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Old 30th May 2009, 00:00   #31
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B&T. ZOTAC ION DUAL CORE ATOM N330 would be good choice. Low TPD. wilth good performance. I am getting mine soon from Zotac NVIDIA ION IONITX-D-E Atom N330 CPU/Motherboard - IONITX-D-E by:
I agree with IBM. 2 GB single stick would be ideal choice. and my hibernation timing is 5-7 seconds to sleep and 5-7 seconds to resume.
For Sound Card. Do not buy USB soundcard at any cost. I am regretting right now with my X-Fi. Not with performance. but Hibernation(CentraFuse) and slow boot time.(Intel Board).
I am soon moving to new enclosure and PCI Sound Card.
For Stoarge. Get 32GB SSD and 320GB Laptop HDD.

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Old 30th May 2009, 00:26   #32
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PCI Sound Card.
Again why PCI and why not PCI-X?

I recommend you this: ASUSTeK Computer Inc.

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Old 30th May 2009, 00:31   #33
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IMBji. It was a typo. I meant PCI-X. Yes Read lots of good reviews about Asus Xonar.
but i have to check with zotac board.coz it has PCI-X but it is occupied by Wi-Fi.

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Old 30th May 2009, 00:47   #34
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Fine, Once you upgraded to Asus PCI-X, buy the Remastered Hotel California 5.1 24/192KHz DVD-A Audio DVD and tell us - how they are playing even with the low end speakers. (I hope you will use good quality RCAs)
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Old 30th May 2009, 07:34   #35
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Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
Believe me even I have too tried, but the kit I have is not efficient(coolermaster R80) and I have reached only 10% low in temp, so I dropped the idea.
this one is better and available in India
Cooler Master - Ultimate provider of Computer Chassis | Cooler | Power Supply

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i actually karaoke'd it. You are pretttttty good with this Mr. Advani!
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Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble View Post
I have had 17 birthdays since the day I was born, and haven't received any ICE components as a gift on even one of them thanks to such baseless rumours.
I was only having fun.

BTW B&T if you are 17, I am 24!

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Primarily because I did not know it existed. Thanks for pointing it out. And by the way, I have never claimed to be an audiophile.
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Old 30th May 2009, 12:40   #36
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So.. 8GB or 32GB SSD?? The price difference must be huge. ...
8GB.
* OS needs 700MB max on disc, <100MB RAM
* Apps that you will run will need a couple of GB max on disc
* You will still have a few GB left over to store songs that you just cannot do without - will help when you get bored of everything else (we all have such times)
* All other stuff goes on to the HDD. Even MS Office if you want!

You can avoid the HDD altogether actually. All your media is acquired via home PC or laptop, and a good media library will allow you to selectively export to external drives, incl. playlists. Even if you carry all your stuff, you will need to get back to base to sync up the new stuff. Get a large capacity pendrive to carry media - no tension of HDD going kaput. Na rahega baans ...

Keep all the DSP work out of the PC. If you really need TA, use a dedicated external unit, because all told the system with external DSP will cost less than the PC and software that dear IBM_J is using. And external DSPs do their job well without hassles.
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Old 30th May 2009, 13:49   #37
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Keep all the DSP work out of the PC. If you really need TA, use a dedicated external unit, because all told the system with external DSP will cost less than the PC and software that dear IBM_J is using. And external DSPs do their job well without hassles.
No, external units uses the same algorithm we are using in PC, but they kill the music with Phase distortion, Intermodulation distortion, Harmonic Distortion, Phase Delay, Group Delay, Crosstalk and CMRR. The Audio processing in DIGITAL Domain is recommended for a SQL setup, but it should be atleast at 24bit/96KHz and I recommend 192Khz samples. I even recommend not to use any Hardware based Cross-over or EQ from your Highend Amplifiers/Speakers. Amplifiers are just to amplify and Speakers are just to deliver. Finish all your processing in the Digital domain and split(XO) the signal in digital then convert to analog to pass for delivery, If possible I recommend digital delivery at least till the amplifier.

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Old 30th May 2009, 18:50   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
CMRR.

Finish all your processing in the Digital domain and split(XO) the signal in digital then convert to analog to pass for delivery, If possible I recommend digital delivery at least till the amplifier.
CMRR in a DSP?

Yes it makes sense to process as much in the digital domain as possible. still if one was to XO inthe digital domain one would need multiple outputs from the sound card to the amps. do sound cards provide this?
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Old 30th May 2009, 19:09   #39
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Quote:
CMRR in a DSP?
it should read as CMR and its not for DSP, but it exists in Analog devices, but not in car amps as long as we are not using balanced inputs.

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do sound cards provide this?
yes, 1010LT will give you unbalanced 8 channels.
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Old 31st May 2009, 00:00   #40
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Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
No, external units uses the same algorithm we are using in PC, but they kill the music with Phase distortion, Intermodulation distortion, Harmonic Distortion, Phase Delay, Group Delay, Crosstalk and CMRR. ...
Huff puff huff puff *now where is that panting smiley* Hello, IBM_J baba, I don't think anyone will get time to listen to music if they have to worry about all this, unless they are doing nothing else all the day. And B&T just wanted something practical - he knows enough about making signals sound nice to teach the rest of us (excl. Navin, who know all that and the rest).

The pursuit of perfection is fine within practical limits, after that the Law of Diminishing Returns applies. All that you have listed above are not necessarily evils, many in fact add to the enjoyment of music, like the output of valve amplifiers.

Just think - how many people have a high power PC to listen to perfect reproduction, as compared to the number of people with external DSPs, and then compared to people who just use rudimentary/minimal signal tailoring?

If you project a graph of practical returns v/s investment in your setup, you will notice a steep fall and then flattening after the first 50K (excluding speakers, amps etc.). Now just consider this: with a the low power PC + external DSP, B&T would reach the same inflection point at much less cost. With lesser complications, lesser points of failure risk, and lesser variables to worry about ideal values. And he will get enough time to enjoy music, rather than worrying about algorithms, software setups and infinite configurability. And with enough money left over to pay for new music acquisition for the next 5 years.

Capisce, compadre?
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Old 31st May 2009, 00:14   #41
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Quote:
with a the low power PC + external DSP, B&T would reach the same inflection point at much less cost.
I agree with you all bhai, except the cost of DSP. An external DSP will cost you around $1000 - $3000, Dont say me Alphine 650 is a pure DSP. A DSP must have a processor with memory and it should accept and maintain the input signal in digital domain till it delivers it. But yes, there are $500 DSP s are there with poor quality ADC and DACs , but they are dedicated for some specific/mobile tasks, not suitable for a complete Car SQL setup.

Why i am saying this all - we have a powerful DSP called computer - why don't we use it for Cross over, TA, Phase correction and Acoustic. I haven't seen any DSP which process the Audio at 192Khz other than the $10,000 Digi-Design's, but your $1000 PC can do it better than the Digi's. But this are all a stupid thing as mentioned by you if B&Ts Aim is just another Car PC and not a perfect SQL setup.

Actually I was not interested in TA & Phase correction with my Car PC in the beginning, But B&T is the one who advised me to try TA, so I hope he will be interested in this stupid SQL concepts. I don't advice anybody to waste money on this softwares, all of the software has some trial version - TRY BEFORE BUY!! But don't buy another Alphine 650 for a SQL setup.

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Old 31st May 2009, 01:06   #42
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And the good news is this Software are even Free now if you have a poorman's soundcard:

kX Project -- Effects for the kX Audio Driver
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Old 31st May 2009, 07:15   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
Why i am saying this all - we have a powerful DSP called computer - why don't we use it for Cross over, TA, Phase correction and Acoustic.
Actually I was not interested in TA & Phase correction with my Car PC in the beginning, But B&T is the one who advised me to try TA, so I hope he will be interested in this stupid SQL concepts. I don't advice anybody to waste money on this softwares, all of the software has some trial version - TRY BEFORE BUY!! But don't buy another Alphine 650 for a SQL setup.
from what I know Digidesigns's boards typically cost $2000 not $10,000 and as someone who has tried and used the Alpine 650 I must say it is extremely limited in its application. that said...

What you are saying is get a simple PC, add DSP software, add a sound card and be done with it (amps and speakers are a given).

Actually if he was to do everything at the PC end, B&T's application would need not 8 but 12 channels of output: 2 for sub, 6 for front (3way active), 4 for rear (2 way active). He'd need a sound card that can do this. Lets assume there is one...

1. Can you configure a PC to boot in a few (under 20) seconds?
2. 12 channels of good amplification are not cheap
3. DSP has it uses but to worry about every type of distortion takes much of the fun out of the music.

As for 192k audio EMU (they have a PCI 1212) and a host of others do it.
RME: Hammerfall DSP MADI
https://www.soundstore.co.nz/p-2070-...bit192khz.aspx
BirdlandMusic.Net EMU 1616M PCI Audio Interface - 24 Bit, 192kHz with DSP - Free shipping
MOTU UltraLite-mk3 | Sweetwater.com

Last edited by navin : 31st May 2009 at 07:31.
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Old 31st May 2009, 09:51   #44
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Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
... A DSP must have a processor with memory and it should accept and maintain the input signal in digital domain till it delivers it. ...
You should study embedded systems to know what DSP is.

Not all processors are x86, not all processing needs large RAM, and very few algorithms need a PC to execute! A PC is like using a cannon to kill a mosquito, and even then it struggles (you have experienced that). But then unless one uses a PC, one wouldn't get the satisfaction of 'digital' manipulation. There is more to do in life than PCs, baba, like listening to music - lyrics, tune, rhythm ...

Last edited by DerAlte : 31st May 2009 at 10:01.
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Old 31st May 2009, 10:44   #45
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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
8GB.
* OS needs 700MB max on disc, <100MB RAM
* Apps that you will run will need a couple of GB max on disc
* You will still have a few GB left over to store songs that you just cannot do without - will help when you get bored of everything else (we all have such times)
* All other stuff goes on to the HDD. Even MS Office if you want!

You can avoid the HDD altogether actually. All your media is acquired via home PC or laptop, and a good media library will allow you to selectively export to external drives, incl. playlists. Even if you carry all your stuff, you will need to get back to base to sync up the new stuff. Get a large capacity pendrive to carry media - no tension of HDD going kaput. Na rahega baans ...
Totally agree. 8GB SSD is more than enough. I've done it in a 4GB SSD with complete North America maps on an Asus EEE PC and still had some 800-900Mb free. Just make sure you get a good quality SSD.

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Originally Posted by navin View Post
1. Can you configure a PC to boot in a few (under 20) seconds?
Yes it is totally possible. I've clocked less than 12 seconds boot times on an Asus EEEPC with 4GB SSD. The key is to nLite Windows XP to bare basics. Some drivers are prone to delay the boot but sub 20 seconds is very much doable.

If none of these works, there are other fast boot options like HORM (Hibernate Once, Resume Many).
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