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Old 10th January 2011, 20:11   #196
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by binaiks View Post
.... Today spotted a few JnNURM buses parked at the ALL yard near Ernakulam with "TN-70-TC" numbers. ...
It shows the Temp registered at Hosur

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
The driver looks at the RVM through the windshield and not through driver side door . That is why you have the RVM at the edge of the windscreen . Sitting in the driver seat , the rear view will be good .
Thats right!
When drove this bus I got the clear visibility while viewing through the windscreen. But to be careful while parking behind vehicles as you normally look at the front portion rather than the protruding ORVM as they are already a feet ahead you.
As pointed by Silversteed, I felt tad difficult viewing through the window of Marcopolos,(as I had to take the view away from the road) that too with so much complication in the driver side quarter vent door.
@ Julupani - I certainly feel ORVM in Marcos are only looking like after thought(as its hanging with a bracket) and also have a feel that these Marcos are little retro design than new age designs.
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Old 10th January 2011, 20:17   #197
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by binaiks View Post
Not just Veera. Some buses for KeSRTC were also built by Prakash. Today spotted a few JnNURM buses parked at the ALL yard near Ernakulam with "TN-70-TC" numbers. There were no body builder markings on the bus. Have heard of some buses being brought from somewhere north of Bangalore as well - not sure of he body builder.

AFAIK, AL has got the JnNURM RE buses of KeSRTC built by Veera, Prakash and Mg-Alma. The latest buses are from them.
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Old 10th January 2011, 21:00   #198
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

I think I already mentioned this, but even I think RVM protruding in front is the better design. And even the ones on the MarcoPolo dont look that good.

@Ashley
What features of the Marco makes you think retro? I hope its just not the multiple differentiated window panes. May be you will think differently of the AC version.
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Old 10th January 2011, 21:07   #199
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by Transsenger View Post
AFAIK, AL has got the JnNURM RE buses of KeSRTC built by Veera, Prakash and Mg-Alma. The latest buses are from them.
Some 27-28 ALL buses have hit the road in Kochi. All of them are Veera built. Only two Prakash built buses have been delivered, and both are running in Trivandrum. I guess the Mg-Alma built buses have either not been delivered, or they are yet to be commissioned.

I guess this is an Mg-Alma built bus:
The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)-img_9019.jpg

This is the interiors of the new lot of buses. The dash has been totally redesigned, and the model of seats have changed.
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The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)-img_9031.jpg  

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Old 10th January 2011, 22:52   #200
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by coolclouds View Post
Which operator is that?? I can guess that "online booking......."

EDIT:
I can read it now.. www.shantadurgatravels.com. First time hearing this name. Is it a new operator?
Looks like new operator based out of Belgaum. Surprised to see how many buses ply to Belgaum everyday from Bangalore! Looks like, there is still room for new operators!!!

Online booking is not yet started! Will try this operator next time.
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Old 10th January 2011, 23:12   #201
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

Probably, it is the pic quality, but I am not very impressed with the dash board layout. Looks like it is fabricated by the builder; not AL design. AFAICT, the "pull up" type switches are not allowed as per CMVR.

Edit:- see this pic. Dash of a very old AL bus from KeSRTC. The Dash is more ergonomica, IMHO.

The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)-image0197.jpg

Last edited by BaCkSeAtDrIVeR : 10th January 2011 at 23:25.
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Old 11th January 2011, 08:23   #202
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

The dash design is not great but still a good enough effort. Does ALL not provide a factory built instrument cluster like Tata around which the dash is built?

The older dash is definitely better having all the dial together and not so far apart. Also the dials are right ahead of the steering wheel rather than in a wide arc.

The design which looked so odd to me on the Low Entry RE buses looks right at home on these buses though. The inclusion of a rear view camera though is a nice touch, should be made regulatory requirement for all city buses all over the country.

Dont the seat width seem a little low to you guys??
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Old 11th January 2011, 09:42   #203
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by julupani View Post
.... The window panes dont seem to have any sort of uniformity at all, all of them of different sizes.
These are some of the design problems with Marcos. These are also a part of my feel that they are retro, but still more to follow including the windscreen look. The co driver side quarter vent window was never common between FE SLF's itself as it was hampering the drivers view on the LH side and later the glass window was introduced.
Look at the photo showing driver(though its not clear) - The major set back of the Marco design as the instrument cluster was too high making a reduced overall window for driver to watch throug windscreen.
More details are already posted in this thread
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/commer...-india-17.html
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The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)-tml-side-front.jpg

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The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)-tml-side.jpg

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Old 11th January 2011, 10:42   #204
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

1st of all the RE and FE buses are separate designs, so dont club them together even though both are from the same manufacturer.

Those kinks and angles that you have highlighted are the exact design features that help releive the long straight lines of the bus and prevent it from looking like a shoe box on wheels, like the ALL design looks.
As for the slider windows on the driver door, all manufacturers go in for that, even on the AC models. What exactly is the problem with that?

As for the high mounted instrument cluster, that can differ from driver to driver. And anyway, I wouldnt exactly want a bus to stay 3 inches away from the guy in front. I dont think many car drivers in the world can see as close to the front of the vehicle and they dont seem to be complaining. Its just a matter of the drivers adjusting to a new kind of bus and not any design issues with the bus.

About the small piece of glass at the bottom in the 2nd pic, that is there to help the visibility, though it should have been intergated in a better way with the paint scheme. It seems to have been a later addition as it isnt there on some of the buses.

Last edited by julupani : 11th January 2011 at 10:44.
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Old 11th January 2011, 12:14   #205
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by julupani View Post
1st of all the RE and FE buses are separate designs, so dont club them together even though both are from the same manufacturer.
No where I have clubbed RE and FE models and asked for a uniformity.
But what I wanted to convey was neither of the models had the uniformity amoung them selves or the clean design what was mentioned earlier

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
Those kinks and angles that you have highlighted are the exact design features that help releive the long straight lines of the bus and prevent it from looking like a shoe box on wheels, like the ALL design looks.
As for the slider windows on the driver door, all manufacturers go in for that, even on the AC models. What exactly is the problem with that?
Its really a nice thought by you to take everything in a positive manner.
But the truth is that they were out of the reason that they were no option to cover the inner parts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
As for the high mounted instrument cluster, that can differ from driver to driver. And anyway, I wouldnt exactly want a bus to stay 3 inches away from the guy in front. I dont think many car drivers in the world can see as close to the front of the vehicle and they dont seem to be complaining. Its just a matter of the drivers adjusting to a new kind of bus and not any design issues with the bus.
I just conveyed the message given by drivers.And its not certainly varying between driver to driver. Requesting you to take the driver seat and have a view. Though it a universal truth that drivers get used to do design issues but still its an issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
About the small piece of glass at the bottom in the 2nd pic, that is there to help the visibility, though it should have been intergated in a better way with the paint scheme. It seems to have been a later addition as it isnt there on some of the buses.
I am strictly not aganist the Marcos but wanted to highlight more chronicle and irritants in the design. Any way no offense plz
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Old 11th January 2011, 12:29   #206
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

As far as passenger comfort is concerned, the Marcopolo is leaps and bounds ahead of ALL. I have travelled in the so called deluxe buses of MTC Chennai(both ALL and Marcopolo). Passenger comfort and safety is a joke as far as ALL is concerned. I don't know which retard designed the window holder in the ALL deluxe buses. It just sticks out and you need to be really careful for it not to hit your head while travelling. With respect to the seating position, the less said the better. The three rows of seats (above, just before and just after the wheel well) are only suited for kids. The Marcopolo on the other hand, is very comfortbale to travel in. You are comfortably seated and far fewer shocks are felt in the Marcopolo than the competing ALL model. The ALL model was built by Veera if I am not mistaken.

Last edited by longhorn : 11th January 2011 at 12:40.
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Old 11th January 2011, 12:44   #207
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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As far as passenger comfort is concerned, the Marcopolo is leaps and bounds ahead of ALL.
For a normal passenger like me, Marcopolos looks better, more comfortable and got better build quality than the ALL buses. Even the center control in Marcos looks much better and complete than the AL ones. Matter of the fact is, ALL is a late entrant to the Finished bus scene in India, and will take some time to catch up with TM, I always wish KerRTC would have got Marcopolos on Kochi roads, instead of the ALL RE buses. Not sure how they managed to bag that order, while "dealing" with the STCs of course ALL is the best, no doubt about that.

Last edited by teamveevee : 11th January 2011 at 12:46.
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Old 11th January 2011, 13:01   #208
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

With respect to the JNNURM services KeSRTC is operating from Ernakulam to its suburbs like Aluva, Perumbavoor and Muvattupuzha, I feel that the Marcopolo fits the bill perfectly. The roads are rubberised and in pretty good shape at most places. These buses are perfect complements to the KeSRTC Volvos for those families coming to Kochi for shopping from the suburbs. The ALL designs are just too crude for such an application.
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Old 11th January 2011, 13:24   #209
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

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Originally Posted by teamveevee View Post
Matter of the fact is, ALL is a late entrant to the Finished bus scene in India, and will take some time to catch up with TM,
Was availability of fully built rear engine ALL buses in mid 1980s too late?
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Old 11th January 2011, 14:11   #210
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Default Re: The Indian Bus Scene (Discuss new launches and market info here)

I dont think ALL was a late entrant into the Fully Built bus segment at all. In fact I think they introduced fully built buses a lot earlier than TML, which pretty much has always played it safe in terms of new products till lets say the last 2-3years. ALL on the other hand always had innovative products coming in. But as always it seems, even though ALL is the pioneer, TML with its massive market share has always come in late with a product, but has made it such a massive success that people tend to think that they were the 1st to do it.

@Ashley
I mentioned separating the two buses because you last post didnt seem to make any distinction between the two.
Also do you mean that those design features had to be incorporated to hide the inner parts of the bus? If so could you please expand on what these inner parts might be? And why the design just had to be like it is and could not be in any other way?

Also, at the end of the day, those design feature still make it look good and not like the shoe box on wheels like the ALL design, which was probably made when the designer had access to only a ruler, a tri-square and a pencil.

The major issue with the TML buses in my opinion is the Cumminss 5.9L B series engine, which is just vibrates too much for a bus. Unlike the H-series engines from ALL which vibrate a lot less. If TML had a proper bus engine, it would be much better. But the engine for buses from Cummins is the L series which is way too large and costly for India.

Even the standard ACGL starbuses being built for the JNNURM in some cities, were a hugely pleasant surprise in terms or build-quality, speed, comfort, features etc. The only thing still remaining is it still feels like a vibrating piledriver when standstill at a stop.
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