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Old 18th September 2007, 22:12   #16
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Guys,

Now I am really going mad. One of my friends was going for an ICE in his car. Before he put the new HU (pio 6950) in his system I put it in mine as I was thinking that my HU had a problem, but the clicking noise is still present.

So far I have checked the HU, the speaker wires, the RCA wires, the amp, the speakers, the power wires, the ground was first connected to the chassis, now it is connected off the battery and still no luck.

I am totally and completely lost. And none of the installers I have seen seem to know what to do :-( . Can someone please tell me what I have overlooked?

Also, since I have a feeling that the wiring is the problem, can someone suggest what could be some good quality wiring that I could get in Chennai and the related specs. I mean my setup is not some high end setup that requires a 20K Audison kit, but I am lost as to what the problem could be.
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Old 19th September 2007, 11:07   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d.kiran View Post
Guys,

Now I am really going mad. One of my friends was going for an ICE in his car. Before he put the new HU (pio 6950) in his system I put it in mine as I was thinking that my HU had a problem, but the clicking noise is still present.

So far I have checked the HU, the speaker wires, the RCA wires, the amp, the speakers, the power wires, the ground was first connected to the chassis, now it is connected off the battery and still no luck. ...
Perhaps you could describe more accurately what you are hearing, since click is rather difficult to visualize (normally a click is a discontinous metallic sound) what with FM noise also being mentioned at the same time.
- Is it something like chid-chid or chirr-chirr that one associates with sparking?
- Is it something like the sound of small crackers in the distance or the sound of small sticks burning?
- Is it a sound synchronous with engine RPM, i.e. the periodicity of clicks increases with accelerator?
- Are the clicks all at the same volume or do the loudness of the clicks vary?

* Did you try replacing your RCA cables connecting HU to amp?
* Did you connect the new 6950 to the amp or to the speakers in your car?
* (Not clear from your previous post) Does the clicking sound occur when
- you connect HU front preamp to amp and amp to rear speakers?
- you connect HU rear preamp to amp and amp to front speakers?
* Does the clicking go away when you remove ONE RCA cable, say L or R?
* Did you try connecting the HU and amp in isolation, i.e. to a battery NOT connected to the vehicle ground or battery?

Usually the most persistent and pestilent problems have a simple silly source / reason, not a complex one. Don't lose heart, maybe you can lick the problem yourself.
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Old 19th September 2007, 17:10   #18
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Ahh The Old Fox :-). I was hoping you would drop in.

I will try and record the sound and post it here. Meanwhile here are the answers to your questions.

- Is it something like chid-chid or chirr-chirr that one associates with sparking?
- Is it something like the sound of small crackers in the distance or the sound of small sticks burning?

The best way of describing the sound would be I think to put metallic stuff (like say one pin or one jump clip) in a small metallic box and shake it once. That sound I am calling it as a 'click'.

The pattern of the sound goes 'click-click-click-cleeeccck' and repeats.

- Is it a sound synchronous with engine RPM, i.e. the periodicity of clicks increases with accelerator?
Nope. The periodicity remains the same always.

- Are the clicks all at the same volume or do the loudness of the clicks vary?
The clicks are of the same volume and the volume of the clicks themselves do not increase if I increase the volume.


* Did you try replacing your RCA cables connecting HU to amp?
Yup.
* Did you connect the new 6950 to the amp or to the speakers in your car?
I used the front preout into the amp. Therefore the amp powers my fronts.
* (Not clear from your previous post) Does the clicking sound occur when
- you connect HU front preamp to amp and amp to rear speakers?
I did not try this. Basically my rears are not connected to the amp. They are connected to the HU.
- you connect HU rear preamp to amp and amp to front speakers?
I tried this and the clicking occurs but it is slightly lesser than before.
* Does the clicking go away when you remove ONE RCA cable, say L or R?
If the engine is off and I remove the R, then the clicking goes off completely. But when I switch the engine on, the clicking is back again.
No effect when I remove L.
* Did you try connecting the HU and amp in isolation, i.e. to a battery NOT connected to the vehicle ground or battery?
Nope. This never occurred to me. I will give this a shot.

I am praying that it is a small problem... I am trying everything I can think of :-). Thanks for your help.
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Old 19th September 2007, 17:20   #19
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I remember this thread about noise being generated because of something about the grounding of the RCAs going for a toss inside the HU. A picture with the fix was also posted -- some wires intertwined between the 4 RCA jacks in the back of the HU. I can't find it now :( Looks like l_b_m's services are needed.

EDIT: One such thread = http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/diy-do...alt-whine.html

EDIT Again: Got it. Look at post #5726. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/ask-gu...new-q-382.html

Last edited by hydrashok : 19th September 2007 at 17:32.
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Old 19th September 2007, 17:35   #20
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I tried that with the Pioneer 6950 which I had connected. No luck :-(.

My HU does not have the connectors on the HU, it has separate wires coming out which has the pre outs for all the channels (front, rear, center and sub). I tried grounding them as well. No luck again.
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Old 20th September 2007, 15:27   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d.kiran View Post
* Does the clicking go away when you remove ONE RCA cable, say L or R?
If the engine is off and I remove the R, then the clicking goes off completely. But when I switch the engine on, the clicking is back again.
No effect when I remove L..
when the engine is off and you remove L cable you still hear clicking?
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Old 20th September 2007, 17:51   #22
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Do you by any chance carry a mobile phone all the while where you keep Bluetooth on?
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Old 20th September 2007, 18:11   #23
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i have a feeling that your amp could be the culprit. try another amp if possible.

cheers
clip
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Old 20th September 2007, 19:41   #24
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I think he has already tried a different amp.
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Old 21st September 2007, 00:41   #25
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Quote:
when the engine is off and you remove L cable you still hear clicking?
Nope. I cannot hear the clicking when the engine is off.

Quote:
Do you by any chance carry a mobile phone all the while where you keep Bluetooth on?
As a matter of fact my bluetooth is always on. I will try not taking my cell phone the first thing tomorrow morning. That's a good suggestion.

Quote:
i have a feeling that your amp could be the culprit. try another amp if possible.
I think he has already tried a different amp.
Yes. I tried a different amp but still no luck.

I am planning to go to an installer on Saturday and rewiring the entire car. Will probably change all the wires :-)
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Old 21st September 2007, 09:39   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
Do you by any chance carry a mobile phone all the while where you keep Bluetooth on?
but when the engine is off he does not hear any clicking even with both channels connected. I assume bluetooth would affect teh system even when engine is off.

when engine is on he hears clicking only after R channel is connected
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Old 21st September 2007, 10:02   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
but when the engine is off he does not hear any clicking even with both channels connected. I assume bluetooth would affect teh system even when engine is off.

when engine is on he hears clicking only after R channel is connected
You are quite right, Navin, BT will affect even when engine is off.

If the clicks happen only when the engine is ON, and are independent of HU and amp, the possible reasons of the clicks could only be:
- EMI through power line from an engine-related source like a control unit or alternator
- EMI directly to RCA cable, HU or amp from such a source
- Wrong connection to some control/signal pin at HU or amp

Last edited by DerAlte : 21st September 2007 at 10:04.
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Old 21st September 2007, 10:10   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
You are quite right, Navin, BT will affect even when engine is off.

If the clicks happen only when the engine is ON, and are independent of HU and amp, the possible reasons of the clicks could only be:
- EMI through power line from an engine-related source like a control unit or alternator
- EMI directly to RCA cable, HU or amp from such a source
- Wrong connection to some control/signal pin at HU or amp
I suspect the third of those options.
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Old 21st September 2007, 10:34   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DerAlte;
Usually the most persistent and pestilent problems have a simple silly source / reason, not a complex one. Don't lose heart, maybe you can lick the problem yourself.
very true DerAlte,... I have experienced this over and over again.

hi d.kiran, I have been watching your thread for long. in fact i used your thread's title on my garage too. sorry for that.

i'm absolutely nothing compared to the audio gurus here, but i would like to give you a different way to troubleshoot...

(needs patience, some expertise in removing and reinstalling the ICE, and a strong goal to get rid of this issue)

- completely remove the ICE, every single thing that you fit in (including the wiring)
- start the troubleshoot by connecting only the HU and the speakers (probably one by one - step by step)
- one left, another left, one right, another right to your HU output directly
- next go on to do the same using the amp (exactly in the same way that you plan to use the amp)
- play music ONLY from a CD player - no FM, no external source for your test
- proceed by connecting your components - one by one

this will help you isolate the culprit SURELY.

this is the way test cases are executed for a project with the focus on a 100% error free software
hope you can apply this to your project too.




P.S.: never add/change/remove any individual piece of the components used in the ICE during the check.

Last edited by gbpscars : 21st September 2007 at 10:41.
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Old 25th September 2007, 12:10   #30
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Well.. I am still not close to why the problem is occurring, but now it is under control. I am not technical so probably someone can explain why the following steps helped.

1. My grounding wire (for the amp) was a 10AWG. I upgraded it to 8AWG. Perceptible reduction, but still very slight.

2. The grounding from the battery to the chassis was upgraded with a newer wire of the same guage. This made the most difference. I did notice there was a slight bit of rust there. Was that probably affecting the grounding? No idea myself.

3. Changed the RCA wire. I noticed that my previous installer (Sound Factor) had spliced the wire and used the tape to connect them together.

4. Reduced the gain on the amp (this is jugaad, not actually solving the problem) to around 35%.

Now the noise is coming only when some aspect of the HU is in operation i.e. when the Display slides out, when the iPod is selected etc. and it goes away in 1-2 minutes. It really does go away cos I checked by pausing the music and keeping my ears very close. My static in FM and interference is gone.

So right now, it is liveable. But undoubtedly I will need a new HU and that's a new thread in Product Discussions :-).

Thanks a lot all of you for helping me out with this.
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