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Old 8th January 2010, 16:04   #61
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Default Mercedes launches 3 axle coaches

Mercedes Benz India has launched its 3 axle luxury coaches in India. The coach comes with an O 500 RSD 2436 chassis from Mercedes while the coach body will be assembled by Sutlej Motors Ltd.

Some highlights of the new Mercedes 3 axle coaches:
  • Euro III compliant rear engine with 6 vertical cylinders, turbo charged and intercooled engine delivering 1200 Nm torque at a low rpm of 1400-1600.
  • Smart suspension system equipped with a lifting mechanism that allows the driver to lift the height of the coach when the road conditions are bad.
  • ABS (Anti-lock Braking System). The ABS impedes the locking of all the wheels when braking the vehicle and it is independent of road conditions.
  • Passenger seats are mounted on a higher level from the aisle and are equipped with a mechanical reclining mechanism.
  • The coach maintains a perfect temperature with a well developed roof mounted AC.
  • The coach comes with two LCD screens to make viewing more comfortable for the passengers.
  • The coach also boasts a sufficiently large luggage compartment between the front and rear axels.
  • All the materials used for the coach body are certified as fire retardant.

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Old 25th March 2010, 19:14   #62
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I'm surprised with the large "Sutlej" name tag on the front on the bus. I'm sure quite a large number of the general public will think that the bus is a modified Sutlej bus with a fake Mercedes logo stuck on the front.
If I were Mercedes, I would place the Daimler Mercedes name logo on the other side.
The more you promote the bus as being an original Mercedes the more customers you are going to get.

Also is it just me or do the Front lights look quite small?
Even at the rear of the bus the Sutlej logo is positioned strategically where the three-pointed star actually should have prominently been (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attach...s-img_2596.jpg).

I do not know whether placement of the "Sutlej" text was the reason why the execs from MBIL posed for the photo session in this manner (MOTORINDIA ONLINE EDITION: Mercedes-Benz offers next-generation high-tech luxury buses)!!!

Could this be the reason why "Travel with the Star" is written in jumbo-sized font both at the front as well as on the sides? (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attach...s-img_2601.jpg)
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Old 24th April 2010, 20:47   #63
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Most of you have been discussing the volvo power to AL tata Engine power . What is missing is the fact that the volvo bus runs the air conditioner off the same engine , where as the AL and Tata have to use an auxilliary engine for air conditioning . Another thing is volvo is inherently heavier than the AL or Tata buses .

Power to weight is more important than the power of the engines .

Mercedes will do well only if they launch the setra buses . With the current chaisis they can offer the chaisis to other bus body builders rather than only build it with sutlej .

Ironically , most of you think sutlej bodies are better than azad . But , Azad has more innovations than sutlej . Volvo would not be so stupid to choose Azad over sutlej . Azad was the first manufacturer in India to offer "Air bus " type body , apart from the fully built Neoplan buses . Before the air bus ,the best body in the business was TVS body .

The difference btwn Volvo and Merc is that Volvo has taken the responsibility of raising its child , but merc has left its child in the mercy of an orphanage (aka Sutlej ) .

The reason for the tamil nadu govt to choose traditional AL or Tata over Volvo is that people want cheaper tickets rather than comfort . Another thing is the mileage . An AL bus returns atleast 1.5 kms more than a volvo bus thereby making it cheaper to operate . An AL engine has an expected life of around 5 lakh kms and the engines are rebored and recon work is done in the MTC , TNSTC workshops .
The engines are actually replaced and the time taken for an engine replacement is typically 1-2 hrs . That is why most of the tamil nadu state operated vehicles do not have the engines no . that is mentioned in the RC book .
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Old 24th April 2010, 22:12   #64
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Most of you have been discussing the volvo power to AL tata Engine power . What is missing is the fact that the volvo bus runs the air conditioner off the same engine , where as the AL and Tata have to use an auxilliary engine for air conditioning .
Not any more, Looks like unaware of the latest development in Indian CV market. Now Tata and AL offer buses with ac is driven by the Engine itself

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The reason for the tamil nadu govt to choose traditional AL or Tata over Volvo is that people want cheaper tickets rather than comfort .
That is exactly State owned RTCs should do. We should appreciate TNSTC for sticking with affordable transport instead of going with Pricey Volvos. Leave the ultra luxury to the private operators. RTC s please Provide affordable Luxury to the common man.
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Old 24th April 2010, 22:14   #65
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Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
What is missing is the fact that the volvo bus runs the air conditioner off the same engine , where as the AL and Tata have to use an auxilliary engine for air conditioning .
Leaving Luxura and Hispano both ALL and TML have FE driven AC's.


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Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
Ironically , most of you think sutlej bodies are better than azad . But , Azad has more innovations than sutlej .
I strongly agree in this point forward. Sutlej actually tried some better designs in body but they never looked good. A different kind of pillar behind driver seat, a high mounted spoiler like thing over the rear glass..etc. (let me try posting some photos from KPN... they still have those running)Those were fully with FRP and they looked cheap. But Azad was really neat and their finish was much better. May be their design is neutral but they did better with what they known
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apart from the fully built Neoplan buses .
Neopan in India, I never heard this before.
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Before the air bus ,the best body in the business was TVS body .
TVS bodies had lot of unique features.
Lot of Chrome in the front grills with vertical stripes.
Twin head lamps with nickel covers.
A chrome plated bumper.
Side beedings made of steel running out the body just below the window.
A sliding doors up front.
Their bodies had a better resale values in south.
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Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
The reason for the tamil nadu govt to choose traditional AL or Tata over Volvo is that people want cheaper tickets rather than comfort . Another thing is the mileage . An AL bus returns atleast 1.5 kms more than a volvo bus thereby making it cheaper to operate .
With cheapest travel cost in entire India, its justified.
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Old 24th April 2010, 22:39   #66
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That is exactly State owned RTCs should do. We should appreciate TNSTC for sticking with affordable transport instead of going with Pricey Volvos. Leave the ultra luxury to the private operators. RTC s please Provide affordable Luxury to the common man.
Why is it that SRTCs should only offer cheap transport? Private operators are not officially permitted to carry out interstate operations, and they do so using loop holes (and under-table transactions) in the licensing raj.

SRTCs should surely offer premium services to passengers, and they should charge tickets in a way that the cost of operations are entirely recovered from the ticket cost. (Currently, politicial requirements often result in these services priced abysmally low).

Why is that Premium services (I MEAN Premium Service using a premium brand) should not coexist with common service?

As State Sponsored company, which are legally supposed to be only bodies to provide interstate services, they should offer services to all categories of passengers - right from subsidised ordinary services to expensive premium services.
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Old 24th April 2010, 22:46   #67
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Neopan in India, I never heard this before.
With cheapest travel cost in entire India, its justified.
Tamilnadu has the cheapest public transport system in south. And kerala probably is the most expensive.

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Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
Power to weight is more important than the power of the engines .
Mercedes will do well only if they launch the setra buses .
Azad was the first manufacturer in India to offer "Air bus " type body , apart from the fully built Neoplan buses . Before the air bus ,the best body in the business was TVS body .
An AL bus returns atleast 1.5 kms more than a volvo bus thereby making it cheaper to operate . An AL engine has an expected life of around 5 lakh kms.
The engines are actually replaced and the time taken for an engine replacement is typically 1-2 hrs . That is why most of the tamil nadu state operated vehicles do not have the engines no . that is mentioned in the RC book .
And so is the low rpm torque and gearing along with power to weight ratio.

Kassbohrer setra is a subsidary of MB making fully built customised buses on MB chassis.They do make their own coaches called Travego on similar lines of a{ 9400(india) or 9700 and 9900 (europe)} from volvo.

Neoplan buses were assembled by Kirloskar in india during the mid eighties.

Well in terms of fuel efficiency AL or Tata scores over a volvo.Then how much is the a/c engine FE if an additional engine is used?

Volvo engines are also designed for a life expectancy on similar terms as tata or AL if not more before a major overhaul.

TVS had excellent bodies and the seat spacing was probably the best that i've seen in kerala.


[QUOTE ]That is exactly State owned RTCs should do. We should appreciate TNSTC for sticking with affordable transport instead of going with Pricey Volvos. Leave the ultra luxury to the private operators. RTC s please Provide affordable Luxury to the common man.[/quote]

+1 to that.
How is it that Kasrtc is able to operate a large fleet of volvo and make it profitable or is it not??

Last edited by conjon : 24th April 2010 at 22:49.
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Old 24th April 2010, 23:15   #68
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[quote=teamveevee;1854279]Not any more, Looks like unaware of the latest development in Indian CV market. Now Tata and AL offer buses with ac is driven by the Engine itself

Well , i am fully aware that AL has their Hino turbo charged and TATA also has their cummins upgraded .

But , ask any private omni bus operator ,they will tell you it is a waste of effort .The bus will not be able to reach on time . If they did try reaching on time .. the FE is much lower than volvo. That is why volvo is a fav for air conditioned coaches .
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Old 24th April 2010, 23:30   #69
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And so is the low rpm torque and gearing along with power to weight ratio.

yes , that is an important point . volvo is a low speed engine . wear and tear is much less compared to AL and volvo engines have good torque in the low RPM making it suitable for reaching operating speeed faster . that is life of the engine is also higher

Kassbohrer setra is a subsidary of MB making fully built customised buses on MB chassis.They do make their own coaches called Travego on similar lines of a{ 9400(india) or 9700 and 9900 (europe)} from volvo.

5 years back , looking at the success we did try to import the kassbhorer . I liked the "K" initials ..that was the same as mine , but the germans werent forthcoming .


Neoplan buses were assembled by Kirloskar in india during the mid eighties.

Well in terms of fuel efficiency AL or Tata scores over a volvo.Then how much is the a/c engine FE if an additional engine is used?

very much , especially if you try to maintain timings ..most of the private operators have the habit of waiting for passengers on lean days at various stops . So in order to reach on time, they tend to rip .

Volvo engines are also designed for a life expectancy on similar terms as tata or AL if not more before a major overhaul.


not really .. AL gives 5 lakh kms while volvo gives 10 lakh before any major over haul .


TVS had excellent bodies and the seat spacing was probably the best that i've seen in kerala.


TVS bodies always used wood sandwiched btwn the sheets and the frame . the body never used to rattle . so they always commanded a premium .
Azad changed the way with the air bus versions .


[QUOTE ]That is exactly State owned RTCs should do. We should appreciate TNSTC for sticking with affordable transport instead of going with Pricey Volvos. Leave the ultra luxury to the private operators. RTC s please Provide affordable Luxury to the common man.[/quote]

+1 to that.
How is it that Kasrtc is able to operate a large fleet of volvo and make it profitable or is it not??[/quote]


Well, KSRTC charges a bomb . and most of them dont seem to complain . I feel tamil nadu is right since most of them do not realise that we have the biggest rail network and buses are meant for connecting small towns and cities ( this is the priority ) . so this has to be affordable . that should be the primary job of the govt .
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Old 24th April 2010, 23:38   #70
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Well , i am fully aware that AL has their Hino turbo charged and TATA also has their cummins upgraded .

But , ask any private omni bus operator ,they will tell you it is a waste of effort .The bus will not be able to reach on time . If they did try reaching on time .. the FE is much lower than volvo. That is why volvo is a fav for air conditioned coaches .plus , most of the private operators rely on parcel services rather than the passengers . classic case would be KPN , Parveen etc . the bus is so over loaded that even the volvo buses barely manage to reach on time . Sometimes i feel that someone has to file a PIL to not allow omni buses to carry parcel services .
this is another reason why most of the govt buses reach much faster than the private parcel service buses ,eventhough the govt buses are speed limited
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Old 25th April 2010, 00:28   #71
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Private operators are not officially permitted to carry out interstate operations, and they do so using loop holes (and under-table transactions) in the licensing raj.
But there are Interstate operations between Pollachi(TN) - Palakkad, Thrissor(Kerela) by private operators - PRM Five Star.
Further more there are also private buses between Vellore(TN) and Chittore(AP).
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Old 25th April 2010, 01:16   #72
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Volvo engines are also designed for a life expectancy on similar terms as tata or AL if not more before a major overhaul.


not really .. AL gives 5 lakh kms while volvo gives 10 lakh before any major over haul .

Sir,I actually meant from the above statement that volvo has a longer life expectancy.I didn't use the right punctuation in my above statement.
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Old 25th April 2010, 05:36   #73
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SRTCs should surely offer premium services to passengers, and they should charge tickets in a way that the cost of operations are entirely recovered from the ticket cost. (Currently, politicial requirements often result in these services priced abysmally low).
binaiks, I totally agree with you. If they can recover the cost from fare go for it.
Another factor is initial cost, If the corporation is self sustainable (investing the profit back to the business), does not matter, but most of the time, they get money from the government or other financial institutions(Hudco, Worldbank etc) to buy buses. So the capital is fixed(Never get what what you ask, some one else decides the amount), so which is better, with the resources available, go for few premium buses or opt for more no of normal buses? You can argue either way, but it is hard to tell which is right and which is wrong.

Last edited by teamveevee : 25th April 2010 at 05:37.
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Old 25th April 2010, 05:43   #74
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How is it that Kasrtc is able to operate a large fleet of volvo and make it profitable or is it not??
Dont you agree, The Karnataka goverment has the obligation to support Volvo in the initial days, as it is based there? Because of their support in the initial years, Volvo is still around...I am not saying it is a bad thing to do..All states should do the same, support the local industry
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Old 25th April 2010, 10:36   #75
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But there are Interstate operations between Pollachi(TN) - Palakkad, Thrissor(Kerela) by private operators - PRM Five Star.
Further more there are also private buses between Vellore(TN) and Chittore(AP).
If your intention is solely nitpicking, then I'll give you more routes: Kasaragod-Mangalore, Kannur-Madikeri, Bangalore-Ananthapur, Bangalore-Chittoor, Bangalore-Pondicherry, etc.

We were talking about "premium" services, and these routes are not the kind that can support such services (except perhaps the BLR-Pondicherry route).

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binaiks, I totally agree with you. If they can recover the cost from fare go for it.
They should price the product in such a manner - and that is not the case is most circumstances. In case of KaSRTC, their services to cost a bomb, and that kind of recovers a substantial portion of the cost.

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Another factor is initial cost, If the corporation is self sustainable (investing the profit back to the business), does not matter, but most of the time, they get money from the government or other financial institutions(Hudco, Worldbank etc) to buy buses. So the capital is fixed(Never get what what you ask, some one else decides the amount), so which is better, with the resources available, go for few premium buses or opt for more no of normal buses? You can argue either way, but it is hard to tell which is right and which is wrong.
As the only body in charge of providing all kinds of transport to passengers, the corporation should decide on a mix of the right number of buses.

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Dont you agree, The Karnataka goverment has the obligation to support Volvo in the initial days, as it is based there? Because of their support in the initial years, Volvo is still around...I am not saying it is a bad thing to do..All states should do the same, support the local industry
May be what you say is correct - but that was for the initial days. Its been about 8 years since Volvo came to India, and KaSRTC is still purchasing Volvos. Why so?
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