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Old 31st October 2005, 13:18   #166
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Doc,

I would recommend you dont think about the rear speakers because of your budget constraints plus after listening to your initial install, you will find out whether you really need the rear speakers or not. In my car I have only two front speakers and its enough for the rear passengers.

I would recommend Pionner beacuse they are VFM and at the same time sound good. Dont worry about the B&W beause in my experience Pioneer's are reliable.

Also use a 4 ch amplifier and a sub. The amp will make a lot of difference to the sound and the sub to the bottom end. If you are very particular about tight bass, you will need a sub in a sealed box with lots of power driving it. Which will need lots of money to buy. Would recommend you listen to some free air installs of subs on the rear parcel tray and decide whether the bass is tight enough for you or not. Free air subs are available for less than 3000 and the amps for them start at 5500.

For an HU, 2 good speakers, an amp, a sub, cabling and install, 20k is not enough. You would have to spend atleast 25k.
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Old 31st October 2005, 13:28   #167
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pics of what mclaren?

I built my own 4" by taking an existing 4" coax driver riping out the tweeter making a phase plug out of Mseal and adding a blaupunkt component tweeter using a 6db crossover. it is nothing special really and quite easy to do. took me form about 9:30am to 12 noon for the complete job. i dont take pics when i work as it distracts me and then i forget soemthing.

i have not heard the 7750 if one can get one with 3 pre outs for 9k that is great. The Blaupunkt will come with bill and warranty dont know if the pio will come with B&W at that price.
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Old 31st October 2005, 14:57   #168
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Originally Posted by navin
i have not heard the 7750 if one can get one with 3 pre outs for 9k that is great. The Blaupunkt will come with bill and warranty dont know if the pio will come with B&W at that price.
well the pioneer 7750 is a great HU at its price..ya its the grey price we are talking about..the 7750 is not yet officially launched in india as yet (thru the autocop networking that is)..when launched officially it should retail around 18-20k im sure..
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Old 31st October 2005, 21:46   #169
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Ah, nice to see the symphony of advice waiting for me when I got back home after work and checked the net. I have concluded the following at this point weighing all the advice so far:

1. My budget is toast.

2. HU - pio vs blau (price may be the deciding factor). A dumb question What is the benefit of 3 vs 2 preouts? Are preouts synonymous with amp channels?

3. Fronts - JBL vs blau - one lingering question from my last post - any point in going for a door install to get a larger coax or comp (maybe 5 1/4) vs trying to squeeze something into the smaller factory 4" aperture?

4. Rear - I like the idea suggested by 5u3zEr0 of seeing what happens after the fronts and the sub are in. Sound for rear passengers is not a consideration as I don't expect to have anybody sitting there who will be discerning enough to notice! If needed, will probably go with JBL 6" coax or comparable blau depending on whats in front.

5. Amp - Sony 504

6. Sub - will decide after listening whether a free air or tube will do instead of a box...

7. Good cabling (any suggestions? I have Monster cable for home, but dont know what is good for cars...)

8. Disclaimer - all of the above are subject to availability....

Sam - How should I contact you (or whomever else I should) to get more details/avail of your generous offer - is there a place in Kochi you could recommend where I could check out the JBL's?

I will be out hunting with my BIL tomorrow (all day I guess). Will let you know what happens.....but I am still open for more advice and comments on my outlined POA before that! Thanks guys!
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Old 31st October 2005, 22:56   #170
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@ doc


2. blau if u want backup/service/warranty and good fm/radio.... 3 pre out means ( in the case of sony: frnt/ back outs and a sub out)

3. 4 a santro right? can u cut/fit a compo ( 5 incher would do) , or at frnt pods, jbl gto series 426e, i think new cs series r cheaper. ( 426 costs 2.5 with b&w )

4. co-ax at back.

5. sony 504 is fine; cheapest 4 channel u can find under 5k i guess

6. sub... emm.. i am going 4 box, i like it tight. tubes take up the whole space, but nice boooomm . free air? well, then u haev 2 c that u have a nice IB, but free air is cheaper!

7. cable? deep pocket?

u can just power all speakers using 504 for now. when u r ready for sub, power teh rear frm the HU and bridge teh amo to power teh sub.


a.m. traders market jbl stuff. what no?

guys what says?
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Old 31st October 2005, 23:02   #171
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Default 3 types of pio

knw what guys? if u go to any car accessory shop in kerala ( alright tvm/cochin), they have 3 varieties of pios.

1. made in china
2. made in thailand
3. made in japan

no marks for guessing, 3 diff rates for these three. aha, yup , chinese is cheapest! and maybe these 3 differ in pmpos too! maybe ones 420pmpo , 440pmpo and then 480pmpo. some marketing!

Last edited by jkdas : 31st October 2005 at 23:06. Reason: used sms lingo:D
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Old 31st October 2005, 23:11   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doc
Ah, nice to see the symphony of advice waiting for me when I got back home after work and checked the net. I have concluded the following at this point weighing all the advice so far:

1. My budget is toast.

2. HU - pio vs blau (price may be the deciding factor). A dumb question What is the benefit of 3 vs 2 preouts? Are preouts synonymous with amp channels?

3. Fronts - JBL vs blau - one lingering question from my last post - any point in going for a door install to get a larger coax or comp (maybe 5 1/4) vs trying to squeeze something into the smaller factory 4" aperture?

4. Rear - I like the idea suggested by 5u3zEr0 of seeing what happens after the fronts and the sub are in. Sound for rear passengers is not a consideration as I don't expect to have anybody sitting there who will be discerning enough to notice! If needed, will probably go with JBL 6" coax or comparable blau depending on whats in front.

5. Amp - Sony 504

6. Sub - will decide after listening whether a free air or tube will do instead of a box...

7. Good cabling (any suggestions? I have Monster cable for home, but dont know what is good for cars...)

8. Disclaimer - all of the above are subject to availability....

Sam - How should I contact you (or whomever else I should) to get more details/avail of your generous offer - is there a place in Kochi you could recommend where I could check out the JBL's?

I will be out hunting with my BIL tomorrow (all day I guess). Will let you know what happens.....but I am still open for more advice and comments on my outlined POA before that! Thanks guys!
well if u have 3 preouts then u can independently connect the rears,the fronts and the sub..if u have only two then u need to bridge the front and the rears and as such u will loose out on the fader or if its bridged with the sub and the rears then u will loose out on the sub control..u can however use a Y-cable to achieve better results with a 2 preout..but on any given day 3 preouts is better as it gives independent connections to each of the speakers and the sub..

well regarding the need to accomodate the compos in the front u might have to speak to ur installer itself..u can decide based on whether u find the IB install or the sealed enclosure to be better..

cables ??? monsters damn expensive..so u might want to stay away from them..belden wires are pretty good and come at a good price too..i would also check on the cabling from audison..the are pretty good but the availability is the issue..
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Old 31st October 2005, 23:15   #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkdas
knw what guys? if u go to any car accessory shop in kerala ( alright tvm/cochin), they have 3 varieties of pios.

1. made in china
2. made in thailand
3. made in japan

no marks for guessing, 3 diff rates for these three. aha, yup , chinese is cheapest! and maybe these 3 differ in pmpos too! maybe ones 420pmpo , 440pmpo and then 480pmpo. some marketing!
hhmm..nice find there JK..obvious that the goods made in china is the cheapest(cheap labour,raw materials and what not)..anyway as far as my knowledge goes the pioneer HU's that are made in thailand are as good as original or in other other words they are original..its just that the lower end HU's are made in thailand whereas the higher end models are made in japan only..so there is no worry if u get a HU from thai make..but do make sure u stay away from the chinese ones..
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Old 31st October 2005, 23:22   #174
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Angry

the point is how will u find out which is the right one!

and guys :(( some of my post r getting deleted ( not even a trace) by some mods. its really pissing me off.


http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8391 (Driver salaries / pay)

Last edited by jkdas : 31st October 2005 at 23:26.
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Old 1st November 2005, 10:12   #175
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Thanks JK and Mcl - will go with 3 preouts. Another newbie question - what does "IB" stand for?
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Old 1st November 2005, 12:15   #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doc
Thanks JK and Mcl - will go with 3 preouts. Another newbie question - what does "IB" stand for?
well IB stands for infinite baffle..in this type of enclosure(if u can call it) u have a baffle board(a mdf tray in this instance) which separates the front of the speaker from the rear of the speaker..this type of a install will use ur entire trunk space as a huge box but ul have to make sure that there is no leak for sound from the rear of the speaker to its front. If this happens, cancellation will occur and bass output will be reduced...
this way u can use ur boot space to and have a satisfying boom boom too and also keep the costs to a minimum as it would eliminate the box..

but this also comes with a few disadvantages like in u have excessive momvement of the cone and hence no precise or definition from the sound that emanates from the sub..so expect a lot of boomy effect rather than a punchy bass..

if u need some punch in ur bass a sealed enclosure is the way to go..that would mean another 2k on the design of the box..

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Old 1st November 2005, 12:50   #177
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Doc,

For the HU, please choose the Pioneer over the Blaupunkt. An HU would 2 pre-outs would suffice as you are going to have only one amp to begin with. Also, The amplifiers we are talking about here, as far as I know, have a maximum of only two pre-out inputs. So a HU with a third pre-out will be of no use immediately.

A pre-out jack is required for connecting amplifiers through a RCA cable and takes only the audio signal from the HU without any amplification to the amplifier.

If your installer could install a pair of 5 1/4" compnent speakers on the doors it would be ideal. 6 1/2" speakers would even be better. Personally, I would do that. I am sure in a place like Ernakulam/Kochi you would have good installers. Take a look at the front doors of my car. http://img235.imageshack.us/my.php?i...eftdoor7lb.jpg

Last but not the least, please install all your equipment with a professional installer with good RCA and speaker cables. An install can make or ruin your cars sound!
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Old 1st November 2005, 14:07   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doc
Sam - How should I contact you (or whomever else I should) to get more details/avail of your generous offer - is there a place in Kochi you could recommend where I could check out the JBL's?
You have anice way of writing. Good show.
Dude you could just pick up any car magazine, Car, Autocar, Overdrive, Top GEar and you will find AM traders number there. Sorry but its not handy for me. If you dont get it i will PM you the number next time.
JK is a pretty famous guy for JBL. His name features in every JBL ad. (I wonder why) I am sure now HE can get you a discount too. lol.

In any case, find a dealer, find a product you like, tell him you're a friend of Sam's from JBL OR pm me his details, I'll send an injecttion from here.

Cool?
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Old 1st November 2005, 18:41   #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi
You have anice way of writing. Good show.
Dude you could just pick up any car magazine, Car, Autocar, Overdrive, Top GEar and you will find AM traders number there. Sorry but its not handy for me. If you dont get it i will PM you the number next time.
JK is a pretty famous guy for JBL. His name features in every JBL ad. (I wonder why) I am sure now HE can get you a discount too. lol.

In any case, find a dealer, find a product you like, tell him you're a friend of Sam's from JBL OR pm me his details, I'll send an injecttion from here.

Cool?
thanks Sam. (psst.. wanna drag?... lol,mcl)

aseem bhai, wont it be better if he buys a 3 preout HU now rather than get one when later. a sub preout should be gr8 in future in case he wants a sub.

doc mate, if u can find a good installer who can fix a 506 at the frnt door pls send me a telegram or call me !

and abt fibre glass mould for door too..if u find someone who doesit here pls pm me

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Old 2nd November 2005, 00:30   #180
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Just got back home and..........the deed is done. My bank balance is poorer by 26.5k and here is what I ended up with (professionally installed):

HU - pio 5750 - Malaysian (it was 2.5k less than the 7750 - also Malaysian, and as far as I could tell, matched it in things that mattered - power, settings, 3 preouts) - (7.25k)

Fronts - (Navin - you were right - no 4" comps to be had) Blau 4" ODX 102 coaxials driven by the amp - a step up from the THx series (2.9k)

Rears - Blau 6" GTx 173 triaxials driven by the HU - a step down from the THx series (2.8k)

Amp - Sony 504 (5k - a bit more expensive than I had expected from the estimates in prior posts) - anyone know what the RMS power would be on it? The manual just has peak and continuous...

Sub (yup had to get one) - Blau THb 250 sealed box (7.1k)

Cabling and install (under 1.5k)

(Sam, Sam, Sam - Sorry - I had really wanted to give the JBL's a shot but I hadn't gotten your mail by the time I had gone "hunting" this morning so had no modus operandi at hand.... And, sad to say, a few days ago when I first thought of getting sound, had stopped by a place with JBL on the board outside and all over the shop -dunno if this is A M traders though. The guy there seemed rather disinterested in a possible sale and after going through a monologue (we talked, he grumbled) we headed out at a somewhat faster pace than when we had ambled in. Our sources later told us this was indeed THE JBL place, so we decided going back there would be our last resort. As you can see, something else clicked before that....thanks for trying to help - and for your positive comments on my writing!)

The sound is good, I think REALLY good by my non-audiophilic standards. Have to tinker around with the HU settings to see what works best but it looks like a winner. All 4 speakers in factory locations - just didnt have the budget, time or stomach for custom. I am glad I went with the sealed box sub as it sounds just right - tight and punchy enough without getting muddy and rattly. The soundstage is towards the rear and I have to see how I like it - but it does make for less ear strain.

Will post again in a few days as to how its breaking in - meantime, thanks again guys - couldn't have done it without you.

Guess we can call it a wrap (but post-mortems are welcome)!
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