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Old 6th December 2006, 11:52   #4756
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Other JBL customers may want to beat him up for stealing their stickers...
You actually went thru the entire posts?... this was posted nearly 1 year back... to be precise on page #74....
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Old 6th December 2006, 12:56   #4757
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Originally Posted by Autophile View Post
And Dual Concentric is a trade mark of Tannoy's properietory driver technology, not a generic category of transducers.

More over Tannoy Dual Concentrics are phase/time aligned.
I don't know what you mean by trade mark, because I have never seen 'TM' next to the words "Dual Concentric" ever. Manufacturers like flaunting that, and also helps prevent other manufacturers from cashing on their technology. And if it's an exclusive technology patented by Tannoy, then that has also not been evident from rampant usage of the same technology by other manufacturers without any mention of the patent, or it being a licensee of the technology from Tannoy.

Fundamentally, dual concentric drivers are also coaxials.
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Old 6th December 2006, 16:24   #4758
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I don't know what you mean by trade mark, because I have never seen 'TM' next to the words "Dual Concentric" ever. Manufacturers like flaunting that, and also helps prevent other manufacturers from cashing on their technology. And if it's an exclusive technology patented by Tannoy, then that has also not been evident from rampant usage of the same technology by other manufacturers without any mention of the patent, or it being a licensee of the technology from Tannoy.
I dont think you've really studied the Tannoy Dual Concentric design in depth. It isnt just a matter of coaxially mounting a tweeter with the midbass. Dual Concentric is a true point source, where the emission center's of both HF and LF drivers are absolutely concentric on the same plane (X and Y, no Z). Whereas in case of the imitations, or so called dual concentrics there emission points, though concentric, dont share the same plane. Hence they arent time or phase aligned physically. Further, in Tannoys, the tweeter sits behind a wave guide which further uses LF cone as a larger wave guide. This achieves seamless point source sound reproduction, which is only claimed by others.

So, I wouldnt call the others Dual Concentric, especially since "Dual Concentric" is indeed a Tannoy trade mark.
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Old 6th December 2006, 20:30   #4759
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Originally Posted by gunbir View Post
I dont think you've really studied the Tannoy Dual Concentric design in depth. It isnt just a matter of coaxially mounting a tweeter with the midbass. Dual Concentric is a true point source, where the emission center's of both HF and LF drivers are absolutely concentric on the same plane (X and Y, no Z). Whereas in case of the imitations, or so called dual concentrics there emission points, though concentric, dont share the same plane. Hence they arent time or phase aligned physically. Further, in Tannoys, the tweeter sits behind a wave guide which further uses LF cone as a larger wave guide. This achieves seamless point source sound reproduction, which is only claimed by others.

So, I wouldnt call the others Dual Concentric, especially since "Dual Concentric" is indeed a Tannoy trade mark.
You make a very good case for Tannoy, but reality is that everyone calls their dual concentric drivers, dual concentric. That's all I was talking about.
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Old 6th December 2006, 20:43   #4760
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Originally Posted by Bass&Trouble View Post
... everyone calls their dual concentric drivers, dual concentric.
Its probably like people referring to all photocopying as Xeroxing and all photocopiers as Xerox machines. Over time, the special function/unique feature becomes a generic name for the whole general category (which is usually good for the person who invented/discovered/made it in the first place).
End of marketingspeak.
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Old 7th December 2006, 12:22   #4761
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You make a very good case for Tannoy, but reality is that everyone calls their dual concentric drivers, dual concentric. That's all I was talking about.
Tannoy is one of the oldest surviving and successful loudspeaker manufacturing company with its expertise in the area of residential, studio and pro sound reinforcement. The other brand is JBL.

Tannoy over the period of almost 80 years has developed lot of technologies and designs which were unique and original like ICT, wideband, dual concentric, tulip waveguide, pepper pot, HE surrounds etc. etc.

Dual concentric was infact a patent with Tannoy Ltd. until it expired in 2005. Now since last year lot of companies are using this design and nomenclature as it is open for everyone. eg. L Acoustics also call their similar driver "Dual Concentric"
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Old 7th December 2006, 15:34   #4762
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Ok guys this is one of the weirdest things I've seen in recent times. My friend had bought a Verna and on my suggestion went to get a setup done. Unfortunately the installer is a relative of his so he couldn't supervise much of the install & the following stuff was installed:

Velocity VPc172 components
JBL GTO 937
Pioneer 6850

Now when I checked the setup out I find that an inductor & another black object (don't know the technical name!) have been tied to the 937's with tape. I couldn't understand why so I took a few pictures for you guys to see.

The two parts in question







Now two questions arise.

1. What is this intended to do?
2. The setup has a problem that the 937's on being played at high bass levels are making a jarring sound as if it's grille is striking something. Now the Verna has 6"X9" pods in the back so no cutting has been performed. But I could not understand the reason for the jarring, I even tried it after turning down the Bass in the EQ but it remains.

Sam/B&T/Navin/Gunbir can you clear this up please?

Last edited by iraghava : 7th December 2006 at 15:38.
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Old 7th December 2006, 15:45   #4763
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LOL, it's not stuck with tape yaar.It's part of every GTO937. That is the passive crossover.

You got me all excited and now I realise what you were talking about.

Baaki bacha the vibrations could be cause by the speaker touching a metal portion. I suspect the installation can be improved a bit.
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Old 7th December 2006, 16:03   #4764
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GTO937s have a tweeter attenuator. Some kind of push switch placed between the mid and the tweeter on the speaker that you push to contorl the highs. The contraption on the speaker probably has something to do with that. Sam?

Rags, I guess there isn't an amp in the setup, right? So it can't be a problem with the gains settings.

Do both the rear speakers have this problem? If it is just one, it could be a problem with that speaker, or with the wiring to that speaker. But if both have the jarring sound it must have something to do at the HU end.

Are both speakers screwed down real tight? If not, the sound could be them vibrating.

Is the vibrating sound coming from the speaker, or the area around the speaker -- loose plastic trim parts?


EDIT: WHoops! Looks like Sam answered while I was replying :-)

Last edited by hydrashok : 7th December 2006 at 16:04.
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Old 7th December 2006, 16:15   #4765
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
LOL, it's not stuck with tape yaar.It's part of every GTO937. That is the passive crossover.
Arrey how do I know there's a passive crossover on the 937's, that's why I called & asked you. Anyways chalo learnt something new today!

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Rags, I guess there isn't an amp in the setup, right? So it can't be a problem with the gains settings.
No amp yet, so no problems with the gain there.

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Originally Posted by hydrashok View Post
Do both the rear speakers have this problem? If it is just one, it could be a problem with that speaker, or with the wiring to that speaker. But if both have the jarring sound it must have something to do at the HU end.
I think it's both but will check carefully once again tonight. Another friend who sat in the back said it's coming from one speaker so not absolutely sure.

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Originally Posted by hydrashok View Post
Are both speakers screwed down real tight? If not, the sound could be them vibrating.
Is the vibrating sound coming from the speaker, or the area around the speaker -- loose plastic trim parts?

Will check this too. Can anybody advise how to remove the stock grille of the Verna parcel shelf? Sam???
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Old 7th December 2006, 16:30   #4766
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
LOL, it's not stuck with tape yaar.It's part of every GTO937. That is the passive crossover.

You got me all excited and now I realise what you were talking about.

Baaki bacha the vibrations could be cause by the speaker touching a metal portion. I suspect the installation can be improved a bit.
Hi Sam,
I am new to this forum.
I have recently purchased Blaupunkt Maui MP36 HU (4x45 Watts Max. Power) for my new suzuki swift. I am searching speakers for the same. I would be thankful to you if u cld answer my queries -

1. What should be the Specs (Power etc) of speakers to match the HU?
2. Which type of speakers (Coaxial [2/3/4-way], or compos) should i go for in FRONT?
3 Which type of speakers should i go for at the REAR(Coaxial [2/3/4-way], or compos)? (Door Installation).
4 Lastly which company should i go for? How is Blaupunkt or JBL?
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Old 7th December 2006, 16:38   #4767
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Can anybody advise how to remove the stock grille of the Verna parcel shelf? Sam???
Haven't got the Verna delivery yet. Will know in 5 weeks.
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Old 7th December 2006, 16:46   #4768
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Haven't got the Verna delivery yet. Will know in 5 weeks.
5 weeks Damn that's way too long!
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Old 7th December 2006, 16:48   #4769
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Haven't got the Verna delivery yet. Will know in 5 weeks.
What???????? Will it take so lonnnnnnnnnG???
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Old 7th December 2006, 20:09   #4770
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Originally Posted by Vipul.Sharma View Post
Hi Sam,
I am new to this forum.
I have recently purchased Blaupunkt Maui MP36 HU (4x45 Watts Max. Power) for my new suzuki swift. I am searching speakers for the same. I would be thankful to you if u cld answer my queries -

1. What should be the Specs (Power etc) of speakers to match the HU?
2. Which type of speakers (Coaxial [2/3/4-way], or compos) should i go for in FRONT?
3 Which type of speakers should i go for at the REAR(Coaxial [2/3/4-way], or compos)? (Door Installation).
4 Lastly which company should i go for? How is Blaupunkt or JBL?

1. Any speaker that says 40W and upwards will do you.

2. If your budget allows, go for components in front.

3. Fix co-axials in the back. (Co-axials of the same brand and series).

4. Both companies are good, they both make speakers of comparable quality, and they both have a good service network. BUT, the speakers from Blau sound different from the speakers from JBL. You had better listen to both and decide. JBL gives a brighter (more trebly) sound than Blau.

Vipul, what is your budget for speakers? Your choice from either brand will depend on the budget.

JBL CS series and Blau GT series will run to about 5K for the entry level components (JBL CS2165c and Blau GTc172HP). Both are 6.5" components and will be ideal for your Swift.
The entry-level co-axials will run to about 4K in both cases. So that's about 9K for speakers (give or take 500/-). The speakers mentioned will go well with your HU.

Now netween the two, if you are in this budget level, I would suggest JBL over Blau as the GT series are not thaaaat good. And, If you like your music a little bright, I would recommend JBL anyway. (Blau's next range of speakers TH series and OD series are worth a listen, but compare them with JBL's GTO series).

And, if you don't mind spending a little extra (about 2K-3K more in total), You must give a listen to Hertz DSK165 components and DCX165 co-axials. They are worth the extra money.

Listen to all three and decide which suits your taste best.

Last edited by hydrashok : 7th December 2006 at 20:21.
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