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Old 1st July 2016, 21:01   #256
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Hangover, I have been following your posts on this thread and have noticed that many of your queries are not related to the 777. Some are not related to Boeing aircraft altogether. And some are misguided in the sense that you seem more intent of showing off what you know than taking the time to learn from experts in this domain.

We have many experienced commercial pilots contributing here and my advice is to ask pertinent questions in a constructive manner. Searchingheaven and Jeroen have been very patient so far. Let's ensure that we don't frustrate them by taking this thread off topic or trying to put them on the defensive. From what I have read so far, it is obvious you don't have the relevant expertise or experience.

Over to you searchingheaven and Jeroen.
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Old 1st July 2016, 23:42   #257
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In terms of passenger comfort (noise levels, cabin pressure etc.), which one would the experts here rate better, between Airbus A-380 Super Jumbo, Boeing 787-8, and Boeing 777 ?
Since you asked about this, i was reading an article online a few days back about Emirates pilots complaining that the A380 is way too silent for them to sleep peacefully on long haul flights when its time for one crew to rest and the other to take over controls. The pilots reported that the engine sound is so well insulated that they are having trouble sleeping because they can hear people talking in the cabin and babies crying.

Emirates is to blame as well since they requested Airbus to change the default location of crew rest area since they wanted to make more space for first class cabin.

I have not yet had the privilege to enjoy a long flight on a 777 but between the Airbus A380 and Boeing 787-8, i would definitely choose the 380. I was much more comfortable inside the 380, the noise levels were also lower, for cabin pressure, i could not make out much of a difference. Emirate's A380 was a joy to fly in, top notch aircraft, coupled with top notch service.

A general suggestion to every one, please avoid Qatar's 787 economy like plague, it is absolutely horrendous, the leg room, seat pitch/width etc are very bad and was one of the most uncomfortable flight i sat in when i came from Madrid, Air India's A320 has better seats than Qatar's 787.

P.S : Seat width, legroom etc are dependent on airlines and the configurations they choose, most airlines have messed up on 787 with a 3-3-3 seating.
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Old 1st July 2016, 23:56   #258
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

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Since you asked about this, i was reading an article online a few days back about Emirates pilots complaining that the A380 is way too silent for them to sleep peacefully on long haul flights when its time for one crew to rest and the other to take over controls. I have not yet had the privilege to enjoy a long flight on a 777 but between the Airbus A380 and Boeing 787-8, i would definitely choose the 380. I was much more comfortable inside the 380
After having flown Boeing's all my life, I have to hand over this crown to the A380. That aircraft is eerily silent on the inside, including in the cockpit. The 777 is no match for the jumbo when it comes to sound insulation. It's just unreal. I have deadheaded in our partner's A380 a lot of times as a passenger.(Our operator doesn't have A380s.) and the silence just makes me go crazy sometimes.
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Old 2nd July 2016, 10:29   #259
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

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and the silence just makes me go crazy sometimes.
This reminds me of a time when I met some Toyota engineers (the Lexus branding was in the works) and they told me that they could actually make the cabin totally silent (as in they had the technology to do that) but found that in the tests the conducted drivers found a totally silent cabin disconcerting hence they engineered some (small amount of) road noise into the cabin.
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Old 2nd July 2016, 11:46   #260
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

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This reminds me of a time when I met some Toyota engineers (the Lexus branding was in the works) and they told me that they could actually make the cabin totally silent (as in they had the technology to do that) but found that in the tests the conducted drivers found a totally silent cabin disconcerting hence they engineered some (small amount of) road noise into the cabin.

Some cars ( Lexus and Honda's cars have this ) have noise cancellation systems that play back the low frequencies ( road and engine noise ) through the cars stereo speakers whilst inverting the phase of the sound and cancelling it out.

Ever wondered why a Lexus is so quiet? It's because the quiet is artificially generated.

Also, I have heard that the ATM machines whirr sound is artificially generated. But really not sure about this.
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Old 2nd July 2016, 12:35   #261
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

Some humans too have a noise cancellation feature. The moment they start speaking, the company falls silent. ;-)
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Old 2nd July 2016, 20:13   #262
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

Absolutely wonderful thread, rated five stars.

searchingheaven your patience in answering each and every question is commendable. There was a certain positive vibe in this thread until someone bumped in. searchingheaven you have frequently mentioned "operator". It appears to me that there is a high level technical team in every carrier who prepares technical policies. This is new to me. Can you please enlighten us on this?

I would also like to request @hangover to come clean on whether he is an industry professional or an enthusiast. Your post are intelligently written and so totally believable. So it is becoming very confusing for us laymen.
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Old 3rd July 2016, 11:37   #263
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i usually do one long haul a month , and invariably the 777 is the dafault choice of the operators in this sector
On a recent trip , the outbound Delhi - Newark was on United , and a tired 777-200ER , the sound levels were really high , and not a comfortable flight by any stretch . Have flown BA / Delta/American and Emirates , and there was a visible difference in the way the airframe shaked on takeoff

On return got a connection through Frankfurt on a 380 , and the difference was amazing , i could actually speak to a passenger in the adjoining aisle seat , during take off , there was better legroom .

But Personally , i would always pick the 777 , call me old school , but the BIG GE or RR engines on the 777 are awe inspiring and the soundtrack for the take off roll is worth all the reduced legroom .

This is an amazing thread ! keep the info flowing Searchingheaven & Jeroen.

Salman
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Old 4th July 2016, 12:56   #264
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

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Originally Posted by coolboy007 View Post
Since you asked about this, i was reading an article online a few days back about Emirates pilots complaining that the A380 is way too silent for them to sleep peacefully on long haul flights when its time for one crew to rest and the other to take over controls.

Emirates is to blame as well since they requested Airbus to change the default location of crew rest area since they wanted to make more space for first class cabin.

I have not yet had the privilege to enjoy a long flight on a 777 but between the Airbus A380 and Boeing 787-8, i would definitely choose the 380. I was much more comfortable inside the 380, the noise levels were also lower, for cabin pressure, i could not make out much of a difference. Emirate's A380 was a joy to fly in, top notch aircraft, coupled with top notch service.

A general suggestion to every one, please avoid Qatar's 787 economy like plague, it is absolutely horrendous, the leg room, seat pitch/width etc are very bad and was one of the most uncomfortable flight i sat in when i came from Madrid, Air India's A320 has better seats than Qatar's 787.
I get to travel regularly on Emirates. Have done three trips from March till now. And since its the BLR-FRA sector I travel on, my choice is always Emirates though we have a few others like Qatar, Etihad, Lufthansa(Direct). In this sector, I get a back to back 777-A380 Experience which is one of the main reasons I chose this carrier. After the BLR-DXB leg on the 777, I dont feel a thing on the A380 and this will make it a relaxing flight without noise and a smoother ride. While returning, since the DXB BLR stretch is in the early hours of the morning, I fall asleep right after take off irrespective of the aircraft. Once there was very bad turbulence which led to breakfast all over the plane, and I didnt realise a thing in my sleep and I did so only after we landed in BLR, after I went searching for my spectacles and found them under the front seat, crushed
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Old 4th July 2016, 14:21   #265
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Speaking on pure aesthetic terms, I can say that 747 is the true queen of the skies. The grace and majesty of the aircraft when on ground or in air is unparalleled. The A380 is humongous but truly doesn't have a flattering shape, its largely called as 'fatbus' by some pilot communities and I tend to agree. Speaking of engine sound, I am sure the 380 must be superior to others considering that it has newest technology, but I read somewhere that the 787 is the quietest of them all, due to electrical air conditioning and flight controls. I am not sure, since I didn't get to fly pax in either of these airplanes, my experience is limited to 320/340/777 and the likes so far.
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Old 4th July 2016, 15:53   #266
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In my last trip from NRT-BOM sector, we flew in the day time in a 787. While flying over china airspace, I could see a couple of "contrails" (googled for white foam like trail mark behind a jet, and got this word, not sure I meant the correct one here) across to our flight and also saw one plane flying across just over our flight.
Most of my long travels are in the dead of night this far. Is it normal to see so many contrails and even other jets flying over?

On a side note, I feel narrow body aircraft like A320 family or B-737 have more cabin noise and vibration than the wide body counterparts, why so?
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Old 4th July 2016, 17:49   #267
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In my last trip from NRT-BOM sector, we flew in the day time in a 787. While flying over china airspace, I could see a couple of "contrails" (googled for white foam like trail mark behind a jet, and got this word, not sure I meant the correct one here) across to our flight and also saw one plane flying across just over our flight.
Most of my long travels are in the dead of night this far. Is it normal to see so many contrails and even other jets flying over?
?
In general, over the last couple of decades airspace has become busier and busier. Also vertical and lateral seperation is becoming smaller and smaller. So yes, it is not unusual to see several planes around you, heading in different directions and altitudes. (As a passenger you typically dont see the one that are behind or in front of you.)

Whether there will be contrails, and how long they are visible, is more down the temperatures and humidity plus a few other factors.

Jeroen
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Old 4th July 2016, 18:29   #268
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Speaking on pure aesthetic terms, I can say that 747 is the true queen of the skies. ... I read somewhere that the 787 is the quietest of them all
I'm yet to try the A380, but from my other half who travelled in one (Etihad), it's the most silent of the lot. For me, I find the A350 better than the B787 - got a chance to try both back to back, thanks to Qatar.

On pure aesthetic terms, I concur that the Jumbo is the most majestic of all
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Old 4th July 2016, 19:35   #269
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Default Re: Boeing 777 - Pilot's Review

Brilliant thread Searching Heaven. It made for a great read.

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In my last trip from NRT-BOM sector, we flew in the day time in a 787. While flying over china airspace, I could see a couple of "contrails"
Unrelated, but I remember that JAL used to fly a 737 on this sector in an all business class configuration if I'm not mistaken. I was very surprised that a narrow body was being used on such a route, and apparently it was one of the longest, if not the longest 737 route at the time (7 hours and something)



Two planes which I really want to fly in are the 787 and the A350. Having experienced the silence and smoothness of the A380 I cannot wait to see what these other modern aircrafts are like.

The A380 on the upper deck was super silent and smooth. And after being used to the engine noise in the other jets it was a revelation. My flight was only 3 hours so couldn't really figure out about the air quality bit. I'm itching to take a proper long haul on the A380.

Coming to the 777s, I had taken a BOM-ATL flight a couple of times, and it was on a 777-200LR. I really used to love flying that, and be amazed as to how a plane could fly such a distance. Its a pity that flight was stopped.

But of course the queen of the skies is my personal favourite. I've had the privilege of flying the upper deck multiple times, and being in row 1 on the lower deck once. And flying in the 747 is a difference feeling altogether. I still think it is a best looking air plane out of all the commercial aircrafts.

Another thing I have noticed, is that the 777s are a fair bit louder than the A330s in terms of engine noise. I found this very surprising. Is it just due to the larger and more powerful engines on the 777 or something else?

In fact I've noticed the reverse on the narrow body aircrafts. The A320 has an irritating whine (if you can call it that) from the engines especially on take off, and seems to have more engine noise than the 737.

Sorry for the long and seemingly random post. But this seems to be the aviation thread in tbhp now.
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Old 5th July 2016, 00:43   #270
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Brilliant thread Searching Heaven. It made for a great read.



Unrelated, but I remember that JAL used to fly a 737 on this sector in an all business class configuration if I'm not mistaken. I was very surprised that a narrow body was being used on such a route, and apparently it was one of the longest, if not the longest 737 route at the time (7 hours and so.
I think you may be referring to ANA which still flies the sector on a 737 along with a 787. Even Ethiopian and Kenya airways operate 737 on the Mumbai route, again , along with their 787's.
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