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Old 23rd June 2006, 14:08   #3706
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi
Isn't that a tape player?
yes. It is. Thingy works fine though.
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Old 23rd June 2006, 18:36   #3707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
If B&T is following this thread...I'd like to see a midbass with a edge wound voicecoil, copper shroting ring, vented pole piece, NdFeb magnet system with the coil outside the magnet system coil dia = 1/2 cone dia, single spider till 6" and dual spider for 8"+, Butyl half roll high damping surround, cast or moulded frame, etc...
Navin, I am mentioning the following driver from Illusion Audio because it is used for car audio, although there are several other home hi-fi drivers that Peerless makes that would be a closer match.

Illusion Nd series drivers: (aka The Carbon Series)

1. Edge wound, flat-wire, high-temperature, low inductance voice coil.

2. The motor uses an aluminium support tube which doubles up as a pole piece. This sorts out the impedance, although not as efficiently as a copper shorting ring would, due to lower conductivity. No copper shorting ring possible since the driver employs a inverted Nd motor, open-gap design. Only way out is to construct the U-pot (in this case, it doubles as the top-plate) of the motor in copper. However, the product designer was of the opinion that the driver did not show significantly worrying impedance irregularities to incorporate this.

3. One step ahead of the vented pole piece cooling design is the patented open-gap motor. The v/c is not only vented due to construction, it is also vented to the front of the driver rather than the back so as to allow fresh air to continuously cool the driver rather than the warmed air in the enclosure.

4. If the v/c dia on the driver is increased to any larger, the magnet will become large enough to completely cover the front radiating surface of the cone. Illusion drivers cannot use voice coil sizes like the Dynes etc. The 6" still use upto 40-50 mm dia coils, and the largest 15s etc use 3-4" coils. Larger than average, permitting above-average thermal power handling, but not oversized. 65-80mm voice coils would leave very little exposed radiating area.

5. All Illusion drivers were intended for shallow mounting application. Although they are drivers with longest throws for a particular power handling and size, the geometry of the driver will not permit a second spider to be added unless it is incorporated in the front of the subwoofer (somewhat like Strokers). The advantage of the geometry is that the center of gravity of the moving parts is quite vertically centralized due to the inverted voice coil, hence multi-point centering can be easily avoided, and using a progressive spider keeps the excursion in check, and linear. As you would agree, it is difficult to have dual spiders for most neo-based drivers, inverted or not.

6. All inverted motor Illusion drivers use die-cast Aluminium baskets, and symmetrical half-roll, butyl rubber surrounds. The latter is pretty much mandatory for any good car audio speaker, I would think. The overall weight of the driver is very low due to the Nd magnet, plus the magnet isn't directly bolted to the basket. hence the basket uses multiple thin ribs/ spokes. These minimize interference with the back wave and there is no question of ringing. I am sometimes disgusted when subwoofer drivers with a power handling of over 400W rms use stamped steel baskets. They should listen to those guys with the driver mounted upside down. Just in case, this matters, although you didn't bring it up, the spider is vented on the top and bottom too. Most manufacturers overlook this aspect. It causes drivers to behave non-linearly due to pressure build-ups in the chamber.

7. In addition it uses a super light and rigid carbon fiber cone. The drivers do not use mass loading like all other major SQ subwoofer manufacturers do, to lower Fs at the expense of sensitivity. Add to that, the advantages of having a narrow gap, and a neo motor with practically no flux leakage and the driver easily boasts efficiencies atleast 6dB higher than most conventional drivers. Even in 'in-car' scenarios, they suffer zero flux loss to adjacent metal body parts, which is unavoidable with all other conventional driver formats. They wouldn't handle as much power as some 12W7s etc, but with a 95 dB sensitivity and 400W rms of power handling (for a 12), it doesn't leave much to be desired for SQL buffs. Sure, if you're the dB drag types, you should feel most obliged to buy DD Audio and some earmuffs.
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Old 23rd June 2006, 19:19   #3708
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VVVVery techinal stuff here had to read twice to understand that but very good keep it up B&T u will surely get butter chicken for that........
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Old 23rd June 2006, 19:36   #3709
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B&T what do they cost?

besides I am not very happy with the magnet in the front unless it was shaped like a phase plug.

in any case what do they cost in India? As much as KB's amp I guess!
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Old 23rd June 2006, 20:49   #3710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
B&T what do they cost?

besides I am not very happy with the magnet in the front unless it was shaped like a phase plug.

in any case what do they cost in India? As much as KB's amp I guess!
For the price of kb's amp, you would get exactly 4 pairs of 6" Carbon component sets, or nearly 10 pairs of the Luccent series 6" comps which use all the same technologies, but use a PP cone, have slightly lower power handling and a standard 1" neo, silk-dome tweeter which is not low resonance frequency like the Carbon. Hence they also use a different crossover.

The magnet in front surprisingly does not alter the response much, although it isn't a solid phase plug by any stretch of imagination. The carbon series uses a damping rubber ring on the magnet to remove resonances. There are some drivers that use a phase plug of the Illusion magnet shape, but in this case, it's mounted way too far from the cone to function as one.
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Old 23rd June 2006, 20:51   #3711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by low_bass_makker
VVVVery techinal stuff here had to read twice to understand that but very good keep it up B&T u will surely get butter chicken for that........
If it took you only two readings to understand, who deserves the butter chicken?

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Old 23rd June 2006, 21:54   #3712
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble
For the price of kb's amp,
GOOD LORD.... I AM getting FAMOUS!!... and so is my amp!!... becomes a POR (Point of Reference) of guru's on this forum!!..

Kb ka dB making Dhamaal even before it gets a opportunity to get installed!
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Old 23rd June 2006, 22:55   #3713
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What you expect KB?
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Old 24th June 2006, 00:25   #3714
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
What you expect KB?
?? expect??


Nothing at all!!.. Good sound I hope... And hopefully something worth hanging on to as I got one those hand made ones signed by J.W Fairchild himself!

Last edited by kb100 : 24th June 2006 at 00:31.
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Old 24th June 2006, 09:54   #3715
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KB, I meant to say how do expect not to be famous when you got amps that most here would die for. THat is why I would love for you to get speakers that can do them justice. I am begining to think that only a HU like a Becker or the Clarion HX D2 and VDH/Kimber Cable might help fully extract every onuce of music these amp should produce.

I say "should" becuase I have not heard these amps but they should be atleast twice as good as any 20-30K amps and those are pretty good too.
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Old 24th June 2006, 15:11   #3716
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin
KB, I meant to say how do expect not to be famous when you got amps that most here would die for. THat is why I would love for you to get speakers that can do them justice. I am begining to think that only a HU like a Becker or the Clarion HX D2 and VDH/Kimber Cable might help fully extract every onuce of music these amp should produce.

I say "should" becuase I have not heard these amps but they should be atleast twice as good as any 20-30K amps and those are pretty good too.
Hmm, yeah. I completely second Navin on this one. Minimum VDH or Kimber for interconnects and speaker wiring. You can't compromise on wiring for this setup.

For mains, use good quality 1/0 ga cable to take care of all amps. For power, it's better to go overkill than to run close to optimum and then fall short since Gunbir says the specs on the amp are deceivingly underrated, and it's always useful in the face of a future upgrade.
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Old 24th June 2006, 17:53   #3717
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KB, I can help you with cabling ok? lemme know.
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Old 24th June 2006, 18:53   #3718
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Can anyone suggest a good and qualified car audio installer at Kolkata for my Santro. I don't mind paying higher but I expect the best quality job done. Or should I approach Hyundai dealer to get the job done.



I'm comming to Kolkata on 16th and wish to get the job done right away.




Guys plz suggest.
Tnx in advance....
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Old 24th June 2006, 20:06   #3719
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delu
Can anyone suggest a good and qualified car audio installer at Kolkata for my Santro. I don't mind paying higher but I expect the best quality job done. Or should I approach Hyundai dealer to get the job done.



I'm comming to Kolkata on 16th and wish to get the job done right away.




Guys plz suggest.
Tnx in advance....
I dont know any installers in Kolkata. I do know that i held a training session for west bengal Hyundai dealers in Darjeeling and there were a lot of them from Kolkata. Ask them about the drinking and dancing in darjeeling and that fuuny guy with the long hair

Seriously though, I think you can ask Mr. Golcha at Slverline Kolkata. I dont have the number at hand but you can find it at the back of an autocar magazine.
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Old 24th June 2006, 22:18   #3720
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi
KB, I can help you with cabling ok? lemme know.
you wanna do teh cabling?
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