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Old 31st May 2009, 14:38   #46
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from what I know Digidesigns's boards typically cost $2000 not $10,000
Bhai, for $2000 you will get just the I/O device. A single DSP Chip cost you around $8000 from Digi. Pro Tools|HD 2 Accel Systems

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and as someone who has tried and used the Alpine 650 I must say it is extremely limited in its application.
I am not against Alpine. I am saying that its not DSP as they need at least 400MIPS processor for a 512 band EQ which is not possible under $400. i will be the first one, if you prove that its a pure DSP.

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ould need not 8 but 12 channels of output: 2 for sub, 6 for front (3way active), 4 for rear (2 way active). He'd need a sound card that can do this.
12 Channel output is not a big deal, but you need to invest in 2 sound cards. I recommend you two Xonar D2X.

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Can you configure a PC to boot in a few (under 20) seconds?
I hope, My PC wont take more than 10

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12 channels of good amplification are not cheap
Exactly, and you may need to Bi-Amp the High Frequencies. A Passive 3-way or 2-Way with single input wont work for SQL.

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DSP has it uses but to worry about every type of distortion takes much of the fun out of the music.
No, There are good dedicated DSPs at 24/96 for Car PCs, but it will cost you a bomp.

RPM 26z Programmable Multiprocessor

BSS Audiosw9088iis

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A PC is like using a cannon to kill a mosquito, and even then it struggles
I agree Bhai, but using a DSP in car is like using a mobile phone in home as you already have a Landline there. I don't agree a device as a pure DSP device as it has a DSP Chip. A DSP should perform all its operation in digital domain, isnt it? If it performing only the Time Alignment in Digital and EQ in Analog, whats the use? I wonder then why Digi has 18 DSP Chips in its Accel card.

And finally I advice B&T to buy and write a good review here: Alpine PXE-H650 IMPRINT™ sound processor Get top performance from a full audio system while retaining your factory stereo at Crutchfield.com

But all this stupid things won't work if your ears are not perfect. Don't follow my advice if your can't find any difference between 48Khz music and 96KHz music. If you had never get a chance to hear DTS-HD or TrueHD at 192Khz - you may not need a SQL setup. For MP3 and 48KHz, I recommend you the Alpine 701 than 650.

Last edited by ibm_jennifer : 31st May 2009 at 14:58.
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Old 31st May 2009, 15:53   #47
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Originally Posted by Digital Vampire View Post
Yes it is totally possible. I've clocked less than 12 seconds boot times on an Asus EEEPC with 4GB SSD.
with DSP software and sound cards?

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Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
I am not against Alpine. I am saying that its not DSP as they need at least 400MIPS processor for a 512 band EQ which is not possible under $400. i will be the first one, if you prove that its a pure DSP.

Exactly, and you may need to Bi-Amp the High Frequencies. A Passive 3-way or 2-Way with single input wont work for SQL.

No, There are good dedicated DSPs at 24/96 for Car PCs, but it will cost you a bomp.

RPM 26z Programmable Multiprocessor

BSS Audiosw9088iis
I said I have tried the Alpine (and so has B&T) and found it limiting. We did not like it.

If B&T wants to work in the PC domain (incl. XO) he'd need 12 amp channels as he is going 3 way in the front and 2 way for the rear plus he needs 1-2 channels for the subs

We cant install the BSS or Rane devices in a car can we. These are for rack mounting.

IBM_J dont get me wrong. We are not trying to diss you or anything all we are trying to do is get a simple solution that will boot fast, not be a headache to tune, and produce good sound.

A PC with DSP software and 12 channel sound card would be great if it could do this. Since B&T sells Steg I assume his amps would be 2 Steg 4.01 and 1 700-1200W GZ monoblock for the subs.
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Old 31st May 2009, 16:05   #48
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with DSP software and sound cards?
Its not possible to Boot, but we can Hibernate, isn't it?

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he'd need 12 amp channels as he is going 3 way in the front and 2 way for the rear plus he needs 1-2 channels for the subs
I don't understand this Bhai, as I have ZERO knowledge in speaker domain. Do you referring the speaker output of the Amps as channel? Why do you need 2 channel for sub? And how many inputs (means RCA inputs) a 3 way speaker needs? Is it possible to control the MID and High of this passive speakers without Bi-Amping? I am not sure whether its possible with a 3 way speaker, but not with my Electra 6.1 unless I Bi-amp without the cross-over.

If he is going with 4.1 setup, then he needs 4 channel for front(MID+High) and 4 channel for rear (Mid+high) and one for Sub - so totally 9 channels. if he is going for 3 way front, he needs 11 channels (3+3+2+2+1), Am I right?

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Old 31st May 2009, 16:08   #49
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he needs only 1 ch. for a sub but most sound cards have even number of outputs 6, 8, 12, etc..

1 ch. for sub
6 ch. for front (3 way left, 3 way right)
4 ch. for rear (2 way left, 2 way right).
------
11 channels.
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Old 31st May 2009, 19:49   #50
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11 channels.
And +1 for Center channel (if he plays 5.1 songs or Blue-ray movies). So total 12 channels. SO he needs total 10 channels Amplification power with a dedicated Mono Amp for Sub and an Active center speaker.

And you don't need 5.1 for competition SQL as you will ended up playing a 192Khz 24 bit LPCM or DTS-MA or lossless FLAC source only for a SQL show-off. (There is no 5.1 lossless DTS at 192Khz)

I think B&T will drop his SQL idea and he will Be happy With his current setup.

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but most sound cards have even number of outputs 6, 8, 12, etc..
Yes, But installing 2 sound cards is not a problem in a Car PC and it will perfectly works with Virtual Audio cable through ASIO4ALL.

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Old 31st May 2009, 20:10   #51
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Active fronts with 2 x 6" midbasses per side + 1 pair x HF drivers
And what you meant by Active speaker in a Car? Don't it have any built-in Amp? And can we load it with multiple/separate inputs for Low/ Mid and High? Then don't it have a built-in cross-over?
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Old 31st May 2009, 23:30   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
... IBM_J dont get me wrong. We are not trying to diss you or anything all we are trying to do is get a simple solution that will boot fast, not be a headache to tune, and produce good sound. ...
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Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
And what you meant by Active speaker in a Car? Don't it have any built-in Amp? ...
Hello IBM_J, the thread is about B&T wanting suggestions about a CarPC. Going off track and overboard about exotic concepts is not helping the thread originator's cause. Shall we constrain our discussion to practical (and practically achieving them in India) issues please? Looks like we have already scared B&T into hiding.

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Old 31st May 2009, 23:36   #53
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Never believe it cannot be done - it's only that you haven't found out how!!!
I just noticed that actually I have bumped a very old topic: 19th January 2009, 11:42. - Its because not to diss/hide B&T, I thought he might too love Music like me.

But the Real is No one was here to help B&T for the last 4 months - If real is what you can feel, smell, taste and see, then 'real' is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain..

Why I am here is - if you believe Active speaker is better than Passive, if you believe Time Alignment is necessary in a Car then, To tell you Pure Digital Audio Processing is better than any good High End Analog Processing - And its actually cheaper/free! If you are in business with those Analog / Poor DSP Signal Processing companies, then I cant do!

And I agree that I am over boarding and I will keep quite.

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Old 1st June 2009, 00:07   #54
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And what you meant by Active speaker in a Car? Don't it have any built-in Amp? And can we load it with multiple/separate inputs for Low/ Mid and High? Then don't it have a built-in cross-over?
By active I mean that all XO is done before the amp and not after it.

B&T is considering 2 x 6" + tweeter which in reality is a 2 way as the 2 6" will use the same LP output from the electronic XO but I intend to convince him to go 3 way with with a dedicated wide band 3.5"-4" midrange. But that is another story.

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Originally Posted by ibm_jennifer View Post
Why I am here is - if you believe Active speaker is better than Passive, if you believe Time Alignment is necessary in a Car then, To tell you Pure Digital Audio Processing is better than any good High End Analog Processing - And its actually cheaper/free! If you are in business with those Analog / Poor DSP Signal Processing companies, then I cant do!
IBM_J lets start from the very begining.

The option we are looking at is how to get FLAC encoded music from a Hard disk to the speakers in as simple and clean a manner as possible. We want TA, DSP, etc..but the system must be reliable, have a really fast boot time, etc..

Yes doing all this at the PC end sounds great. I assume what you are suggesting is

Hardware -> Software DSP (TA, EQ, etc..) -> Sound card (XO, DAC, etc..) -> Amps -> Speaker. If this is right lets see what the best way to execute each of these blocks is.
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Old 7th December 2009, 18:18   #55
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Where is B & T ? Is it done yet sir ? We are waiting with bated breath.
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Old 7th December 2009, 21:18   #56
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The Lancer has met with an accident. :(
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Old 8th December 2009, 00:50   #57
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Ohh S**t. what happened ?
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