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Old 9th February 2009, 17:44   #1
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Default Query on Very Basic ICE setup for Vista

Hello Gurus,
Please help me for the following questions.(Request you to Please answer all my questions point wise)

I have a budget of max Rs10000 (If possible I would like to save on it also ). Am ready to go for without bill and warranty.Will not fit amplifier or subwoofer in future.I would be booking Vista TDI in coming week and giving the Purchased ICE and setup to Dealer to fit it as per his style to avoid warranty getting void (No wire cut,Thanks to Team BHP for all this knowledge) Am in Pune can travel to Mumbai (hometown) if am going to get a good deal.
Present decided configuration: Pioneer HU 3090 (Rs5400),Front Pioneer Coaxials 4 inch(Rs 1200), Rear 6x9 inch ovals (2200).All are without bill and warranty.
1) Are the above prices ok?
2)Accessory shop person told me not to fit JBL speakers because they wont give any additional benefit unless you use Amplifier.It would cost me Rs3000 for JBL Is that true?What is the cost of 6x9 JBL Oval speakers without bill/warranty.
2) Any changes in Headset?Front 4 inch/ Pioneer coaxials in door?
3) Most Imp Question for me: Should I fit rear speakers in doors or on the Parcel Tray? Does it really make such a big difference if I put Ovals on tray when as compared to 4 inch coaxials in the rear door.(Standard Provision)Please discuss this in detail.Vista has a flimsy parcel tray(factory fitted) would it be gud to fit ovals on such a flimsy tray?Please throw some light on pros and cons of such fitment.
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Old 9th February 2009, 18:06   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_purohit20 View Post
Hello Gurus,
Please help me for the following questions.(Request you to Please answer all my questions point wise)

I have a budget of max Rs10000 (If possible I would like to save on it also ). Am ready to go for without bill and warranty.Will not fit amplifier or subwoofer in future.I would be booking Vista TDI in coming week and giving the Purchased ICE and setup to Dealer to fit it as per his style to avoid warranty getting void (No wire cut,Thanks to Team BHP for all this knowledge) Am in Pune can travel to Mumbai (hometown) if am going to get a good deal.
you can get it installed from outside without cutting any wires(remember to use a wiring harness, and get it done at a reputed installer) and still have your warranty. Dealers just say that you will lose warranty just to scare you into buying the ICE from them - they are very high margin items. I have an indica myself, and the service center said no issues with getting the ICE done from outside
Quote:
Present decided configuration: Pioneer HU 3090 (Rs5400),Front Pioneer Coaxials 4 inch(Rs 1200), Rear 6x9 inch ovals (2200).All are without bill and warranty.
1) Are the above prices ok?
seem fine , but I'd suggest you avoid pioneer speakers. most of them currently available are fake , and most people cant notice the difference
Quote:
2)Accessory shop person told me not to fit JBL speakers because they wont give any additional benefit unless you use Amplifier.It would cost me Rs3000 for JBL Is that true?What is the cost of 6x9 JBL Oval speakers without bill/warranty.
no such thing. they'll work quite fine with the pio 3050. the ovals should cost about 1.5k for the 4" coax for the front, and 4~5k for the rear ovals
Quote:
2) Any changes in Headset?Front 4 inch/ Pioneer coaxials in door?
as said earlier , avoid pioneer speakers. If you want more bass, get the door speakers, if you want more vocals and clarity, get the speakers in the dash. if you want both ( and can afford another 5k), get comps , but I'm not sure the dealer can fit them
Quote:
3) Most Imp Question for me: Should I fit rear speakers in doors or on the Parcel Tray? Does it really make such a big difference if I put Ovals on tray when as compared to 4 inch coaxials in the rear door.(Standard Provision)Please discuss this in detail.Vista has a flimsy parcel tray(factory fitted) would it be gud to fit ovals on such a flimsy tray?Please throw some light on pros and cons of such fitment.
i think the rear door fits 5 inchers. ovals in the back would be a better idea. I'd suggest you get a wooden tray made (~1k) and fit the ovals in that. should be sturdier and get more bass. keep your current plastic tray safe, so that you can put it back in your car when you sell it.
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Old 9th February 2009, 19:31   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_purohit20 View Post
Hello Gurus,
Please help me for the following questions.(Request you to Please answer all my questions point wise)

I have a budget of max Rs10000 (If possible I would like to save on it also ). Am ready to go for without bill and warranty.Will not fit amplifier or subwoofer in future.I would be booking Vista TDI in coming week and giving the Purchased ICE and setup to Dealer to fit it as per his style to avoid warranty getting void (No wire cut,Thanks to Team BHP for all this knowledge) Am in Pune can travel to Mumbai (hometown) if am going to get a good deal.
Present decided configuration: Pioneer HU 3090 (Rs5400),Front Pioneer Coaxials 4 inch(Rs 1200), Rear 6x9 inch ovals (2200).All are without bill and warranty.
1) Are the above prices ok?
2)Accessory shop person told me not to fit JBL speakers because they wont give any additional benefit unless you use Amplifier.It would cost me Rs3000 for JBL Is that true?What is the cost of 6x9 JBL Oval speakers without bill/warranty.
2) Any changes in Headset?Front 4 inch/ Pioneer coaxials in door?
3) Most Imp Question for me: Should I fit rear speakers in doors or on the Parcel Tray? Does it really make such a big difference if I put Ovals on tray when as compared to 4 inch coaxials in the rear door.(Standard Provision)Please discuss this in detail.Vista has a flimsy parcel tray(factory fitted) would it be gud to fit ovals on such a flimsy tray?Please throw some light on pros and cons of such fitment.
I'd the following setup in my Swift
Pioneer 3090/3050 + JBL Front Coaxials + JBL 6*9 Ovals + Custom Made Parcel Tray (made of 1.5" Plywood)- all without B&W for 8900.

Seeing your current prices - they seem to be a little on the higher side.
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Old 9th February 2009, 21:27   #4
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I would suggest if you drive most of the time get a HU+component set infront, if not then HU+front speakers+ovals in parcel tray.
I would suggest JBL irrespective of the fact that it is connected to a Amp or not.
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Old 9th February 2009, 22:49   #5
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Mods please merge the following thread with this as i think a duplicate thread has been created - http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/ask-gu...vista-tdi.html
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Old 10th February 2009, 22:26   #6
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Thank you all guys, I visited more acessory shops in pune. Following points:
1) I will go for PIO 3050 (I dont know if any other model exists to fit my budget of 10k).Pioneer lot of fakes available so JBL Speakers for front and JBL/JVC rear.
2) I have tied up with car dealer,I will supply him all setup and he will do the fitting from me and give me a labour bill for the same. Hope this doesnot ruin my warranty. Still I dont trust the dealer for his words and also his ICE Fitment ability is in a big doubt.
2) FRONT DOOR SPEAKERS: Read from those who have already installed on T-BHP that max 5.25 inch Coaxials can be put in Front door for Vista but some guy has put 4.25" as his acesory shop person advised him. Anyone sure about the max speaker size please revert. I want to try to put the maximum size coaxial in front. Acessory person told me he fit 6" for some guy but Team BHP member telling something different.Am confused.Please suggest JBL or any other good speaker models.
3) REAR DOOR/TRAY SPEAKERS: I am still confused between tray and door location.Size for Rear Door is 4"(Source:Accessory shop).I do not want to sacrifice the Boot space but will be ready to do so if the difference I would get by fitting 6x9" Ovals is quite significant.(I love bass) Please again comment on this. If you vouch for parcel tray location then please suggest JBL models for the same. Could some one give prices of the lowest to medium cost 6x9" JBL ovals like 402,937/938 etc.

Again thank you all gurus for the help you provide to newbies like us.
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Old 11th February 2009, 11:11   #7
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Hello Gurus,
One more query I read if you are the one who is going to drive always, then its better to go for components in front and no need for 6x9" ovals in tray.One can just fit simple 4"coaxials in rear doors. Is this ok and will it be more better than using the 6X9" in tray? If yes,I read that JBL components cost around 4500-5000.Is this with or without b/w?As my budget is 10k can i manage to go for Pio 3090/3050 USB-Rs5000 + JBL Components in front doors-Rs 5000 = Rs 10000. Will I need anything more than the above set like cross overs,wiring etc or it will come with the Components itself. If i go for components I do not plan to install any speakers in rear(door/tray) due to budget crunch.
What I understand from components is that it comes with 2 speakers (Bass+Treble)in Front doors and 2 Tweeters in Dash. Is my understanding right?
Please suggest the best configuration what I can get in 10k budget.
@Soni Rohit Could you tell me the specific JBL speaker models in your car in front and rear and there sizes?
Imp: Do we need a amplifier for using Components. I mean would the components make a difference without the amplifier?I am not going for amplifier in future also.

Last edited by amit_purohit20 : 11th February 2009 at 11:30.
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Old 11th February 2009, 11:35   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_purohit20 View Post
I have tied up with car dealer,I will supply him all setup and he will do the fitting from me and give me a labour bill for the same. Hope this doesnot ruin my warranty. Still I dont trust the dealer for his words and also his ICE Fitment ability is in a big doubt.
Even I wouldn't trust a dealer about his fitment skills. I still say get it done from outside. I really dont think it will void your warranty if done properly. Pune has some really good installers. Check this thread for more info
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/ask-gu...ller-pune.html
Quote:
2) FRONT DOOR SPEAKERS: Read from those who have already installed on T-BHP that max 5.25 inch Coaxials can be put in Front door for Vista but some guy has put 4.25" as his acesory shop person advised him. Anyone sure about the max speaker size please revert. I want to try to put the maximum size coaxial in front. Acessory person told me he fit 6" for some guy but Team BHP member telling something different.Am confused.Please suggest JBL or any other good speaker models.
A friend of mine , 200mph tried fitting 6" speakers using spacer rings, but couldnt. 5" was the max he could do. you may be able to fit 6"ers if you cut the door panels , but that might cause you to lose you warranty, and i dont think most people like to have the door panels cut up. since you are un pune , try out illusions audio speakers too. poona motors should have them in stock.
Quote:
REAR DOOR/TRAY SPEAKERS: I am still confused between tray and door location.Size for Rear Door is 4"(Source:Accessory shop).I do not want to sacrifice the Boot space but will be ready to do so if the difference I would get by fitting 6x9" Ovals is quite significant.(I love bass) Please again comment on this. If you vouch for parcel tray location then please suggest JBL models for the same. Could some one give prices of the lowest to medium cost 6x9" JBL ovals like 402,937/938 etc.
If you want bass and will not be fitting any subwoofer, the next best thing is a pair of 6x9 ovals on a thick MDF tray. no other option ! . i think they start from 4k onwards
Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_purohit20 View Post
Hello Gurus,
One more query I read if you are the one who is going to drive always, then its better to go for components in front and no need for 6x9" ovals in tray.One can just fit simple 4"coaxials in rear doors. Is this ok and will it be more better than using the 6X9" in tray? If yes,I read that JBL components cost around 4500-5000.Is this with or without b/w?As my budget is 10k can i manage to go for Pio 3090/3050 USB-Rs5000 + JBL Components in front doors-Rs 5000 = Rs 10000. Will I need anything more than the above set like cross overs,wiring etc or it will come with the Components itself.
What I understand from components is that it comes with 2 speakers (Bass+Treble)in Front doors and 2 Tweeters in Dash. Is my understanding right?
Please suggest the best configuration what I can get in 10k budget.
@Soni Rohit Could you tell me the specific JBL speaker models in your car in front and rear and there sizes?
for a 10k budget, you have to choose between bass and clarity. you cant have both.
1. for absolute max bass, get 6x9's + MDF tray in the rear, and 5" coax in the door
2. for something with a slightly less bass, and a little more clarity and vocals, get 6x9's + MDF tray, and 4" coax in the dash
3. for clarity, and if your budget is really tight, get 5" components in front , and 6" coax in the rear stock tray ( you will have to cut it though - and it may rattle)
4. max bass and clarity, 5" components in front, 6x9's + MDF tray in the rear, but the speakers alone will cost 10k

I would recommend either config # 2 or 4
Quote:
Imp: Do we need a amplifier for using Components. I mean would the components make a difference without the amplifier?I am not going for amplifier in future also.
no , you dont need an amp for components. I'm using my components with my HU only

Last edited by greenhorn : 11th February 2009 at 11:39.
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Old 11th February 2009, 11:37   #9
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I got the JBL GTO 607C components for 5k. These are 6.5". Components come with a mid-woofer, a tweeter and a cross-over box. These went into my front doors (have an Aveo U-VA). Although a lot of installers said a 6.5" could not be fitted in the U-VA, I could finally get it done from one.

For the rear, the guy reinforced the existing flimsy parcel tray with a wooden panel and covered it up with flannel. A standard set of 6" speakers (no coax.) went on the pacel tray. I had these from the stock setup, did not want to spend more right now and am the only person in the car most of the time.
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Old 11th February 2009, 12:57   #10
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A friend of mine , 200mph tried fitting 6" speakers using spacer rings, but couldnt. 5" was the max he could do. you may be able to fit 6"ers if you cut the door panels , but that might cause you to lose you warranty, and i dont think most people like to have the door panels cut up. since you are un pune , try out illusions audio speakers too. poona motors should have them in stock.
@Greenhorn: 1)Does your freind 200mph has a indica vista, where he tried to fit 6" in the front doors, or some other car?
2)Why do you prefer config 2 any reasons over config 1? I thought a 5" would give more effect than a 4" and 5" can be fit only on the front door.Is there any disadvantage of fitting on the front door over fitment in the dashboard?
3) Why did u scrap my idea of using only components (in the front doors&dash) and nothing else?Any reasons?
4)I tried my best to defend the boot space but it seems there is no other option rather than to compromise on it by using a MDF Tray.I think it will give superior sound quality thats why you recommend me such an option over simple coaxials in rear doors.
Thank you again for your valuable advice.
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Old 14th February 2009, 12:43   #11
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Default A sub + Amp for th Vista

I am planning to get the ICE done for my sister's Vista Aura as the factory fitted one falls short on reproducing the lower end of the audible audio spectrum.

Here are my requirements

1) I am looking at putting an Amp and a sub Only( Not inclined towards bass tube)
2) The sub should not be placed in the boot thanks to the small boot. I read somewhere that the space below the passenget seat can be used. Is it a good location??
3) Budget is 8-10 K including everything

I am looking at a setup which would gel with the existing system. It should sound decent at all frequencies at the end of it.

I know touqeer/ Anwar (bangalore guys...they did the ice on our Swift) from whom will get the setup done but need some options on speaker/ Amp/ Cabling options. Should i buy it from other places or get it from Toqueer

ICE gurus and those who have done ICE on your Vistas please share your experiences and suggestions.

Regds
Muni
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Old 14th February 2009, 12:59   #12
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Originally Posted by muni View Post
2) The sub should not be placed in the boot thanks to the small boot. I read somewhere that the space below the passenget seat can be used. Is it a good location??
I am sorry but I dont think there is enough room under the passenger seat to accommodate a Sub. I guess you are confused between the amp and sub, when it comes to the passenger seat.

Anyone has pics of subs in places other than the boot ?
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Old 14th February 2009, 13:16   #13
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@FH, details of under-seat sub in a Swift. No pics though: https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/ask-g...tml#post724942

Gunbir had posted pics of an install of two 8" IDQ subs under the front seats of an Innova here: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/sound-...a-install.html
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Old 14th February 2009, 18:02   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_purohit20 View Post
@Greenhorn: 1)Does your freind 200mph has a indica vista, where he tried to fit 6" in the front doors, or some other car?
Yes of course he has a vista. why would i post his experience with some other car here? I believe he tried it in the front door
Quote:
2)Why do you prefer config 2 any reasons over config 1? I thought a 5" would give more effect than a 4" and 5" can be fit only on the front door.Is there any disadvantage of fitting on the front door over fitment in the dashboard?
a door fitment means that your legs will be listening to the mids and the highs. your legs do not have ears. your head does. hence you want them coming from somewhere higher up. thats why the 4" coax in the dash.On the other hand , if you are willing to sacrifice clarity for an all out bass setup ( which I wouldnt , and hence my choice of 2 over 1) get option 1. it will also be more expensive.
Quote:
3) Why did u scrap my idea of using only components (in the front doors&dash) and nothing else?Any reasons?
this would be the other extreme, choosing an all out clarity setup, without much bass. I want SOME bass. I drove around with just my front speakers for a while till i got my MDF tray made, and while the clarity was good , there was not much bass.
Quote:
4)I tried my best to defend the boot space but it seems there is no other option rather than to compromise on it by using a MDF Tray.I think it will give superior sound quality thats why you recommend me such an option over simple coaxials in rear doors.
you wont get much bass from putting speakers in the doors, and again the problem I mentioned for choosing 2 over 1 will be present here too. putting them in the dash means you can listen to the vocals and highs clearly. using an MDF tray does not waste THAT much space.
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Old 14th February 2009, 20:32   #15
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Default Rear Tray speaker sound unbearable to rear seat persons

Thanks GreenHorn for all your valuable suggestions.
Now I have one more reason why not to go for 6x9" on tray. One of my friend told me that by fitting on tray the sound would be louder to the persons who sit on the rear(my parents who would not like that loud sound). To get the effect of the rear speakers one needs to increase the volume so that the driver can feel that, but by this time it becomes quite unbearable to the passengers on the rear seat. Whats your say on this? If i were ready to sacrifice some amount of bass for the above reason what config you suggest?
1) 5.25" Coaxials in front and rear doors and a 4" coaxial in the dash?
2) I asked one accessory guy he told me that a 4" coaxial can not be fit on the dash because the speaker top interferes with the dash board.I mean the height of the speaker is the problem now and not the diameter.Do you have any idea of it? Has 200mph put 4" coaxials in his dash?
Again thanks a lot for your answers.
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