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Old 15th December 2005, 15:48   #2596
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Originally Posted by rsjaurr
Sam, some lotions do work on sunburns.
Sam on a serious note. when i was sailing and got burnt we'd use Vitamin E cream. It helped heal faster. Sun tan lotion is useless after the burn.

as sailors we prefer to use oil free lotions as the rops will slip if your hands are oily. and oil free, water proof lotions did not exist in those days. even today most oil free lotions are barely water resistant leave alone water proof.

BTW you need more sun tan protection in the hills esp when you are skiing or on snowy slopes. the sun's reflection off the snow halves the time it takes to get burnt.

Lastly I am off to Singapura. We'll be back Jan 4th. See you guys Jan 5th.

Last edited by navin : 15th December 2005 at 15:53.
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Old 15th December 2005, 15:59   #2597
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next step Sam is to get Doc to modify the XO's of the speakers. after that we convice him to replace the amp with a EL34 PP Class AB1 Triode 15W amp.

PP becuase SE in a car is insane. and AB1 to keep the heat down. you see I am actually serious about this. I am importing 4 custom OPTs from Singapore (S$150 each) for my amp.

navin everything went over my head...nothing through or into it.

And lets hope one day i will install this stuff[or even beter] but not in getz,in some other 'BIIIIIG' car.[if i get immigration nod.]

now guys plz come to real topic and do enrich me with ur knowledge.
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Old 15th December 2005, 16:14   #2598
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navin everything went over my head...nothing through or into it. now guys plz come to real topic and do enrich me with ur knowledge.
dont worry Doc most of what I say is garbage. Mostly to entertain myself.

as far as knowledge goes, i'll quote sting...
...I have only come here seeking knowledge
Things they wouldn’t teach me of in college...
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Old 15th December 2005, 17:08   #2599
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a) both speakers.
b) the mathematical equation is F = 1/(2 Pi RC) where R is the speaker impedance.
c) as far as dynamat oes if there is no bass there will be no bass resonace. simple. remember dont do this if you dont have a sub or the system will sound bright as you'd have lost much of the bass. if you dont have a sub leave this out and use dynamat.

f=1/(2*pi*R*C)
R=4ohm
C=235 X 10 to power -6 Farad (for first case ie two capacitors of 470uF back-to-back)

this gives f~170Hz ??? aint its too high

For my rear speaker(JBL CS256e) having frequency spectrum 55Hz-20kHz
I think the crossover point should be kept around 55Hz, correct me if i 'm wrong?

If correct than what should be the value of Capcacitors?

one more question Navin!
what is the significance of connecting two electrolytic capacitors of value C bk-to-bk to make a non-polar capacitor of value= C/2
why don't we use a capacitor of that value itself?
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Old 15th December 2005, 18:49   #2600
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Shrey its always nice to gain some knowledge but using it on ur own system may be harmful for guys like u and me.
As navin has pointed u,dont do it if u dont have subw and i suppose u dont have one.

So just set ur amp's all channels to high pass filter and enjoy ur music.
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Old 15th December 2005, 19:20   #2601
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Originally Posted by Shrey
this gives f~170Hz ??? aint its too high

For my rear speaker(JBL CS256e) having frequency spectrum 55Hz-20kHz
I think the crossover point should be kept around 55Hz, correct me if i 'm wrong?

If correct than what should be the value of Capcacitors?

one more question Navin!
what is the significance of connecting two electrolytic capacitors of value C bk-to-bk to make a non-polar capacitor of value= C/2
why don't we use a capacitor of that value itself?
ok the filter is a 6db filter which is very shallow. this filter will be only 3db down at 170Hz and at about 10db down at 50Hz. now that is correct. you need this level of filtering to make any significant difference.

if you XO at 55hz you wont be solving your problem unless you use a high order filter which comes with it's own problems (cost, phase, etc). do the math for a filter at 50hz and you'll see the size of caps you need.

the idea of using 2 caps back to back is that you really need a non polar cap in this ckt. but non polar caps of this value are expensive. so you use electrolytic as they are cheaper. the 2uf bypass cap improves the sound quality. remember standard caps have a tolerance of 10% so 2uf is no signifcant capacitance in this picture.
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Old 16th December 2005, 00:26   #2602
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hey guys
please suggest something here !

My friend has installed the following setup in his Indigo.
Pioneer 6991 rears, Boss 4 inch fronts, Boss Ripper 12" Amp and Desi Alpine 4 channel Amp.
he says that everything is on Amp, the rears and the fronts are bridged together and the sub if on the leftover 2 channels.
Do you recommend this kind of setup? or shud I run fronts on Unit and Rears and Amp on a 4 channel Amp. How shud It be configured?

Guys also suggest a cheap but good sounding sub and 4 channel Amp. This will be installed in matiz, will sub sound better on tray or in a box in the boot?

I am really concerned abt spending money - I need the sub with the thumpy bass and not too much of ripple effect that will shake the passengers. kindly suggest. Also how shud the setup be done?

Last edited by zzzehar : 16th December 2005 at 00:39.
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Old 16th December 2005, 02:51   #2603
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Originally Posted by zzzehar
hey guys
please suggest something here !

My friend has installed the following setup in his Indigo.
Pioneer 6991 rears, Boss 4 inch fronts, Boss Ripper 12" Amp and Desi Alpine 4 channel Amp.
he says that everything is on Amp, the rears and the fronts are bridged together and the sub if on the leftover 2 channels.
Do you recommend this kind of setup? or shud I run fronts on Unit and Rears and Amp on a 4 channel Amp. How shud It be configured?

Guys also suggest a cheap but good sounding sub and 4 channel Amp. This will be installed in matiz, will sub sound better on tray or in a box in the boot?

I am really concerned abt spending money - I need the sub with the thumpy bass and not too much of ripple effect that will shake the passengers. kindly suggest. Also how shud the setup be done?
desi alpine amp as in a fake one ?? best would be to run the fronts and the sub on the amp and use the HU for the rears..ya fade to the front until u get a good balance wherein ur rears are just but audible..

as for ur matiz id still suggest pio 6100 amp at 7.5k to be the best bet..as for the sub u can choose with whatever money ur left over with..and stick to the box unless u want to shake ur whole car up..
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Old 16th December 2005, 02:55   #2604
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885
desi alpine amp as in a fake one ?? best would be to run the fronts and the sub on the amp and use the HU for the rears..ya fade to the front until u get a good balance wherein ur rears are just but audible..

as for ur matiz id still suggest pio 6100 amp at 7.5k to be the best bet..as for the sub u can choose with whatever money ur left over with..and stick to the box unless u want to shake ur whole car up..

Someone told me that you rears also need the amp to be driven to their true output. is that correct? Boss claims them to be outputting 250 W RMS and 500 W Peak - what do you guys say?
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Old 16th December 2005, 03:12   #2605
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Originally Posted by zzzehar
Someone told me that you rears also need the amp to be driven to their true output. is that correct? Boss claims them to be outputting 250 W RMS and 500 W Peak - what do you guys say?
well that would something to think about if at all ur using ur 6x9's as the rears without a sub..as ur using ur rears as just fillers its quite ok to run them of the HU..well the RMS figures dont say all about the sub..

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 16th December 2005 at 03:13.
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Old 16th December 2005, 03:20   #2606
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885
well that would something to think about if at all ur using ur 6x9's as the rears without a sub..as ur using ur rears as just fillers its quite ok to run them of the HU..well the RMS figures dont say all about the sub..
I have a different post in my email, It seems as if you edited it.
Could you please explain how to calculate the power distribution? As of now, I am running my 6x9's on the HU Pioneer 3750. The output is quite Ok, they are able to shake my rear seat and at times my front seats as well, with the volume around 40-41.
I want to drain the maximum power with clarity from sub as well as rears and fronts. Kindly suggest as I am really dumbo in these specs. Thank you.

Last edited by zzzehar : 16th December 2005 at 03:24.
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Old 16th December 2005, 03:28   #2607
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Originally Posted by zzzehar
I have a different post in my email, It seems as if you edited it.
Could you please explain how to calculate the power distribution? As of now, I am running my 6x9's on the HU Pioneer 3750. The output is quite Ok, they are able to shake my rear seat and at times my front seats as well, with the volume around 40-41.
I want to drain the maximum power with clarity from sub as well as rears and fronts. Kindly suggets as I am really dumbo in these specs. Thank you.
well ya my post is edited as i thought the RMS specs u gave were for the amp..power distribution ?? i didnt quite get that question..best way to get clarity from ur setup would be as i suggested earlier..remember if possible u could also use a bass blocker for ur rears to prevent the excessive lows..as ur 6x9's effictively are nothing but 2 8'' subs..add to that another sub and all u get in return is headache..simple setup would be good fronts,rears as fillers,and a sub to give u the lows..given the number of channels on the amp configure how u want to set it up..preferably run ur fronts and the sub from the amp if its capable of handling 4 channels..
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Old 16th December 2005, 04:06   #2608
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885
well ya my post is edited as i thought the RMS specs u gave were for the amp..power distribution ?? i didnt quite get that question..best way to get clarity from ur setup would be as i suggested earlier..remember if possible u could also use a bass blocker for ur rears to prevent the excessive lows..as ur 6x9's effictively are nothing but 2 8'' subs..add to that another sub and all u get in return is headache..simple setup would be good fronts,rears as fillers,and a sub to give u the lows..given the number of channels on the amp configure how u want to set it up..preferably run ur fronts and the sub from the amp if its capable of handling 4 channels..
Now you are making me feel bad abt the money I spent on the rears. I got them for Rs 4200 with B&W and that too after lots and lots of testing and time input. How abt something else where I can put my rears to use? I hope u understand that how bad it feels after spending a lot and using them as fillers. Anyways I will do that but still, do you recommend running 4 inchers on Amp, will they give enough output?
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Old 16th December 2005, 10:26   #2609
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
ok the filter is a 6db filter which is very shallow. this filter will be only 3db down at 170Hz and at about 10db down at 50Hz. now that is correct. you need this level of filtering to make any significant difference.

if you XO at 55hz you wont be solving your problem unless you use a high order filter which comes with it's own problems (cost, phase, etc). do the math for a filter at 50hz and you'll see the size of caps you need.

the idea of using 2 caps back to back is that you really need a non polar cap in this ckt. but non polar caps of this value are expensive. so you use electrolytic as they are cheaper. the 2uf bypass cap improves the sound quality. remember standard caps have a tolerance of 10% so 2uf is no signifcant capacitance in this picture.

Ok Now consider the scenario where i connect 3 such non-polar capacitors of value 235uF(made out by connecting two 470uF cap. bk-to-bk), the equivalent capacitance will be 705uF, and calculating the frequency it comes out to be f=56Hz approx ? taking R=4ohm

how does this bass blocker work,(or if its feasible at all?) how much a 470uF electrolytic cap costs?

How do we acheive a deep filter(not shallow), i mean 12dB/octave or more?

Lastly, what does the bypass capacitors do(and How)? you can explain me in as much detail, because you are moderator now, and nobody will object to your highly technical response.
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Old 16th December 2005, 11:08   #2610
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zzzehar,

Firstly let me say that i understand that everyone has a budget. I was a poor starving student too (really starving - i can remember days when i had no money for dinner).

Given that one thing one should keep in mind. 2 good speakers will sound better than 4 bad ones. A good HU will sound better (if less loud) than a lesser HU and a poor amp.

now to see what we can salvage of this...
My friend has installed the following setup in his Indigo.
Pioneer 6991 rears, Boss 4 inch fronts, Boss Ripper 12" Amp and Desi Alpine 4 channel Amp.


I assume the Ripper a Subwoofer not an amp.

With this setup the 4" boss fronts will be virtually not heard esp since the 6991 are in parallel with them (so you cant fade them down). The 6991 will be helped by the 12" Ripper.

what i would do...

1. make sure the HU allow you to use the rear speaker out and line level out at the same time and your sub as a LP filter for atleast the rear.
2. then run the front BOSS and Sub (2 ch. bridged) of the amp (front and rear line level out)
3. run the 6991 from the HU. the 6991 is the most efficeint of these speakers. it requires the least power.
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