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Old 11th August 2009, 18:06   #46
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Originally Posted by Autophile View Post
The fiesta stock locations accept 5 X 7" speakers. Putting the bigger speaker is of no use as the grill / perforation in the door pad is quite small which will restrict the drivers output.

im about to make a decision. can the gurus care to explain this one to me, further in detail. How much of a difference does it make if we mount 6.5 inchers this way?
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Old 11th August 2009, 18:15   #47
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Originally Posted by Autophile View Post
I was talking about putting a pair of coaxials in the rear parcel shelf and feed them little power (fader can be used). It really helps in centering the front image which other wise is not great.

It is car dependent so it can work in one car but might not work in another. Hope it helps.
I experienced something similar in a Friend's Scorpio with coaxes in the front doors and 6X9s on the inside of the rear hatch door.

The rear fill really helped raise the stage and centre the image, when I turned the rear fill off using the HU fader, the stage collapsed to knee-level and the centre image pretty much disappeared as well.
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Old 11th August 2009, 18:45   #48
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Default Coax at Rear?

Just like add, With the right amount of gain, frequency, TA, rear coax/ speakers may help to have wide front sound stage. But, as we all know in concerts the music comes from front but it's wide. Whereas in cars especially smaller cars like hatchback and mid size sedans, with speakers mounted in lower part of doors, completely off axis, the sound coming may sound a bit narrow though it may be coming off well from center with the use of TA.
I have been using rear coax in Fabia with frequencies where I only get mids running from 200hz to 5khz. With right amount of gain and with TA it improves the vocals much better, gives wider image, giving the feeling of it coming from center of dash but high up. When I crossed it lower to 80, 100hz adding more lower freq, it pulled my midbass a bit to rear which can give more confused sound same goes for higher freq.
Cutting at 5khz takes care of the vocal part.

Last 15years I have been using rear speakers with fronts. In some cars it does work well on parcel shelf in some on rear doors. Speakers on parcel shelf always tend to sound brighter due to the reflection but if installed just the mids it could give the perception of sound coming from every corner/part of rear windshield. In an esteem in 98' we had tried it with a 2 way ovals where we cut of the tweeter, receiving only mids upto 4khz and it worked brilliantly. I did use that similar setup on 3 other car including a Zen, and somehow the Zen gave better results than the other two sedan. I guess all due to the angle of rear windshield that played the role.

Having rears or not is completely a personal choice. If not tuned correctly it could have adverse effect either pulling the stage to bit at rear or the vocals in front could sound a bit muffled. In some having only front setup could sound excellent, its the vehicle's acoustics that plays more important role.

Last edited by Invinsible : 11th August 2009 at 19:01.
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Old 11th August 2009, 19:11   #49
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im about to make a decision. can the gurus care to explain this one to me, further in detail. How much of a difference does it make if we mount 6.5 inchers this way?
Why dont you get the exact measurement of the grill/perforation part on the door panel? I don't think it should make much of noticeable difference.
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Old 11th August 2009, 20:55   #50
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i have posted this in the fiesta thread. waiting for reports. if no one posts, i will post it when I take the measurement on my car itself. Till that time an impending upgrade on the components are postponed.
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Old 12th August 2009, 17:43   #51
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Originally Posted by Invinsible View Post
Why dont you get the exact measurement of the grill/perforation part on the door panel? I don't think it should make much of noticeable difference.
I've actually had someone measure this.
There would be a significant difference between 6.5s and 5x7s in the fiesta, although the area is somewhat similar. The doorpad grill would make all the difference.
FM, whats ur plan?
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Old 12th August 2009, 17:45   #52
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ive decided to persist with the 6.5's till I actually feel the grille is the problem. I really feel it's not going to make SUCH a large difference, since the 6.5 can be placed more centrally to the grille by adjusting the spacer shape and position.


From what i have read, 5*7's JUST cannot match up to the performance of the 6.5 inchers. The door pad grille will be a slight deterrent. But let's see how much it is, in actuality.

Last edited by frankmehta : 12th August 2009 at 17:49.
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Old 13th August 2009, 11:10   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Autophile View Post
The fiesta stock locations accept 5 X 7" speakers. Putting the bigger speaker is of no use as the grill / perforation in the door pad is quite small which will restrict the drivers output.
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankmehta View Post
ive decided to persist with the 6.5's till I actually feel the grille is the problem.
Frank I think you are on the right track. The grill might be a very small obstruction and that might be resolved using a spacer.Remember the radiation surface of the misbass is the cone and there is little or no radiation from the surround so if you see the entire cone through the grill you should have no problem,

Yes since there are many more 6.5" woofers out there than 5x7 you will have amny more driver options as well as some nice long throw drivers at your disposal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Invinsible View Post
Speakers on parcel shelf always tend to sound brighter

I guess all due to the angle of rear windshield that played the role.
A speaker on a rear parcel shelf will reflect off the rear glass and the output will be less off axis (especially if you include some angled spacers thereby directing the speaker more towards the front). Speakers on the rear door are very off axis and component tweeters in the rear door might be too close to the ears of the front passenger.
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Old 13th August 2009, 14:37   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
A speaker on a rear parcel shelf will reflect off the rear glass and the output will be less off axis (especially if you include some angled spacers thereby directing the speaker more towards the front). Speakers on the rear door are very off axis and component tweeters in the rear door might be too close to the ears of the front passenger.
Well the zen that we did about 11yrs back we could tell the difference as to which location sounded better. Anyways that was than. As of now talking about rear coax / speakers on doors well it depends on where it is mounted on doors, driving position, and PLD. The PLD for me in my current setup, Fabia where the coax is mounted at OE location the PLD is very minimal, the rear coax is close to ear by just 7cms compared to the front midbass, even left rear coax is close by just 5cms compared to the front left midbass. Now if change my driving position this would result in more or less.
If I install the coax on rear parcel tray the PLD will be -15-18 cms where the coax will be far off than front midbass.
As long as the PLD is at minimal, applaying TA on them with gain setting at 75% of front, gives better result., atleast in my case. Also, I did mention they playing just the mid freq, nothing above 5khz. Reflection happens all around not just front or rear windscreen. It's just windscreen reflection can be more audible than other minor reflection that happen around.
Am not mearly using rear coax as fillers but they also clean up my front vocals, and lifts the stage high up. I could only achieve this from hours of tuning. Even a bit of difference here n there in setting your rears could throw one's image haywire.
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Old 13th August 2009, 15:18   #55
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There are hardly any options in the 5x7 compared to the 6.5".
Good choice Frank.
Your luccents sound amazing and i don't think you need an upgrade.

Do fiddle with the tweeter position in the fiesta, the acoustics would be different that the swift. ( maybe you can get something better than before)
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Old 13th August 2009, 16:44   #56
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@ invinsible: for the timebeing, a rear stage is being ignored.

@ abhinav: yes man. 5*7's hardly ever end up sounding as good as 6.5's. I would stick to my loving Luccents for longer. I love them. maybe a tweeter upgrade in a few months, but yes, the front stage and the sub stage is final. Which means we can now talk about the install!
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Old 26th August 2009, 23:33   #57
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Finally....
I now have my entire setup planned out. The new stuff is going to start trickling in soon, and within 2 weeks, I plan to start putting the equipment in.
Before that, the car will be damped and the FG Subwoofer enclosure will be installed. Amp racks etc. are also in the pipeline, but I shall make my final call when Ajay gives me his suggestions.

The final equipment measures up to this:

Head Unit: Eclipse CD7200MKII (no changing that one, she's for keeps)

Front Stage:
---Speakers: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (which means, you gotta GAS)
---Amplifier: DLS RA20 supplying 120W of RMS power to each side (this amp has got me to change my ENTIRE equipment single-handedly. It's one of the best amplifiers in the world right now. Not kidding. Some say, it sounds better than even the Flagship Tube amps and the (lesser than Tube) Ultimate Series from DLS!!! Not kidding!!)


Sub Stage:
----Subwoofer: JBL W12GTi in a 1 cu. ft. sealed enclosure (expect some classic sound quality from this combination)
----Amplifier: Clarion DPX11551 (1551*1 @ 2 ohms. Need I say anything more?)

Wiring:
----Mono: Polycab 0 Gauge
----2 Channel: Polycab 4 Gauge (yet to be purchased)


RCAs: Monster XLN Pros (from the earlier installation)


Phew. That's it.

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

WAIT.
What's this? (XXXXXXXXXXX)

















Watch this space for details.
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Old 26th August 2009, 23:45   #58
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waiting for the XXXXXXXXXXX to be filled in. Are those the same brand you told me through PM?? Dont worry i wont leak it if it so.
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Old 26th August 2009, 23:47   #59
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yep. you're right. But a slightly (lol) bumped up version of the same.
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Old 27th August 2009, 00:37   #60
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Hmmm nice. Cant wait to see it.
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