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Old 29th June 2012, 01:48   #11611
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Gurus,

I am complete newbie looking for a good ICE setup for my scorpio lx which does not have any HU/speakers. First a big thanks to the Gurus here.

My requirement is simple, I am looking for sound quality similar to my ipod/sennheiser in a budget of 20K - 30K. I am looking for good acoustic sound. Ie Guitars and Metal where the heavy bass will create havoc. I am not an expert, but I have seen with heavy bass the sound of metal songs get ruined. I am an avid listener of alternative rock, classical metal, Indie. Please suggest me a HU/speakers for the same. Please note, I have a sony explode in my current car and it fails to excite me, hence I go with my earphones mostly. If I can say it more clearly, I need more clarity and the acoustic warmth in the music.

Thanks folks, eagerly waiting for a reply.
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Old 29th June 2012, 06:47   #11612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha1
My plan is to set up warm sounding speakers since I have realized that is my general taste.
PS: the budget would be in whereabouts of 10K. Front comps - two woofers and two tweeters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath
Try jbl gto-609c..
Alpha, I would listen to at least 3 brands. For speakers with laid back highs I would consider Alpine, Infinity, etc. Taste is subjective so listen for yourself. Also some speakers particularly components have the option of trimming the high frequency response via the crossover. Lastly done forget that most HU have some control over the tonal balance (bass and treble controls).

Quote:
Originally Posted by droolingvoyager
My requirement is simple, I am looking for sound quality similar to my ipod/sennheiser in a budget of 20K - 30K. I am looking for good acoustic sound. Ie Guitars and Metal where the heavy bass will create havoc. I am not an expert, but I have seen with heavy bass the sound of metal songs get ruined. I am an avid listener of alternative rock, classical metal, Indie..., I need more clarity and the acoustic warmth in the music.
Thanks folks, eagerly waiting for a reply.
Metal is rarely Acoustic. For example Black Sabbath is Metal. America is acoustic. Similarly clarity usually implies a strong treble, warmth implies a laid back treble.

Like I suggested to Alpha above why not listen to a few brands and see which ones give you the balance of sound you like. Polk, JBL, Infinity, Focal, Boston are common good brands. I would stay away from Somy, Pioneer, Kenwood etc when it comes to speakers. They are usually bested by the specialist speaker manufacturers.
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Old 29th June 2012, 09:18   #11613
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
Metal is rarely Acoustic. For example Black Sabbath is Metal. America is acoustic. Similarly clarity usually implies a strong treble, warmth implies a laid back treble.

Like I suggested to Alpha above why not listen to a few brands and see which ones give you the balance of sound you like. Polk, JBL, Infinity, Focal, Boston are common good brands. I would stay away from Somy, Pioneer, Kenwood etc when it comes to speakers. They are usually bested by the specialist speaker manufacturers.
Navin, thanks dude, you are awesomely fast. I have also one more thing in my head. Music to me means painstakingly hrs of preparing playlists and randomizing them. I find my ipod better at that. Could you suggest if its a good thing to have a dumb HU with good aux/amplifier. I really do not need the HU's playing an mp3 or CD. Its good to have kind of feature. But I am not sure, if this kind of thing is actually there in market or not. I would be also happy with a HU, which can work with playlists or advance features like randomizing or playing the top rated ones. Ideally, if thats not possible, I would be happy with a good Amplifier with the aux connected to my ipod.

thanks again.
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Old 29th June 2012, 09:43   #11614
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

@ Navin and other Gurus:

A simple query. I have a 2012 Swift VXI. I have decided to do the installation tomorrow. In the first phase, it will be a Pioneer HU, with Infinity Kappa components on the front door, driven by a JBL 1004 4 channel amp (two channels used, the other two to be bridged for the sub going in in Phase 2).

My question is about the positioning of the tweeters. The midbass would go into the stock locations in the lower parts of the front doors. Given this situation, what would be the best place to position the tweeters?
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Old 29th June 2012, 09:53   #11615
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Hi,
I use Cowon J3 (PMP) mostly in Car, The stock front speakers of Fabia are not good, I plan to add componenet speakers in front and move the current stock to rear door.
I have a query , Do I need a amp as I connect the J3 to the Aux in , The stock HU is OK, with Audio Technica Head phones , The J3 sound great without amps as there are 32 predefined JetEffect 3.0 Settings which I like.

Can I avoid the Amp and just add the component speakers. I hear to mix of FLac and Mp3.
Even if I get a 50% iprovement in sound I am OK.
Plan to add Infinity Kappa speakers ao anything better budget 10- to 12K.
Will this setup work.
Regards,
Pravin
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Old 29th June 2012, 10:41   #11616
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by droolingvoyager View Post
Could you suggest if its a good thing to have a dumb HU with good aux/amplifier.
Technically you could drive a power amp directly from the iPod but it is more than a bit limiting....

An HU gives you control like front rear balanace, left right balance, tone controls, etc...some better HUs also offer ipod control, time alignment (quite useful if you have a subwoofer i the trunk and you want the bass to feel like it coming from the dash instead) etc..

In addition your ipod has 2 outputs. A headphone output (which is variable) and a line level output (via a dock or 30 pin connector) which is fixed. The live level output is a higher quality output s and using a HU which is "ipod compatible" allows you to use this output.

That said...today most HUs are ipod compatible (it was not the case as little as 10 years ago). BTW good digital media receivers such as the KIV-700 or KD-X40 are superbly suited to drive ipods but they are a bit more expensive than basic "ipod compaitble" HUs.

Depending on your budget you can get a decent "ipod compatible" HU for under 7K. One option is the Pioneer 1490 linked below, another is JBL's 333 and 555 (see thread on this forum).
Car Entertainment Systems

Quote:
Originally Posted by arindambasu13 View Post
A simple query. I have a 2012 Swift VXI.
My question is about the positioning of the tweeters.
Ideally the tweeters should go where the OVRM pods are but if this is not possible (if your OVRM controls are mechanical and not electrical) the other options are on the dash (where they might be damaged by an over zealous car cleaner) or high up on the doors.

Last edited by navin : 29th June 2012 at 10:44.
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Old 29th June 2012, 10:50   #11617
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post


Ideally the tweeters should go where the OVRM pods are but if this is not possible (if your OVRM controls are mechanical and not electrical) the other options are on the dash (where they might be damaged by an over zealous car cleaner) or high up on the doors.
Thank you Navin. A follow up query- on the doors or the mirror pods (this is possible since my mirrors are electrically adjusting, not manual) would mean they are firing at the driver (driver- the person!), while on the dash would mean they firing at the windshield.

Are these two positions not different in terms of their acoustic result? Or are they alternatives with differing degree of trade off in terms of optimization of acoustics?
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Old 29th June 2012, 11:57   #11618
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by arindambasu13 View Post
... would mean they are firing at the driver (driver- the person!), while on the dash would mean they firing at the windshield. ...
No, that would be painful. The driver's side one should point at the passengers right ear, and the passenger's on to the driver's left ear. Pointing at the opposite headrest is also OK. There would be angle mounts with the tweeter, so you can start by using double sided tape to mount it till you are happy with the position.

If on dash, it should actually be at the base of the A-pillar, firing as above. Alternatively, you can get a mount made for mounting it on the dash near the windshield, again facing / firing as above. There are plenty of installation pics that you can search - will help you visualize.
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Old 30th June 2012, 10:31   #11619
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by arindambasu13 View Post
.
Are these two positions not different in terms of their acoustic result? Or are they alternatives with differing degree of trade off in terms of optimization of acoustics?
1. if you have the tweeter firing AT the windshield it will cause a lot of HF smear and ghosting.

2. in my view, the best practical install locations are either on the OVRM tweeter pod or high on the door.
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Old 7th July 2012, 22:11   #11620
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

To solve a lot of potential "auditioning" problems - I would request all the potential buyers to play abround with the graphic equalizer in their audio systems.

The JBLs have an exaggerated high mids - 1000 - 3000 Hz (JBL).
Boost the EQ of this range by 3/6 dB and listen - do you like this sound?
Reduce the EQ by 3dB and increase >7 kHz by 3/6dB (Infinty) - do you like the sound?

This is the main difference between JBL and Infinity.

Last edited by alpha1 : 7th July 2012 at 22:32.
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Old 7th July 2012, 22:53   #11621
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabiaous View Post
Hi,
I use Cowon J3 (PMP) mostly in Car, The stock front speakers of Fabia are not good, I plan to add componenet speakers in front and move the current stock to rear door.
I have a query , Do I need a amp as I connect the J3 to the Aux in , The stock HU is OK, with Audio Technica Head phones , The J3 sound great without amps as there are 32 predefined JetEffect 3.0 Settings which I like.

Can I avoid the Amp and just add the component speakers. I hear to mix of FLac and Mp3.
Even if I get a 50% iprovement in sound I am OK.
Plan to add Infinity Kappa speakers ao anything better budget 10- to 12K.
Will this setup work.
Regards,
Pravin
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Components are good enough. You will get better separation and will sound good. Amplifiers are not mandatory unless you drive a sub woofer. Try to get the rear speakers as well.
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Old 9th July 2012, 10:34   #11622
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

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Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
Components are good enough. You will get better separation and will sound good. Amplifiers are not mandatory unless you drive a sub woofer. Try to get the rear speakers as well.
Thanks Srishiva, I plan to move the current front door speakers (coaxial) to rear amd add componnet speakers in front.
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Old 9th July 2012, 18:59   #11623
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Hi Gurus,

I am posting my confusion as a new question here. Since this is something to do with my existing setup, a search did not work for me.

My Car - VW Polo TDi (I feel it has some good potential as far as Audio setup is concerned )

Existing Setup
HU : Alpine W203E
Front Speakers : JL Audio Components (Don't remember the exact model number)
Rear Speakers : Morel Coaxials (Don't remember the exact model number)

And importantly, I am really happy with the current SQ.

Why a question here?
Just like every human being, I am checking how can I improve this further? That too on a tight budget of 15K.

Conditions
Nothing as such. But I would like to retain my existing Alpine, JLs and Morels as they are quite capable for the level of my taste. Just like any other, the first item comes to my mind is a Sub-Woofer setup. Will I be able to get a decent one with my current budget and setup? I mean something that goes in line with my HU and speakers.

If you can suggest something other than Sub-Woofer setup, that is also welcome. I am not particular about that and ready to try something different.

Boot space is a concern. But still I am ready to sacrifice in case it is a value addition.
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Old 9th July 2012, 23:07   #11624
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by novice29 View Post
If you can suggest something other than Sub-Woofer setup, that is also welcome. I am not particular about that and ready to try something different.
Wow !! Such a different requirement. Nice. Let me give it a try.

Here are some options to try:
  • Door Damping - 3000/-
  • Boot Damping - 3000/-
  • Floor Damping - 3000/-
  • Try JBL MS-2 for improving sound quality. (Costs 12,000/- with B&W).
  • Add More professional quality wiring like Audison wires etc.
These would imporove sound quality drastically without adding a sub-woofer, but you would still lack that "bass"/"punch" if you dont use a sub / bass-tube.
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Old 10th July 2012, 14:02   #11625
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by novice29 View Post
... If you can suggest something other than Sub-Woofer setup, that is also welcome. I am not particular about that and ready to try something different.

Boot space is a concern. But still I am ready to sacrifice in case it is a value addition.
1. It is time for an amp to be added - that will improve the sound that comes out of the front components. Get a 4ch amp - Kenwood, Pio, JBL, ... Keep the rears on the HU for the time being; the other 2 channels can drive a sub (if and when you want)

2. If boot space is a concern, get someone to make a fiberglass enclosure on one side of the boot

All told, you should be able to manage an amp, a decent sub, the FG enclosure and wiring within 15-17K

And then there is the damping too as @scopriobharat suggested. This will remove a lot of the noise that masks part of the music.
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