Default Re: Sony Xplod system upgrade for Santro Xing

highway_star,
There will be a big positive difference in audio quality if you install the speakers on an MDF rear parcel tray. I am speaking from experience as I got the same thing done for my previous Xing. It was done by a team-bhpian Satya. In my opinion, JBL is a very good choice in your budget. Fully agree with swarnava.m's suggestion to consider changing the front speakers as well. I think that will also fit in the budget that you have given.
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Old 22nd October 2012, 22:21   #221
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Default Re: Sony Xplod system upgrade for Santro Xing

Quote:
Originally Posted by swarnava.m View Post

What I would definitely suggest is a set of components in front. You can find quite a few entry level ones, with pretty good SQ. Trust me, they will make a world of differences to your hearing experience. For a lower budget, a good set of coaxials in front, maybe JBL, would be good too, but nowhere close to components. For your budget of 10k, you should have some good choices.

I could have also told you to get a 2 channel amp to power the components (they sound better that way), but with the wiring and everything else, it is probably going to go over the budget. Therefore, you can upgrade the rear ones to a set of better coaxials, maybe JBL or Pioneer. It will make a lot of difference too. Only thing, it might sound a little rear heavy, but you can adjust the fader in your HU and take care of that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by pradyblr View Post
highway_star,
There will be a big positive difference in audio quality if you install the speakers on an MDF rear parcel tray. I am speaking from experience as I got the same thing done for my previous Xing. It was done by a team-bhpian Satya. In my opinion, JBL is a very good choice in your budget. Fully agree with swarnava.m's suggestion to consider changing the front speakers as well. I think that will also fit in the budget that you have given.

Thanks.

Santro only has provision for 4" speakers at the front. So does that mean I will have to get the doors cut to install components or better coaxials? This is not something that I am looking forward to. Are there any options which do not involve major work which may cause damage?

I am thinking of going for the rear speaker replacement first since it is easier, and then exploring options for the front.
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Old 22nd October 2012, 22:27   #222
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Default Re: Sony Xplod system upgrade for Santro Xing

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Originally Posted by highway_star View Post
Thanks.

Santro only has provision for 4" speakers at the front. So does that mean I will have to get the doors cut to install components or better coaxials? This is not something that I am looking forward to. Are there any options which do not involve major work which may cause damage?

I am thinking of going for the rear speaker replacement first since it is easier, and then exploring options for the front.
It is definitely possible. My Alto also has only 4" stock slots in the front, and similar to you, I ain't keen on getting any door cutting done. For this reason, I have always stuck to 4" inch speakers and I am not disappointed.

For last 4 months, I was running JBL CS4 4" coax speakers in the front. 4 days back, I changed them and got a set of Illusion Electra 4" components. Made a world of difference, trust me!

For my install, I had the tweeter screwed into the A pillars, and the cross overs into the kick panels. These parts are pretty cheap to replace for Marutis anyways. However, if you are not ok with this, you can always look for other provisions like using double sided 3M tape. Works well.

Or, just play it safe and stick to any good 4" coaxial, like JBL. I don't know what other brands have them. For a budget setup, the JBL 4" have decent quality and I would recommend them. And they cost about 1.4 or 1.5k, so it will keep your budget happy.

Last edited by swarnava.m : 22nd October 2012 at 22:30.
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Old 24th October 2012, 14:56   #223
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Default Re: Santro ICE - Installation & Tuning Queries

Got the MDF tray and 6X9s fitted today.

Compared both JBL and Sony by fitting one each and changing the balance. I couldn't feel much difference between the two, maybe JBL sounded slightly better. I guess that classifies me as acoustically challenged.

Decided to go for JBL as it seems to be the popular choice here. Overall sound quality has definitely improved. As of now I don't plan to make any changes in the front.

Thanks again to swarnava.m and pradyblr for the advice. This brings my brief foray into ICE to an end.
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Old 24th October 2012, 16:20   #224
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Default Re: Santro ICE - Installation & Tuning Queries

Quote:
Originally Posted by highway_star View Post
Got the MDF tray and 6X9s fitted today.

Compared both JBL and Sony by fitting one each and changing the balance. I couldn't feel much difference between the two, maybe JBL sounded slightly better. I guess that classifies me as acoustically challenged.

Decided to go for JBL as it seems to be the popular choice here. Overall sound quality has definitely improved. As of now I don't plan to make any changes in the front.

Thanks again to swarnava.m and pradyblr for the advice. This brings my brief foray into ICE to an end.
Nice to know that you are happy and astisfied with the upgrade. However, one thing I would like to tell you here. Or rather, warn you..

Slightly OT:
The ICE Keeda never lets go of you. I have seen this happening with myself, and a few others. You get an upgrade, be happy with it for a while. Then, while it still sounds good to you, you start thinking of what else you can do to improve it.

For example, I got a new HU and new front speakers about 4 months back. I was pretty happy with the sound. But the happiness was short lived, as I said. End result? I ended up getting an amp, a sub and new components in front in the past 2 weeks.

So.. Beware..!!
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Old 3rd November 2012, 02:14   #225
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Default Help - 2002 Santro ICE Budget Mod

Hi guys, I have a 2002 Santro Zip Plus with stock casette player and two 4 inch OEM rounds in the front lower dashboard. I now need to upgrade the ICE of my car. I am planning to have a Single DIN Head Unit with two 4 inch round speakers from JBL and two 6x9 Oval JBL speakers. My budget is 10k max.

The car battery was replaced recently with the Amaron battery (4 year warranty, not much of load on the battery till date).

I have earlier seen the JBL Head Unit in JBL India's website, but when I checked it yesterday, strangely enough, it was not displayed.

Kindly recommend me some options. The car is currently in Chennai and so am looking at fitting the entire system from a reputed shop in Chennai.

I am looking at JBL products specifically because I have a 25% discount on JBL products till Diwali provided I purchase them online. My doubt is, If I purchase it online, where can I do the fitment in Chennai and how much will they charge (even if it is through the authorized JBL distributor)?

Also, will JBL speakers run well without any interference, distortion or static noise when used with Other brand HUs like Blaupunkt, Pioneer or Sony?

The following are the models of JBL speakers that I have shortlisted for purchase. If anyone is curently using them or has used them, please give the feedback on performance. The car is mainly for my grandparents, so Bass and Frequency response can take a back-seat (hence the low budget). Also, the HU interface should be simple and easy to use.

JBL GT6-S699 6x9 30way speaker for rear.

There are no options in the budget range in JBL for front 4 inch round speakers.

Please help me as I want to finish this off within a week's time so that the system is up and running before I leave from Chennai.

Thanks in advance - Surya
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